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Patrick_Mucci

Pine Valley's weakness? I'll tell you.
« Reply #25 on: June 29, 2001, 08:51:00 PM »
Bill Coggins,

That's not the wind's fault, that is the fault of the architect or superintendent.

Prevailing winds, especially prevailing winds with velocity should be an important component of the design principle.


Aaron

Pine Valley's weakness? I'll tell you.
« Reply #26 on: June 29, 2001, 11:14:00 AM »
I don't think too much wind can ruin a course...but if a designer has not planned for such conditions, it can be a grueling experience.

However, if a designer has knowledge on seasonal wind conditions and plans his design aournd that, I think 9 times out of 10 you should enjoy it, no matter how hard the wind blows.


TEPaul

Pine Valley's weakness? I'll tell you.
« Reply #27 on: June 29, 2001, 03:56:00 PM »
Think whatever you want to about wind and whether trees minimalize it and detract from the archtitecture or not. But trees do play a part in golf architecture when designed well and where they were designed to be.

I challenge any of you, not matter how accomplished you are as players to honestly state that a treeless unfettered wind attacked golf course is really any harder to play than a golf course in high and swirled winds (due to trees). It's vastly different, no doubt, (actually in the differences lies a very good thing for golf and its archtitecture)! But harder or more interesting or challenging?! Not to me. I love both challenges!

Pine Valley in the beginning? It may have been susceptible to a flatter, stronger more consistently directional wind! Now it may be susceptible to a more complex swirling wind. What's the big goddamn deal? Do you really or seriously think THAT has effected the architecture of Pine Valley.

This original remark about the trees at Pine Valley effecting the design of the golf course by minimalizing the challenge of the wind conditions and therefore Pine Valley has nothing much to do with shot trajectory is about the biggest load of crap I've heard in two or three years of Golfclubatlas.


Paul Turner

Pine Valley's weakness? I'll tell you.
« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2001, 04:36:00 PM »
Pine Valley: I'm only going from photos since I've never been there.  

I'm not saying anything original here, but from old photos there are similarities with Pine Valley and some of the London area heathlands; to my eye (and I think many others on this DG) the trees are affecting the courses too much.  The open wind swept feel of those old heathland courses distinguishes them from the typical parkland affair.  

Only a few of the old heath courses have retained the wild and open conditions: Walton Heath and Hankley Common.  I'd love to see a return to that on some of the others, like Sunningdale, The Berkshire, The Addington...  And from old photos I've seen, I'd prefer Pine Valley that way too.

The original post didn't even mention trees/wind.  So the criticism was more about the green sites and approach options?


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