News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Wells Fargo
« Reply #25 on: May 11, 2016, 08:56:22 AM »
I did say there is nothing wrong with improving your course, except for the example it sets as a quest for perfection that is beyond the means of most clubs, courses, and golfers.  I admit regrassing your greens every 3 years seems extreme to me.  However, as a modest, affordable course, the last thing we need is for our golfers to expect similar conditions.  We can't do it at the prices we charge and if we raised our prices, they would leave for cheaper alternatives.  We have golfers who look at courses on TV like PH2, Chambers, British Open venues, and say "that's ugly, I'd never play a piece of s**t like that."  It's ignorance and outside their experience, so understandable.  But where exactly did they develop this view of golf?  Overseeding, regrassing, perfectly uniform greens, playing surfaces, colors, and gorgeous TV imagery?  Am I jealous?  Not really, I just think the game bigger than that and can be enjoyed equally well at a Sheep Ranch as it can at Quail Hollow.  This quest for perfection does not promote that concept.     

Dave,
Like you, I have a lot of golfing buddies (most of them?) who don't care one bit who designed the course, have little or no interest in GCA, and don't either understand or appreciate the idea of firm and fast golf courses.

I suppose TV is one of the major reasons that so many golfers associate uniform green with a good golf course, but I don't think it's ONLY TV.  There are lots of golfers out there who came to the game and still play the majority of their golf on real estate-based courses, and on those courses, beautiful, lush emerald green year-round is part of the curb appeal that sells lots and houses.  It isn't any different from what a homeowner does to a yard when they are going to try to sell their house; it's just on a much bigger scale.  When you see a brown yard, it connotes neglect, right?  So no surprise that many, many casual golfers think of golf courses the same way.  I think it will be this way until water becomes enough of an issue that there is a complete paradigm shift in how we think of growing things.

Golfers that love GCA think redan par 3s are cool.  Golfers who don't are pissed when they throw it at the pin and their ball goes off the back of the green because the green isn't what they expected.  Green vs. brown is sort of the same thing. 
"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Wells Fargo
« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2016, 12:39:58 PM »
AG,

Couldn't agree more when it comes to the water consumption paradox.

Take a place like California, where before this past winter, the entire state was having a major water crisis.  You would think their own residents would be understanding of this right?  Nope.

http://www.golfadvisor.com/articles/pasatiempo-golf-club-water-use-agreement-santa-cruz-ca-15852.htm

In the last paragraph from this article on the Pasa thread, they said they can't afford to have another brown year due to the fiscal implications.  So if members can't tolerate having Brown, when the conditions mandate it, how in heck could they possibly get away with it even if there wasn't a massive shortage?  Its crazy!

P.S.  On the macro level, even thou this last winter meant immediate crisis averted, they'll be right back there in a few years, with no lessons learned.

Dave McCollum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Wells Fargo
« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2016, 09:25:33 PM »
For the record, I agree, AG, that there are other reasons for this obsession with chlorophyll.   Like Pasatiempo we have to produce the lush, green look when we are able, even though our sand-based course plays its best as f&f.  It's frustrating and beyond logic to accommodate these golfers and their favored style of golf, but we do it to stay afloat.  As the seasons change, we get away with other (and better) conditions.  We just can't do in the prime time of summer when the days are hot and the grass will brown without daily irrigation.  You are absolutely correct, the golfers will see this as neglect and take their money elsewhere.  We've been successful at cutting back the water (we have more than we can use, at least for now) and keeping the course on the edge because we've killed far more turf from overwatering than the alternative.

Kalen, my guess is the Pasatiempo members are much more sympathetic to the water situation than the visitor play.  I also guess that visitor play is an important part of their business model.  I don't know, of course, but we have certainly seen what happens to our public play when our course browns out during the summer.  Our course might be playing beautifully (for us), but the rumors about conditioning spreads rapidly and the result is lost revenue and an open tee sheet.  Meanwhile, our competitors, who are pouring on the water and fertilizer, growing their unplayable roughs, and essentially growing grass as if it were a crop, are getting the play.  Live, learn, adapt.