[Garland Bayley]

...
Burnham's 15th is completely blind from the tee...no marker.  Same for the 18th if one chooses to hit past the visible area.  Prestwick has blind shots without guidance...the 5th is quite famous...same for the second on #4.  Painswick is loaded with blind shots.  TOC as well.  Properly blind holes do exist and in abundance.


Ciao


Ciao

There are different degrees of blindness. When I played 15 and 18 at Burnham and Berrow, I could determine where to hit it without a pole. When I played 10 at Burnham and Berrow, I would not have been able to determine where to hit it without the aiming pole that is there. At Black Mesa, there are places where the blindness is as complete as it is at 10 at Burnham and Berrow. If you are in a cart, you can look at the GPS screen with it's map, or you can drive to the crest of the blocking ridge. A golfer would have to spend the time to walk up and forward to take a look, and then walk back. Of course, I have to admit that part of my complaint with Black Mesa also stems from having to walk long ways out of the way to walk a cart path, because no walking route was provided for ravines and the such.

[Thomas Dai]

Some are more fortunate than others.


I have played occasionally with a partially sighted gentleman, to him most shots longer than putts and chips are blind. There are also various organisations throughout the world for blind golfers. Good thing too.


Atb

[Jon Wiggett]

Garland,

I was giving a bit of balance to your post #69 where you use the examples of West Cornwall, Perranporth and Royal County Down all of which are members clubs. Whilst I agree with you about the need for marker posts for them, if you want to talk about resort destinations then maybe it would be better to use some examples that are actually resort courses.

Jon

Once again, it started with Black Mesa, which is not a members club. I hardly know the difference between member and nonmember courses in the UK. I just listed the first few that came to mind in the UK.

and as I clearly stated I was only referencing you post #69 below. However, as you say above you hardly know the difference between private and public in the UK.

What blind holes in the U.K. don't provide aiming poles? West Cornwall does, Perranporth does, Royal County Down does, ...

[Sean_A]

...
Burnham's 15th is completely blind from the tee...no marker.  Same for the 18th if one chooses to hit past the visible area.  Prestwick has blind shots without guidance...the 5th is quite famous...same for the second on #4.  Painswick is loaded with blind shots.  TOC as well.  Properly blind holes do exist and in abundance.


Ciao


Ciao

There are different degrees of blindness. When I played 15 and 18 at Burnham and Berrow, I could determine where to hit it without a pole. When I played 10 at Burnham and Berrow, I would not have been able to determine where to hit it without the aiming pole that is there. At Black Mesa, there are places where the blindness is as complete as it is at 10 at Burnham and Berrow. If you are in a cart, you can look at the GPS screen with it's map, or you can drive to the crest of the blocking ridge. A golfer would have to spend the time to walk up and forward to take a look, and then walk back. Of course, I have to admit that part of my complaint with Black Mesa also stems from having to walk long ways out of the way to walk a cart path, because no walking route was provided for ravines and the such.

I must say, you have me totally confused as to what your bitch is.  You want blindness, but you don't want it too blind?  You don't want anybody else to be privy to info you don't have?  You like blindness, but want poles to guide the way? 


Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago. 


Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

...
Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  ...

And as a one time player I was supposed to know that?
 

[Sean_A]

...
Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  ...

And as a one time player I was supposed to know that?
 

Well...yes, if you are observant.  A lot can be gleaned by looking around 


Ciao

[OChatriot]

Love blind shots.
Brilliant fun off the tee. Especially if there's a runoff that propels your ball further down..how close from the green will you be?  Or a nicely creased links fairway that hides it. (Ballybunion #9, Deal #17)
 Even better when you just see the top of the flag on an approach shot, but not the green or what lies (lurks?) on your line. Allows you to aim, try and judge the distance, and then open the present as you walk up!
Someone said he couldn't swing properly not seeing everything. I found I go through the ball better than not when hitting a blind shot.
Is a dogleg that you cut not a bit similar? Shaping your ball flight out of sight around a corner to gain 2 clubs on your next shot is every bit as satisfying.
I will add that I was very lucky to have an albatross once. Sandy Lodge #4. Blind second shot...we never saw it going in. No regrets though!!!

[Tom_Doak]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

[Sean_A]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

I don't have a problem with a blind bunker if there is enough room to play.  Its the rough I find much more troubling only because of lost ball and safety issues.  It is usually okay on the 10th, but I still don't see why there shouldn't be fairway extending well to the left.  The problem with rough is folks waiting on the tee can easily think the numb nutz in front forgot to ring the bell and fire into guys looking for a ball in the rough. 


Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

Burnham's 10th could learn a lot from Old MacDonald's 3rd.

[Sean_A]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

Burnham's 10th could learn a lot from Old MacDonald's 3rd.

Garland


I wait with bated breath for your wise words 

Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

Burnham's 10th could learn a lot from Old MacDonald's 3rd.

Garland


I wait with bated breath for your wise words 

Ciao

I'm not giving any wise words. Tom already gave them.

[Sean_A]

Burnham's 10th isn't too hard to decipher if you pay attention when on the 9th green.  Plus, you can see to the left and know that is rough.  Though I really think the fairway should extend much more left.  The hole is a bit contrived by forcing players to go further right than they want.  I am sure that when Colt left the course the hole was more of a pronounced dogleg right...giving people an option of hitting to the left of the dune. Now, everybody has to go more or less over the top...at least they cut the rough back on the backside of the dune a few years ago.

One of the most important aspects of blind holes is that they shouldn't be so narrow on the other side that a miscalculation may result in a lost ball, or looking too long for one.  The intimidation itself has value, so it's unnecessary to have too many obstacles on the other side adding to the problem.  The ideal would just be that an out-of-position drive makes for a tougher angle to the green or a tougher stance or something, not a direct penalty like rough or a blind bunker.

Burnham's 10th could learn a lot from Old MacDonald's 3rd.

Garland


I wait with bated breath for your wise words 

Ciao

I'm not giving any wise words. Tom already gave them.

Well, there is a first time for everything 


Ciao

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