[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I played there this weekend. This is a Norman minimalist golf design. The staff is great with excellent service. The practice facilities are first rate.  It has a large number of very good short strategic par 4's. The strong 4's are good but not enough of them and the 3's are ok to good, but I found the par 5's to be not very good and lacking in character and style. The really interesting thing was the very small amount of dirt moved and the almost lack of mounding or hole separation by ridges etc. The greens were very natural and fit with the land very nicely. There is very little contouring to them. The fairways had some slight role but nothing dramatic. It is in the nicest resort in Orlando. The service and facilities are 2nd to none in the area.The setting is very nice, conservation district on one side, but very flat land as one would expect. It is really not near anthing other than Sea World a few miles away. Mickey is 20 minutes. The course is not as good as Lake Nona, but equal too or better than Osprey Ridge. I thought the fairways were just too big, even for a resort course. Naturally they can be changed and the greens sped up for tournement play. I wonder if the market will be receptive to a minimalist style course in a very high end project in Florida. I am pleased to see Norman do this style of course.  I do reccomend all to take a look at the balance of minumalist golf, with the only caddie program in Orlando combined with superior resort accomadations and service. Then lets view it versus the rest of the Market there.

[Mike_Sweeney]

Tiger,

I will be down there over the holidays with the kids. How does it compare with Champions Gate International, if you have played it?

[JakaB]

This project interests me in that I'm trying to figure out why or who someone would stay here when you could be in the Grand Floridian on the Monorail.   Is it for bearen couples...is it cheaper...is it for buisness people.....how and will it work.  

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Jaka, it is gay friendly I hear. lol the Grand Floridian is starting to look a little dated. This just opened and really is meant to be the top of the market. There is alot more to Orlando now than Disney but it still stirs the pot to make the rest of the area work. However, if one had a bunch of little people staying oncampus at Disney is still the way to go. Mike, I have not played either of them but will see them next trip down for comparison reasons. You can play there and not stay in the hotel either. $95.00 now probably 140 to 150 in fall. That includes cart or caddie. Tip the caddie 20 bucks

[Bill_McBride]

John, if you haven't played Southern Dunes yet, give it a go.  Really good Steve Smyers design with a very smart if short Redan on the back side, and a lot of excellent bunkering.  Straight south off 27.

[grandwazo]

A couple of things....JW Marriott has also built a tremendous hotel on this property and they are sharing the Norman course with the Ritz Carlton.  I think this is a convention oriented property, I will be down there in early February 04 with 1000 other office products dealers.  Also Steve Smyers is in the process of completing another golf course on this property called Grande Oaks (I think that's what he told me) which he was very proud of.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

You are correct about the JW Marriott. They do share convention facilities and the golf. However it is called the Ritz Carlton Golf club.I am almost positive there is not another course to be built. There is only one now.

[Joel_Stewart]

Four Seasons just purchased 300 acres close by and will begin construction of a hotel and golf course.  

I never underestimate the ability for high end developments.  I think they offer quite a bit more than the Disney experience especially if you are without children.

[grandwazo]

I might have misunderstood Steve, but I'm pretty sure he told me that he was working on something either on the property or nearby, went into some detail about having to move a  bunch of oak trees on to the property around the clubhouse so that the name had some meaning.  I'll try to get further info.  

[John_Conley]

A couple of things....JW Marriott has also built a tremendous hotel on this property and they are sharing the Norman course with the Ritz Carlton.  I think this is a convention oriented property, I will be down there in early February 04 with 1000 other office products dealers.  Also Steve Smyers is in the process of completing another golf course on this property called Grande Oaks (I think that's what he told me) which he was very proud of.

Wazoo:

Smyers redesigned the old International course on I-Drive just S of Sea World.  It will be run by Marriott Golf, but I think you got your sites confused.  It is going to be renamed Grande Pines.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

John Is that the location of the Faldo practice facility too. I have checked and there is only going to be one course with the Ritz project.

[John_Conley]

Faldo is pretty much across the street and down the road a tad.  A different site.  Faldo has a Par 29 or so with the best practice facility in town.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

John the Ritz facility is not as comprehensive as Faldo but has better balls and good everything for $7 rather than $9 At Faldo. The food is more expensive by far though. thanks i did not think the course at Faldo was good enough for anyone to brag on.John

[grandwazo]

"Great golf is the hallmark attraction at Marriott's Grande Vista at the Faldo Golf Institute by Marriott, but that's only the beginning of what guests can expect. The distinctively designed one-, two-, and three-bedroom villas feature private balconies and panoramic views. For all the essentials, the Village Center features The MarketPlace convenience store. Just across the street is Marriott's Grande Pines Golf Club, an 18-hole championship golf course scheduled to open in January 2004. And all the magic of Central Florida is waiting, an easy drive from these vacation villas. Construction is expected to continue through 2006."

Sorry, I got my tree's mixed up....Grande Pines it is.  

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Selling a few timeshares here are we. lol

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