[Scott Warren]

With reference to this: http://www.masters.com/en_US/news/splash/articles/2008-11-04/200811041225810120500.html

I was wondering how close to the previous (I won't say original) green do golf clubs (notably Augusta) get the replacement when they do work like this?

Watching pro golf you often hear the commentators talking about a certain player with a long history at a tournament knowing every break on the course. I'm certain I have heard that said of both Tiger and Jack at Augusta (and probably plenty of others).

But how close is it year to year when they dig them up and re-lay them like this?

[Greg Chambers]

Scott,

I can say, from my experience, that great care is taken to get the green back to exactly what it was prior.  That is, of course, unless the reason for rebuilding was to soften the origional contours.

[Ray Richard]

Current GPS software and survey equipment recreates elevations within thousandths of an inch. By taking many elevation shots, in a tight grid,the exact green contours can be duplicated. The only variable is compaction--the green mix ( or subgrade) must not settle or all bets are off. The sod (if used)must be uniformly cut,too.

[JNagle]

When asked to rebuild a green exactly as is or with similar internal features with less back to front slope we employ GPS systems.  When we were rebuilding the 16th green at Tavistock the Club demanded that one internal feature be retained while the remainder of the green is expanded and slopes reduced we utilized GPS elevations on 10" center.  After rebuilding the green to a modified USGA standard we found we were within one inch of the original elevations.  We simply added the necessary amount of sand to acheive the correct elevations.  GPS and I believe even more accurate methods are being employed.  

In other instances where it is not necessary to be so accurate we will have green surveys completed at 6" intervals revealing subtle slopes, rolls and contours.

[Tom_Doak]

Scott:
 
I think Jim Nagle answered your question inadvertently above.

With current technology you can get the green 99.5% back to what was there before, if you take long enough at it.  I have spoken to members at Holston Hills and The Valley Club and SFGC where we tried to rebuild the greens pretty much exactly, and for the most part they can't tell the difference, except on one or two holes they will tell me that a putt breaks differently.

The problem is that along the way, it's inevitable that the architect or contractor or club will decide to "improve the green" along the lines of Jim's description [preserve THIS feature, but reduce THESE slopes].  So, if you are asking whether reconstruction is up to the standard of historic preservation, my answer would be no.  Reconstruction opens the door to changes that would otherwise not be made.  We could argue all day whether that's a good thing or not, but it IS a change.

[Jeff_Brauer]

On the few replicates I have seen, there will always be a few members who say it doesn't break like it use to.  And they would be right - with new bents replacing old poa greens, you have grain, cutting hieght etc. etc. etc. to figure in, so even if the elevations are perfect I think they putt differently.

And I don't know of any way to translate, say a 4% slope on poa annua to a 2% slope on newer bents and get the break to be exactly 5.3" outside the cup on both.

[Mike_DeVries]

Scott,

I would concur with Jim, Tom, and Jeff -- all excellent points -- and reinforce that the degree of accuracy in replicating the contours has to do with diligence and making sure it is just right.  That takes time, coupled with GPS or survey equipment on tighter increments to get the base info that is needed.

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