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Tom Huckaby

Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #50 on: November 16, 2007, 03:00:07 PM »
Guys, how about a little repsect for a serious topic and take the religious discussion elsewhere...

Philip:  of course you're correct that was a wholly inappropriate tangent, but dare I say "lighten up"?  I see no harm done.  I thought it was pretty funny, actually.

But then again I don't consider what the USGA does one way or the other to be all that serious of a topic.

Cheers, my friend.

TH

Dan King

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #51 on: November 16, 2007, 03:05:10 PM »
Chuck Brown writes:
The "February 1998 issue of Golf Journal" will be the last one you get, since they discontinued it.

I guess I'll stop waiting for the mailman every day. Jeez, I feel like someone pulled the football away just as I was about to kick it.

Who can tell what the USGA does right? They have decided to stop communicating with their membership.

Cheers,
Dan King
Quote
I want to tell you a terrific story about oral contraception. I asked this girl to sleep with me and she said 'No.'
 --Woody Allen

Jim Sweeney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #52 on: November 16, 2007, 04:08:18 PM »
Mark Smolens:

Fair enough. We've been over that territory often around here. I'd proffer that you would get a lot of agreement from many on this board, as well as from many inside the USGA, believe it or not. However, before you give the USGA the death sentence for whatever it hasn't done (in your view) about the march of technology, you must answer, or try to answer, the question,

"What would golf equipment look and perform like if the USGA and R&A were not in the business of regulating golf equipment?"

I would suggest that the effect of technology as it has developed over the past few years would be nothing compared to what might have been.

And please do not discount the fact that in addition to better equipment the players are better physically, technically, mentally, and psychologocally, all of which have demonstrable impact on how they play the game.

And remember that the equpment companies are going to continue to find ways to improve their product, or at least convince us that they have done so.

And that the effect of technology is exponentially greater at the tour level than  anywhere else.


My information is that the Publinx handicap index limit will be reduced to 4.4. This has been coming, and justifiably so, for a long time. Ten years ago there was no hadicap limit. The qualifying fields are getting too large. Securing courses and conducting the qualifiers is getting tougher. In many qualifiers a third of the field couldn't break 85. The alternative was to go from a 36 hole qualifier to an 18 hole qualifier. While neither reducing the index (size of the field) or reducing the qualifier is desireable, reducing the field was the lesser of two evils.

The Publinks still has a team competition, the Warren Harding Cup. Three man  teams representing their qualifying sites play for the cup during the two days of stroke play, each team counting two scores each day.

I would have to second the comments about the USGA Museum and Archives. They are the simply the best resource available on any aspect of the history of the game, and they are about to get even better with the new addition. I challenge anyone to go stand in front of Bob Jones's medal case and not get chills as you come to realize for the first time the enormity of what he accomplished from 1922-30.

As Ben Hogan said, "If there weren't a USGA, somebody would have to start one." This comment was made when Hogan was awarded the Bob Jones Award, even for the remainder of his life he disputed the number of US Opens he won. We may not agree with everything the USGA does, but thank God it exosts, and the game is not run by those who have only a commercial interest in it.
"Hope and fear, hope and Fear, that's what people see when they play golf. Not me. I only see happiness."

" Two things I beleive in: good shoes and a good car. Alligator shoes and a Cadillac."

Moe Norman

JohnV

Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #53 on: November 16, 2007, 04:22:43 PM »
create another one for the real amateurs.  I'd call it...

The US Amateur!

I assume that any player who won this and later turned pro would have his name buffed off the trophy. ;)

Tom Huckaby

Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #54 on: November 16, 2007, 04:30:54 PM »
Dammit.  I was hoping you had forgotten about our little bet.  But jeez... a 52 shot drubbing... I think I owe you more than a few beers.  :'(

Love your criteria for the true amateur championship.

TH

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #55 on: November 16, 2007, 05:38:58 PM »
If they held a tournament like that, I think I'd enter my first tournament since 1994.



They do Dave. Twelve of them each year. It's called the Monthly Medal, played at courses all over GB&I. ;)
« Last Edit: November 16, 2007, 05:39:41 PM by Tony_Muldoon »
Let's make GCA grate again!

Peter Pallotta

Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #56 on: November 16, 2007, 10:14:40 PM »
Shivas - good stuff! But did you actually say "I guess this would have to be on the honor system"? If so, I thought maybe you'd appreciate someone noticing... :)

And, do you think you can add "bad back from an ancient basketball injury, left untreated" to your list? Thanks.

Btw, very good post on the "innovative design' thread. I'm thinking you were showing off a little, just to remind us...

Peter
« Last Edit: November 17, 2007, 06:41:00 AM by Peter Pallotta »

TEPaul

Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #57 on: November 17, 2007, 08:04:43 AM »
Shivas:

If the USGA were to hold the kind of tournaments you're suggesting in post #54 they'd probably need to enlist the help of the CIA, FBI and IRS to administer them.

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #58 on: November 17, 2007, 08:59:10 AM »
Chuck Brown writes:
The "February 1998 issue of Golf Journal" will be the last one you get, since they discontinued it.

I guess I'll stop waiting for the mailman every day. Jeez, I feel like someone pulled the football away just as I was about to kick it.

Who can tell what the USGA does right? They have decided to stop communicating with their membership.

Cheers,
Dan King
Quote
I want to tell you a terrific story about oral contraception. I asked this girl to sleep with me and she said 'No.'
 --Woody Allen


I'm gonna have to go over to my post office and apologize for putting in all of those Trace requests, all these months.

Of course, the USGA could reconstitute Golf Journal as an online magazine, at a small fraction of the cost of the printed version.

"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Mark Smolens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #59 on: November 17, 2007, 11:45:08 AM »
Mr. Sweeney, I cannot argue against your point in its entirety.  And I've read many of those threads here, and have participated for some time in the debate at Geoff S's blog as well.  But, I certainly wish that I had the expertise in the field of engineering to come up with a scientific basis for my belief that it's the ball, more than anything else.  The Ohio GA experiment, and the imperious response of the USGA to their data ("oh, we've got our own study") drive me absolutely batshit.  Some time ago there was thread on Shackelford's blog about a speech by Mr. Vernon which seemed to be a candid admission that the ball had been dropped on the ball by the governing bodies.  I certainly hope that such an attitude could at least lead to real inquiry into that area.  If not, all of the discussions on this site about the classic golf courses could become irrelevant.

And Shivas, come play some "tournament" golf with us at Weekly Challenge.  It's handicapped in flights, no sandbagging because you get a handicap based on your tournament play, we play fast (ready golf is the rule, so if you're slow, I'll hit anyway), and post-round cocktails are always fun.

Jim Sweeney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:What has the USGA done right?
« Reply #60 on: November 18, 2007, 06:09:28 PM »
One more thing the USGA has done right- $60,000,000 in grants to programs for the underpriviledged, the disabled, veterans, the environment, state and regional golf associations, the First Tee, LPGA Girls Golf, the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts, and more- since 1995.

Mark S.:

Many people on this site would be very surprised to find out that there is rarely unanimity among the USGA's governors on just about anything. As in every well governed organization, however, once a decision has been made, it gets unanimous support.

Unfortunately, the Ohio State Golf Association's experiment with a uniform golf ball for a single competition produced very little if anything of a useful nature vis a vis the science of golf ball technology. Certainly it has had no impact beyond the initial curiosity with the event. The USGA was at the event, I understand. ANd the USGA does have scientifically sound and reproduceable studies and virtually any aspect of golf ball performance. In short, there is little if anything the USGA or anyone else could learn form the OGA's experiment. BTW, If they tried to repeat the experiment this year, I did not hear about it.

I am not trying to argue with you or anyone else about any of this- I do want to contribute to the discussion whenever I have information or and opinion that might be helpful. There are things the USGA has done with which I disaree. If I were golf dictator, we'd be playing persimmon woods, muscle back irons and the pro-trajectory ball. Too bad I'm not!
"Hope and fear, hope and Fear, that's what people see when they play golf. Not me. I only see happiness."

" Two things I beleive in: good shoes and a good car. Alligator shoes and a Cadillac."

Moe Norman

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