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Ian Andrew

Video instead of pictures?
« on: September 08, 2007, 11:40:15 AM »
I've been recently experimenting with video for my blog. I have provided a link so you can get an idea on what I was able to put together in about 15 minutes.

Here is the link:

http://thecaddyshack.blogspot.com/2007/09/5-at-saskatoon_07.html

It got me wondering, can we post video on GolfClubAtlas? Do you see this as being a huge improvement on how we could communicate ideas on this site? Do you see other potential use - for example - when a member can not make a presentation - they could simply watch the video shorts to find out what the architect intends. Or publishing this on their web site for members to access on their own free time.

Curious on your thoughts.

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2007, 02:29:54 PM »
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Kyle Harris

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2007, 02:42:38 PM »
Can we embed?

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Q8pP2lsoOaY"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Q8pP2lsoOaY" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>

No...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8pP2lsoOaY
« Last Edit: September 08, 2007, 02:43:12 PM by Kyle Harris »

Bob Jenkins

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2007, 08:20:46 PM »
Ian,

I really enjoyed that video and your explanation.

When first looking at the layout, I assume the second set of contour lines were for a depression and not another mound but what you have done make for a very interesting approach shot. I assume a good drive will kick down and to the left to the bunker.

Thank you.

Bob Jenkins

Peter Pallotta

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2007, 09:23:58 PM »
Ian - thanks.

For me, I think the audio-video approach is great: your explanations and background information adds much to what I could've gotten from the drawing alone.

BUT: if I were you, I'm not so sure I'd want a DVD or video with my description/plans for a full 18 holes (or for an extensive renovation) floating around so freely and easily. I guess what I'm saying is, if your work is only on paper, only those who you want to have hear your details/thinking will hear them, at least first hand; put that same thinking in a video, and in a blink of an eye thousands of people (can potentially) have it....so I'd be sure that this is what I want to have happen before I tried it...

Peter  

wsmorrison

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2007, 07:07:27 AM »
Ian,

I really enjoyed your video on the hole at Saskatoon, it was very beneficial to understanding your thoughts.  I think videos are a wonderful idea.  I do not know the logistics of it all, but some video would be welcome.  I tried to get Jim Finegan's speech on Wm Flynn put on the website and couldn't do it because it was so long and I didn't know how to break it up into parts for youtube.  Eric Franzen was nice enough to host it on a site in Sweden.  It was an excellent talk but I don't think too many GCAers checked it out...at least by the responses.  That was a bit surprising.  But I'm all for video if used properly and, like Peter said, not too much proprietary information is expected or revealed.

Ian Andrew

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2007, 09:26:55 AM »
Wayne,

The file size is a serious issue. Text takes up very little space and can be hosted on GCA, but as soon as you add pictures there is quite a bit more space required, and GCA requires you to host it elsewhere.

For presepective my web site (and all those formated photos on it) use almost all my personal web space (5M). That video used 26M for just over a minute. I need to find a more efficient format than MP4. I guess that's what a Canadian winter is for. ;)

I got interested in the udse of video through the Coore video clips available on Golf Digest. Could you please send me or post a link to that video - I would like to see it. I went through a period of a couple of months where I didn't check out GCA because I was far too busy - I missed a lot.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 09:33:24 AM by Ian Andrew »

wsmorrison

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2007, 01:35:09 PM »
Ian,

I'll try to find the site and get you the URL, or I'll send you a DVD version if I cannot.  Maybe Eric will see this and repost the location.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2007, 07:22:31 PM »
Ian, congrats for thinking "out of the box" and incorporating the video on your blog.  I think it is a great idea.  

Ironically, we mentioned this idea of using digital video rather than still shots when one photographs a great course they like to memorialize.  

This flies right in the face of the whole debate we had on the other thread about whether it is "appropriate" to take pictures if you are a guest at a great golf club and you'd like to remember it in photos.

I have taken my pocket size small digital video to a couple  of courses and video documented a few holes "as I walked and played".  The great thing about it is that the digital video has much more powerful zoom feature, so you can zoom in and out of interesting contours and features, and depict them in much better detail than a flat one-snap picture.  You can comment as you walk through the FW corridor, and have your immediate impressions as a record.  I have found that in documenting a nice golf hole, you can hit your tee ball and then begin to walk and talk and video the corridor and zoom in and out of the FW in 10 seconds and get a nice view and comment.  Then as you walk to an LZ another 10 seconds of same, panning the terrain and features.  Then again another 10-15 seconds at the green.  You then have really captured the essence of the hole far better than a one-snap effort.

This practice would no doubt give Mr Kavanaugh appoplexy.

But, it really does have design documentation and discussion value.

What I don't know yet, is how to put stuff on U-Tube>  That is on my to-do list.  

« Last Edit: September 09, 2007, 07:28:09 PM by RJ_Daley »
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

wsmorrison

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2007, 07:21:37 AM »
Ian,

Here's the link to the Jim Finegan video on William Flynn, courtesy of Eric Franzen and I believe the Swedish Golf Federation.  If anyone out there appreciates Jim's writing, it is helpful to hear him speak.  He really does write as he speaks and speaks as he writes.  What a wonderful man he is.

mms://qstream-31.qbrick.com/00372/jf/jfmod.wmv
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 07:24:55 AM by Wayne Morrison »

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2007, 08:34:23 AM »
Ian:

I've thought for years that video would be a much better way to demonstrate the playing values you seek in a course -- i.e. to show how chipping from the left of the green is difficult so you want to favor the right side on your approach.  What a shame that Shell's Wonderful World of Golf didn't take that approach, instead of playing a match where two players rarely interface with the architecture.

(Actually, that would be a great promotional video for Bandon Dunes -- David Kidd, me, Bill Coore and C.B. Macdonald playing key shots on the four courses.  Okay, C.B. isn't very talkative anymore, maybe Crenshaw.  If only they needed the promotion!)

It's a great idea but I suggest you use it in small bites.  The problem with video is that you have to sit through to the end, and you run the risk of losing your viewers' interest while they still feel compelled to watch.  Also, per Peter's point, you are going to leave this out there FOREVER, so you don't want to do it unless it's really done well.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2007, 10:50:49 AM »
Wayne, thank you very much for that link to the video.  

I watched it this morning, and am confident that in doing so, watching all 37 minutes of Mr. Finegan's lecture, that I am unquestionably a bonafide golf dork.

His props and chides to you and TomPaul, for your Flynn research and ever pending publication of the book was really fun to see.  I don't know if the phrase is Finegan's or not, but I loved, "poets of topography".  And, his humor about Doak naming the 15th at PCC the hardest 15th in the world, was great.

All the while watching Finegan, I felt as if I were sitting in a lecture hall at a place like Trinity University in Dublin, while a great lecturing professor was at work.

Good stuff... 8)
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

wsmorrison

Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2007, 10:54:20 AM »
RJ,

He is an amazing fellow and our inspiration when we started out on this 7 year (and counting) odyssey of writing the Flynn book.  Soon to be in print, I hope.  Glad you watched the whole thing.  Congrats, you are a GCA dork first class!  Next time you read Finegan, try to remember how he speaks...it makes the read even more enjoyable.
Best,
Wayne

Wayne Wiggins, Jr.

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Video instead of pictures?
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2007, 07:41:01 PM »
That is a GREAT video!!!  Here's what you need to do: Get a pair of those "Dateline NBC" hidden camera glasses, invite Mr. Finegan over to Merion for a cup of Snapper soup, and have him start reeling off those stories.  Don't spare the minutiae... we need more tales of him breaking into America's guarded golf dominions for ice.

Absolutely priceless!!! Makes me want to move back to Philadelphia!!!

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