[Mike_Cirba]

I just typed a long review of Pinetree CC north of Atlanta and then hit the wrong key and ugh....GONE!  

Suffice to say that I found this a real hidden gem, built in 1958 by a fellow from Iowa named Chic Adams, on super rolling property, with less than 20 bunkers, wide playing corridors, an emphasis on utlizing wonderful natural contours and features, and smallish, tilted, devilish, amazing greens that personified would be something like Hannibal Lecter...civlized appearing on the outside with the heart of a killer once you become more familiar.

The course has hosted 3 GA State Amateur Championships, most recently in 2003, and the amazing thing to me is that in some ways, it's probably more like Dr. Mackenzie and Bobby Jones' original vision of Augusta (i.e. limited bunkering, use of natural landforms, wide corridors) than the present layout.  

Has anyone here played it?  Thoughts?

[Keith Williams]

Mike,

I live pretty close to Pinetree.  My father grew up playing the course.  Originally it was a municipal course named for OB Keeler, but was later sold to the membership to-be and renamed Pinetree.  My dad still remembers watching Arnold Palmer and a few other players of the day playing the opening round at the course.

My family quit being members there when I was too young to play, so I have only played it a few times in local tournaments after moving back into the area.

It is nice to hear how much you liked it as Pinetree has really dropped off the radar screen for private courses in the area in recent decades.  That may be blessing in disguise as they have not felt the pressure to make changes to keep up with competing clubs (see Marietta Country Club, just down the road from Pinetree, and everything they are doing).

Your mention of the wide playing corridors is interesting as the course experienced some major tree removal as a result of a large tornado ripping through the back nine over a decade ago.  I know they did some replanting, but I imagine it is not nearly as dense or tight as once was.

It is good to hear that the greens are still great.  Back when the club was more high profile the greens were its hallmark, very firm and very,very fast.  One example is that it was basically impossible to keep a ball on the green if you were above the pin and had to putt back down on the par 3 8th.

I am glad you like the course, and you are correct that it is a really solid and simple test.  I like the comparison to the original intent of ANGC.

Mike, did you play any other courses while in the area?

Keith.

[Mike_Cirba]

Thanks, Keith...the course was splendid and is a real study in providing great challenge for all levels at a modest 6800 yards.

Unfortunately, I didn't have the opportunity to play other courses this time, but I expect to be back in the area in early August (hot, I know, but what the heck).  

These two articles flesh out some of what I originally wrote (before I inadvertedly deleted it) and are much more "architecturally oriented" than most trade magazine articles typically endeavor.  

http://www.golfersguide.com/regional/editorial.cfm?location=Georgia&id=311

http://www.golfersguide.com/regional/editorial.cfm?location=Georgia&id=770

[Mike_Cirba]

Speaking of interesting links related to golf in Georgia, I came across the following which lists all clubs in the state with their year of origin and architectural attribution;

http://www.bobbyjonesgolfexhibit.com/GolfClubs/golfclubs_yearlist.html

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Mike what is the condition of the course? It sounds like a wonderful place to play.

[Mike_Cirba]

John,

I played there a day and a half after several inches of rain fell and it was pretty firm, particularly the greens.

I'd imagine that it's coming into peak condition right about now, given a normal spring.  I'm not sure what conditions are like in the autumn, but I'm betting that would be wonderful, as well.

[Mike_Cirba]

Just to mention a bit more about the course...

* The greens are small, averaging between 4500 and 5000 square feet, with a combination of big time tilts in all directions, fall off slopes on each side, and good internal contours.

* A number of greens also include front to back slopes (particularly on downhill approaches), requiring shots that land short and run up.

* There are a number of blind and semi-blind shots, mostly due to approaches to greensites situated at high points of the property.

* There are no forced carries, unless one wants to count the sliver of pond one must carry on the par three twelvth to a green falling off on the left into a bunker that would make Raynor proud.

* This is truly a course where local knowledge is at a premium, particularly in where to leave your drives for the best approach on a reasonably level lie, as well as where to miss the tiny target greens where getting up and down is reasonably possible.

* The course is a fine exhibition of what I like to call "convex", or "gravity" golf, where most of the target features are at the high points, falling off into trouble by thoughtfully utilizing the native contours and prevailing slopes.

* There is a really nice mix of hole lengths, but the elevated greens make the course play longer than its listed 6800 yards.

Anyone else from the Atlanta area who's played Pinetree?

[Brent Hutto]

Good grief, man. You've just enumerated most of the features of my ideal golf course. Maybe I ought to start looking for jobs in Kennesaw, GA (whatever the heck that is). Thanks for this fascinating thread about what sounds like a GCA-geek dream course that almost noone has heard of.

[Mike_Cirba]

Brent,

Yes, I was surprised as well and its the kind of course that I haven't been able to get out of my head since playing there a few weeks ago.

Besides some towering Georgia pines, a background featuring Kennesaw Mountain, and an undulating property, there is not a lot in the way of "wow" factor here, so it's somewhat easy to see why this course flies under the radar.  

The fact that it was designed by Chic Adams in 1958 is surprising, as well, because it's very subtly sophisticated in it's approach.  In fact, it's almost the antithesis of what we think of as "dark age" architecture of the 50s and 60s.

[A.G._Crockett]

Despite living in the area for 25 years, I've never played Pinetree.  However, to whatever extent that it could be said to be "under the radar", it's only that way because of the explosion of high-end daily fee and private club construction on the north end of Atlanta over the past 20 years.  I can assure you (and you pick this up from Mike's posts/articles about the course's pedigree) that prior to the construction boom Pinetree was considered to be the best of the best on the north end.

Though it may be little-known nationally, Pinetree is still a highly respected course in Georgia golf generally and Atlanta especially, evidenced by its selection to host a state championship last summer.

Brent Hutto,
Kennesaw is northwest of Atlanta, now a suburb.  There was a major engagement there prior to the Battle of Atlanta during the Civil War, but the town's main claim to fame in recent years was an ordinance passed by the city council REQUIRING each household in the city to own a firearm.  This was only about 15 yrs. ago, and was a poorly concieved protest of Morton Grove, Ill. voting to make owning ammunition illegal, though guns were still o.k.  (Nobody as ever been prosecuted by the town for violating the ordinance, though it is still on the books.  Perhaps Mike Cirba was packing!  )

[Mike_Cirba]

A.G.

As a damn Philadelphia yankee visiting your fair state, perhaps I should have been packing?!  

If I had known about that law prior, I would have given it some thought.  But then again, I might not have played Pinetree.  

[Keith Williams]

Kennesaw, though often mentioned in regards to the firearm law, is actually not really representative of that image (and, no, I was never arrested while I lived in the city limits for not owning a gun  ).  Basically, Kennesaw is a pretty ordinary suburb of ATL.

What I do want to offer, though, is a good hats off to Mike for recognizing the great traits of Pinetree because just as A.G. mentioned; Pinetree has been well respected for years around the metro area, but it is a low key course and I would be willing to bet that 90+% of the golfers who walk off the 18th green like it, but don't nearly notice all of the features that Mike noted.  In fact, outside of the small, quick greens most golfers would see the course as solid but unextraordinary.  A few holes do generate some chatter (the 8th and 11th) but in reality it is a subtle course that definitely would be viewed higher by the treehouse than the ordinary local.

Yes, Mike the course is fun to play in the dry fall.  Unlike most other courses in the area I am pretty sure Pinetree still does not overseed (see the google maps aerial and compare Pinetree's color to Marietta CC's just S-SW) lending itself to F&F conditions.

Pinetree has been known for having a strong low-handicap presence in the membership, so I guess that speaks highly of its test of skills.  Larry Nelson basically learned how to play golf on the course, and he turned out to be pretty good .

Keith.

[Mike_Cirba]

Thanks for the kind words, Keith.   Despite being low-key, it was difficult for me to miss those features because they beat me about the head all day long!  

The interesting thing is that we only had one day to play prior to Monday's ANGC practice round, and I had done some pre-planning to get us to Cuscowilla.  Then my brother called (we stayed at his in laws in Kennesaw) during the week to tell me that his father-in-law had invited us to play at his club that day instead, which would have been impolite to turn down.  I asked the name and when told "Pinetree" was a bit disappointed.

Then I did some research to see that it was designed in 1958 by Chic Adams? and pictured tree lined holes to big greens with artificial water all over the place like a typical 1960 design.  

It was a wonderful surprise.  

The other cool part is that my 78 year old dad got around just fine (actually had a pretty good round) while the course pummelled my brother and I.  

[SWR]

I have been a member at Pinetree for a few years...and could not agree more with a lot of the comments.  It's a fun course to plan day in, day out for a wide variety of golfers.  Just some other comments:

- The course has not had many major modification partly due to some financial issues.  They have removed some bunkers, and as previously stated, trees were removed due to a tornado

- The course provides numerous options off the tee...not through width, but through distance and angles.
- The greens are definately small...after playing the course a few times, you know where not to miss.  You will not get a double breaker on the course...the whole green will be moving in one direction (left to right, back to front, etc)  
-  There is one real bad hole on the course, par 5, #11.  There is a huge valley in front of the green...that basically all 2nd shots roll into.  Good driving hole, good green, but the valley just ruins the hole.
- The course is probably one of the best walking courses in Atlanta.  I would say that more than 60% of the play is done walking
- The course does not play exceptionally firm
- Some nice history...Larry Nelson was the assistant pro back in the early 60's
- Rarely does a round last more than 4 hours...You just have to avoid Sunday afternoon.

The course is very willing to allow some outside play during the week...just give them a call.

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