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Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Back-to-back par-3's
« on: November 17, 2013, 04:20:37 AM »
I recently played at Bristol and Clifton, a thoroughly enjoyable free draining semi-parkland/semi-downland course just south of the River Avon in Bristol. Very much a traditional English golf club, and all the better for it. Very pleasant indeed. The 6th and 7th holes at B&C are back-to-back par-3's.

Other courses with this arrangement that immediately come to mind are -

15th & 16th at Cruden Bay
14th & 15th at Ballybunnion Old
Cullen has a few, though not sure of the hole numbers

Any others?

All the best

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2013, 04:54:16 AM »

West Sussex 5th and 6th are both extremely good holes.

15 & 16 at Cypress Point are none too shabby either.
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Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2013, 04:58:08 AM »
16 & 17 at Golspie.
5 & 6 at West Sussex
15 & 16 at Cypress Point

Cheating somewhat, 4 & 16 East at Royal Melbourne when you're playing an East course main paddock loop late in the day!

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2013, 06:09:57 AM »
It will rarely get a mention, but Painswick's 6 & 7 is an awesome pair of 3s.  Hell, I don't like the 5th much, but adding it to 6 & 7 offers incredible diversity for three short holes in succession.

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Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2013, 06:38:52 AM »
Pac Dunes, as doubtless will be mentioned, boasts the abutment of the par 3 10th and 11th holes.

Its neighbor, Bandon Preserve, has an odd arrangement as well: 13 consecutive par 3s...
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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2013, 07:04:14 AM »
I always thought that back-to-back par-3 holes were a design taboo -- something I would never want to do.  That was partly because any time you do it on a great course, you invite comparison with the 15th and 16th at Cypress Point -- and you will never build two holes anywhere near as good as that!

Then, at Pacific Dunes, I just sort of fell into having them.  Mr. Keiser was not too keen on the idea, either, but it was either that, or waste 100+ yards of oceanfront real estate, and I convinced him that was ludicrous.  [Glad I did.]  However, I was convinced that was the only time I would ever build back-to-back 3's.

Flash forward to Rock Creek, five years later.  The long par-3 13th was in place on some earlier routings, but when we finally worked out the sequence of holes at the start of the round, the routing was 19 holes -- and most of it was one long loop, so it was difficult to throw out a link in the chain.  The only place we had a hole going out and a hole coming back parallel were two par-4's just before the 13th, so Eric Iverson suggested we combine them into a short par-3 down the hill.  It took me a while to overcome my natural resistance, but it helped a lot that the two holes were about 100 yards different in length.  I do wonder sometimes if this is one of the things that holds Rock Creek back in rankings.

I have realized over time that I actually like what having back-to-back par-3's does for the pacing of the course -- by putting two of the short holes together, you wind up with a big stretch of longer holes somewhere, which can get you into a good rhythm.  Even so, I'd never do it again unless both the par-3's were outstanding ... and I couldn't figure out another solution that was nearly as good.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2013, 07:05:38 AM »
Rich:  I would have said 5 & 6 at Painswick.  The 7th didn't do much for me.

The only other modern course I can think of with consecutive par-3's is Desert Highlands, with the 15th & 16th.  And then it has back-to-back par-5's to finish!

Jim Nugent

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2013, 07:35:53 AM »
#2 at St. Louis CC is a long, slightly uphill Biarritz.  So long there's still confusion in my mind whether it was originally a par 3 or a par 4.  #3 is a long Eden.  

At the old Forest Park 18 (pre-Irwin-renovation), numbers 2 and 3 were both par long par 3s, that I liked a great deal.  They were followed by two par 5s in a row.  

Dean DiBerardino

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2013, 07:58:30 AM »
12 & 13 at Mayfield.

Joey Chase

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2013, 07:59:44 AM »
There is 9 and 10 at Quaker Ridge and the 14th and 15th at Oitavos Dunes as well.

Joey Chase

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2013, 08:06:06 AM »
Machrihanish 14th and 15th also

jonathan_becker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2013, 08:25:53 AM »
12 & 13 at Mayfield.

Ah, you beat me to it.

8 and 9 at Lagrange in Chicago are another pair of back-to-backs.

As cool as 10 and 11 are at Pacific Dunes, I probably prefer 12 and 13 at RCCC.  Mainly because of the disparity in length.

It's hard to top 15 and 16 at CPC though.  Amazing holes to the max!

Greg Clark

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2013, 08:28:09 AM »
15 & 16 Whispering Pines
6 &7 Cabo del Sol ocean

Scott Weersing

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2013, 08:35:55 AM »
Here is a thread from way back in 2002!

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php?topic=4138.0


David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2013, 08:36:27 AM »
#16 & #17 at Lincoln Park, San Francisco, two 200+ yarders.

Jonathan Davison

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2013, 08:38:34 AM »
The 9th & 10th at Brancepeth Castle, both great holes.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2013, 09:04:13 AM »
One of the courses at Bonita Springs on the west coast of Florida has two pairs, 7-8 and 16-17.  I remembering playing them 2-2-5-5 during a monumental collapse.

Dan_Callahan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2013, 09:12:20 AM »
13 and 14 at Newport CC.

Frank Giordano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2013, 10:22:05 AM »
In the Pinehurst area, the Dan Maples design at Longleaf Golf Club has par 3's on holes 12, 13, and 15.

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2013, 12:30:43 PM »
Mach Dunes is another modern with back to back par threes immediately after a very driveable 280 yard par four.

James Boon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2013, 12:54:51 PM »
16 and 17 at Tain are back to back par 3s.

16 is a 147 yard slight drop shot, pretty holes with water to carry but not really in play. 17 is 215 yards over flatter land but the water must again be carried and also runs down the right side of the green. Quite a brute by comparison with the previous hole.

Funny, I'd not noticed till this thread that Tain and Golspie being so close together have not just back to back par 3s, but the same holes as well?

Cheers,

James
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Jon Wiggett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2013, 12:55:44 PM »
Best set I have come across was a Harry Colt design at Mandelieu near Cannes, France. The second (158m) and third (193m) are back to back par threes split by a ferry ride across the river. Then at the end of the 16th (121m) and 17th (165m) are also par threes. They are so well done that it was not until I studied the card at the end of the round that I realised the course had back to back par 3s twice.

I have said this before that Mandelieu is a real hidden (or forgotten) gem which is desperately in need of renovation but if it were would be amongst the best courses on mainland Europe.

Jon

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2013, 02:09:57 PM »
Elgin has back to back par 3's (6th & 7th ?) while Rich's home course Aberlour starts with 2 of the more challenging par 3's. From memory Cullen has two par 3's in a row, the first of which is the last hole on the top tier and then the next hole is the long par 3 playing down to the lower ground. Later on in the round it has 3 in a row that play over and around sea stacks.

Niall

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2013, 02:16:56 PM »
Elgin has back to back par 3's (6th & 7th ?) while Rich's home course Aberlour starts with 2 of the more challenging par 3's. From memory Cullen has two par 3's in a row, the first of which is the last hole on the top tier and then the next hole is the long par 3 playing down to the lower ground. Later on in the round it has 3 in a row that play over and around sea stacks.

Niall

Niall:

Cullen has a bunch of back-to-back 3's.  Nos. 2-3-4 are all par-3's, with the flat 230-yard 3rd sandwiched in between two very short ones.  Nos. 6 & 7 are the ones you referred to.  And then 11-12-13-14 are four more in a row among the sea stacks -- the 11th would get my vote as the best hole on the course but the 12th is a pretty crazy blind hole to a tiny green tacked onto a steep slope at the back and right.

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Back-to-back par-3's
« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2013, 02:48:17 PM »
Crail Balcomie has back to back par 3s at 13 and 14, immediately after back to back par 5s.  In fact the last 7 holes are 5, 5, 3, 3, (driveable) 4, 3, 4, 3.
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