[Dennis_Harwood]

I count four current active threads regarding the Rules of Golf, and in each a number of posters are attacking those Rules. I am puzzled as to the logic of those "attacks"--

It is important to clear up what appears to be some misconceptions regarding the Rules of Golf, which are a copyrighted joint work of the USGA and the R&A--

As the governing bodies constantly point out, the only jurisdiction they have in imposing those Rules are the competitions they conduct(13 national championships by the USGA and an approximate similar number by the R&A)-- If you elect to play in those championships (and of course, even if you have the game to compete, the choice of participation is your election) you must play under the USGA/R&A Rules--

Other than that, adoption of the Rules for any competition is purely elective-

The USGA/R&A does interpet those Rules if requested by Committees or others who voluntarily elect to adopt them, but they will not interpet rules questions if the Rules are not in effect for the competition-

The choice to adopt those Rules for any other event or competition, at any level, is purely voluntary--

The PGA Tour could adopt other rules of play, but they choose not to.

The LPGA, Champions Tour and European Tour could adopt other rules of play, but they choose not to.

The various other Tours around the world, Hooters, Nationwide, Japan, Candian and hundreds of other mini-Tour, regional and national championships, pro and amatuer,  could adopt other rules, but none of them do--

The thousands of local and regional associations around the world could adopt other rules or modify the USGA/R&A Rules, but none of them do--

The tens of thousands of courses and golfing clubs could adopt other rules, but virtually none of them do--

Any group stepping on the first tee can adopt any rules of play they wish(I have yet to see someone arrested or jailed for playing a "scramble" or similar competition which has nothing to do with the Rules of Golf), but most people in match or stroke competitions play by the USGA and R&A rules(the club by posting "USGA Rules in effect" has no jurisdiction over you and your group if you wish to play by other rules)--

It is amazing that if the Rules are as bad as some would suggest they would be rarely used, or at least modified, but as we know virtually all competitions everywhere use the Rules of Golf of the USGA/R&A in their current unmodified form--

Why do almost all groups use the USGA/R&A rules?  A few reasons:

1-They have stood the test of time over 250 years that the game has been competitively played-- The games first explosion in popularity in the Isles occured when a uniform set of Rules was agreed upon permiting interclub competition-- the next explosion was after WWII when a uniform set was adopted world wide permitting anyone playing anywhere to be sure he was playing the same game by saying "Play under USGA/R&A Rules". The 34 Rules of today are not much different than the basics of the original 13 Rules(Its clearly recognizable, under the Rules, as the same game)

2- Your group can play under any damn set of rules they chose so long as unanimous agreement exists, but with bets everyone better know exactly what the "other" rules are before you start play-- The oft told story of PJ Boatwright (former USGA Rules director) is applicable here-- Someone in PJ's group on saturday morning asked "PJ, do we have to play by "strict" USGA rules today?"  PJ replied "Of course not, but if we are going to wager I want to know the rules we are playing under and I want to know all of them"

3- The Rules (and the decisions) have been refined based upon millions of golfing events over all kinds of conditions and courses to reach consistent results equally treating all golfers--some may complain that a occasional unique circumstance may arise to create what appears to be an "unfair" result, but as to those who don't like the result and attack the Rule,  I defy them to rewrite the Rule so that it will adequately cover all situations which may arrise in all types of competitions--

Those who complain about the Rules should be mindful that they can chose to compete under the Rules or not compete-- this is a free and elective decision-- It is not like a tax law-- You don't like the Rules, don't play in competitions where they are in effect--Convince everyone in the competition to play under other rules, that is the rules you will play under(you will find you may have very small groups however)

Two final issues that seem to be overlooked(or misunderstood)--First,  If one group is playing, not only can that group agree to play under any rules everyone agrees upon , even under USGA Rules that one friendly foresome is the Committee, and it has great power under the Rules to make decisions and rulings--  Only when more groups are involved does the Committee exist outside your group.

Second, Even with USGA/R&A Rules in effect, most competitive play among amatuers at the club level is match play--Although you can not agree to waive Rules of Golf if you are playing under USGA Rules(Rule 1-3), you can, if you wish, elect to overlook any breach by your opponent(Dec 2-5/1)-- Interestingly those who seem to complain the loudest about a "silly rule" that should not be enforeced are not dealing with an opponent's breach of a rule they overlooked, they are complaining about an infraction called on them--

I just don't see how Rules of Golf, which are adopted on a purely voluntary basis, for use in competitions which an individual has a total elective choice to compete in or not, and are fully spelled out and known to him before he makes his choice to compete can be considered draconian, unfair, silly, outdated, misguided, (or any of the other similar adjectives I have seem used in recent posts)

[JohnV]

Very well said Dennis.

One thing that could cause a problem is that in order to post a score for handicap purposes in the US, the USGA requires that you play according to the Rules of Golf ( although they do allow certain violations such as using laser range finders.)  This means that if you decided to play under your own set of rules you shouldn't post the score.  Since many clubs require all rounds played to be posted, this implies that you must always play under the Rules of Golf whether you and your little group want to or not.

But please lets not get Rich started on the Handicap System again.

[George Pazin]

Come on, guys, all that's needed to make rules is a little common sense.

 

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Dennis,
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!

John, How many times have you caught me accidently putting a ball in play past the tee?

Everytime, you have, I feel in my mind that I have committed a gross error, and in truth, I feel the round, or at least the hole is truely over for doing simply because it is a stupid breach of the rules on my part, even though it wasn't actually being done on purpose. This is where the penalty phase of the breach is more then accepted, and in HONOR and respect of the Game. Without that there is nothing but anarchy, which the Game will surely die.

[JohnV]

Tommy, it was just that you were so blatant that day at PGA West that I know that redanman and I will never give you break on it anymore.

I believe that we usually called it to your attention before you teed off in order to save you from a penalty.  That is truely where Honor and Respect come from.

I played in an OGA event once where a player had teed the ball up very close to the markers and possibly in front.  I noticed on other player (who was known to be a jerk) looking closely at it.  I moved up and made sure that the ball was ok.  The player hit the shot and the jerk said, "Don't pick up that tee",  but the player had already done it.  I said, "The ball was behind the markers and if it wasn't, I WOULD HAVE TOLD HIM BEFORE HE HIT IT!" and walked off down the fairway.  Scum like that need to be removed from the game, not the rules that they abuse.

[A_Clay_Man]

I am currently living the nightmare of confusion of the rules. I don't know what the root cause is, but here in the land of entrapment, few of the golfers have a clue as to the RoG. And those that do all seem to want to golf together, so there is no disemination of rules, ettiquette or advice. Common mis-conceptions include, but not limited to, trying to take a drop near to where their ball was not found. I can just imagine how much I look like a jerk when I tell them,"back to the tee" (or original spot).

Tying in the bruhaha of the scorcard issue, I recently resigned as VP of a club that was continually making exceptions to stated formats or rules. Most of these "last minute" decisions had serious impact on the results. I speculated that the guy "in-charge" didn't have fortitude to say "no". So rather than frustrate the shit out of me I am much more cirumspect in the venues I choose to compete.

Sad but true.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Exactly!

John I don't think I mentioned a story I told you about at one time when I was Captain for the Mountain View CC for SCGA Team Match Play, but I did some years ago ask you about an issue with ball markers with the little prong.

We were playing Indian Hills GC in Riverside, and Indian Hills was known for having a group of golfers that were not only known sand baggers, but tried to utilize rules far beyond their actual scope. One of these fellows, Maurice Norrington, who I had happened upon in SCGA Amateur competition some years before was the type of player that was not only well known sandbagger, but once claimed successfully during a round, and late in the round that the little prong on a ball marker, if utilized on the green was considered testing the surface. He actually won a match by default in this ruling.

I had remembered hearing about this, and approached his captain before our round started, and I said to him, "in regards to ball markers, are the standard little ball markers with the prong allowed? He responded that he had no problem with it, and of the teams went.

After the round, I finsihed in the next to last group, victorious, mind you, but another team match was being argued over in regards to the ball markers. The match was in the closing holes--neck and neck, and at the 17th hole, who of course calls penalty on one of my players for the ball mark?? Why of course Maurice Norrington!

I took great pride walking him over to his team Captain and asked him to explain that we had agreed by the rules that the markers were O.K. We tied our matches, but it to me was still a victory, over the same type of scummy individual that doesn't have the decency and Honor to warn a player of a soon to be impeding rule infraction, and use it for his gain. I beleive it is totally out of spirit of the rules.

Now my question again, since I forgot, Arre those little prongs on the standard everyday plastic ball mark, in fact testing the surface?

Dennis, you too! Please weigh-in on this one!

[ForkaB]

Slightly off topic, but my favo(u)rite tee marker story is the guy in the North of Scotland who won an 18-hole scratch stroke play competition by 5+ strokes in horrendous conditions but was disqualified becuase he (adn his playing partner) had mistakenly used the back tees rather than the forward ones which had been designated for the day.

As a PS to this, I wonder if JohnV, Dennis and the other rules experts can give me the reasoning behind limiting the distance one can tee the ball behind the markers to 2-club lengths?  Surely, the farther back you tee, the less advantage you have (even accounting for those robots who claim to always hit their 6-irons exactly 182.37 yards, or whatever.......).

[Bill_McBride]

One of the things I love most about golf is that the real golfers respect the rules and also help each other with the rules.  I was at the Kemper in Washington DC a few years ago, walking with a threesome that included Tom Kite and Grant Waite, the eventual winner, a young guy from Down Under.

On an early hole in the final round, Waite's ball wouind up near the green in an area marked with white chalk as Ground Under Repair.  He picked up the ball and dropped it in a decent lie but in a place where he would be standing on the line.  Tom Kite very gently told him that he should redrop, as he would not be taking complete relief and would therefore be penalized.  Waite redropped, played on and eventually won the tournament by a couple of shots over Kite.  What a great thing Kite did!  He could have just let the kid play and then informed him thathe was two strokes more than he thought!

[Scott Seward]

Tommy - You are not testing the surface with a ball marker. In fact, under the Rules of Golf a ball marker has no status. There is nothing in the book or Decisions book to support that claim. Sounds like creative Gamesmanship to me.

[Dan Herrmann]

You should've seen the look on my 3 partners' faces when I was forced called a 4 shot penalty on our team.  I don't think they were too happy, but it's part of sportsmanship. All four of us eventually agreed that we did the right thing.

We were playing 2 best balls out of 4 for a combined team score.  We were on the ninth tee, and "Jim", a new member at our club, was bragging about his new set of Ping irons that he'd purchased used.  He told us how he even had a 1-iron included in the set.  

I casually asked to look at the clubs, and could immediately see that he had way over 14 clubs in is bag.  If I remember right, he had 18 clubs in there!  Jim had no idea that there was a 14 club limit...

We couldn't just let it go - like golfers everywhere, we called the penalty on ourselves, dropped off the extra clubs at the pro shop at the turn, and lost by 3 strokes.  (We confirmed with the committee (the head pro) that we were acting in accordance to the rules).

C'est la vie - but that's golf!

[ClarkW]

Dennis:
Well said!

For those of you who want to learn even more about the rules go to www.leithsociety.com which is a discussion group similar to GCA regarding the rules of golf. And don't be surprised to see the name Dennis Harwood attached to a few of the posts!

[Bob_Huntley]

Apocryphal or not, I love the story of Roger Lapham, one of the founders at Cypress Point, in a match against one of his staunchest opponents claiming relief from 'Casual Water.'
Much opposition to the claim from said opponent. Lapham undid his trousers and promptly peed on the ball, creating quite a puddle. Relief granted amid much merriment.
 

[TEPaul]

"On an early hole in the final round, Waite's ball wouind up near the green in an area marked with white chalk as Ground Under Repair.  He picked up the ball and dropped it in a decent lie but in a place where he would be standing on the line.  Tom Kite very gently told him that he should redrop, as he would not be taking complete relief and would therefore be penalized.  Waite redropped, played on and eventually won the tournament by a couple of shots over Kite.  What a great thing Kite did!  He could have just let the kid play and then informed him thathe was two strokes more than he thought!"

Bill McBride:

Kite should really know about that. I can't exactly remember whether he got called on that or if he skated past the "tournament closed" rule without realizing it but in a US Open Kite (in contention) took relief and the later video showed without a question of a doubt that his foot was firmly planted on the line (that he hadn't taken full relief) when he hit his next shot. If I'm not mistaken that still from the video of that incident may still be used in rules seminars!

Here's a trivia question for you rules mavens out there. Who's the golfer in the still photo whose attempting to tee off as a dog is making away with his golf ball? (Also still used in rules seminars!).

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Johnny Bulla?(sp)

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Thanks Scott. I still wonder time to time about that rule, and the spirit of what it means, and how exactly it can be taken out of context.

[Dennis_Harwood]

Tommy-- Re the ball markers with the little "tab", they are just fine-- If you can use a tee to mark your ball, and that is not testing, you can use those-- Please note the Rules require marking of a ball when lifted(Rule 20-1) and in the definition of " Equipment" "coins and tees" are specifically identified as proper things to mark the location of your ball--Also Decision 20-1/17 mentions using a tee to mark the balls position on the putting green.

The only drawback is if the little "prong" lifts a tuft of grass behind your ball when removed you can not press it down or repair it before you putt--

Rich--Why the two club length on the teeing ground?-- Primarily to insure all competitors are playing the same course-- If there be no restriction players could move back to the point where they could always hit their "favorite club" on par threes, and you may be able to get a prefered line of play if you have a hook or slice--

Also historical(in the original Rules you teed off on the next hole within two club lengths of the place you holed your ball)--

Also I am sure greenskeepers prefer some restriction on use of the teeing ground--

[Jim_Kennedy]

Dennis,
Actually the original rules of golf stated "You must tee your ball within a club's length of the hole". There were variations on the distance in other codes with two yards being prominent among them but 3, 6, etc., were also used.  
The R&A rules of 1888 appear to be the first to "create" a teeing area by saying: "The ball must be teed within the marks laid down by the conservator of the links, which shall be considered the "Teeing Ground."  The balls shall not be teed in advance of such marks nor more than two club lengths behind them."

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