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jkinney

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Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2011, 08:09:14 PM »
JKinney,

One of the things I've learned, when in the Road Bunker or short of the green, is that aiming at the flagstick may not be the most prudent play.

Under certain conditions, it's better to aim at the fatter part of the green, accepting a two putt bogey, rather than risk a much higher number.

NGLA is a wonderful match play golf course, but, it can be diabolically devilish at medal play when conditions are fast & firm, the wind is up and the hole locations are "competitive.
[/quote


Pat - Agreed. I aim back left (the fat part of the green) whenever the shot is really dicey and then putt uphill if the hole is cut front right. Front right has an even higher level of difficulty than back right on 12 (Sebonac) and back right on 15 (Narrows) -- both of which you'll describe in future chapters of the enchanted journey, we all hope.

As to National as a match play venue, I know of none better. The Walker Cup in 2013 will show that brilliantly, I'm sure.


jkinney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2011, 08:41:54 PM »
Pat - Another of the brilliant design features of 7's green complex is the front bunker protecting the tee on 8 (Bottle). What a great collection bunker. With the optimum second shot finishing as far right as possible so as to afford an approach down the NW to SE axis of the green, CBM rolled the right edge of the fairway right down into that bunker ! I hope you haven't been in it as often as I have.

Patrick_Mucci

Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #27 on: April 03, 2011, 09:08:54 PM »
JKinney,

Many of NGLA's bunkers, greenside and fairway, roll down from the adjacent green or fairway.

I think it's a fabulous feature and have encouraged GCGC to mow their fairways and green perimeters accordingly.

It certainly penalizes the marginal shot, as it should be penalized.

It's just another brilliant design feature.

jkinney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #28 on: April 03, 2011, 11:05:30 PM »
Well, Pat, having secured par on the road hole by hook or by crook, shall we walk the narrow passage NW betweeen the bunkers to the tee of "Bottle", one of your favorite par 4's anywhere?

Jordan Wall

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #29 on: September 16, 2011, 07:31:22 PM »
Have these threads stopped?  I would love to see them resurrected, because every hole at NGLA is fantastic and offers unique strategy that should stimulate some great discussion.

The seventh hole is one of my favorites.  The tee shot is full of mystery as there is little clue except for where your caddie stands as to where to hit it.  The sixth green, seventh tee, and twelfth green are no more than thirty yards apart, shedding light to the brilliant routing.

Once at the top of the hill, the second shot is in plain view and all of a sudden seems much more difficult than the blind tee shot.  With the green angled at a precise angle requiring a right to left shot to reach the surface, a lay up seems a viable option even from 200 yards.

Last Sunday, I laid up to 60 yards on the left side of the fairway with the pin just over the road bunker.  I've never been more scared of a pitch shot in my life.  To me, that is a great exam ple of why the National is so great.  It's not long, but if you don't think out your shots then even the easiest of shots can be excruciatingly difficult.  At National, you have to think about every shot and this is readily evident on the seventh.


This is certainly a great golf hole.  Without a doubt, one of the hardest and most fun 480 yard par-5 I've ever played.

Patrick_Mucci

Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #30 on: September 16, 2011, 10:36:46 PM »
Have these threads stopped?  I would love to see them resurrected, because every hole at NGLA is fantastic and offers unique strategy that should stimulate some great discussion.

The seventh hole is one of my favorites.  The tee shot is full of mystery as there is little clue except for where your caddie stands as to where to hit it.  The sixth green, seventh tee, and twelfth green are no more than thirty yards apart, shedding light to the brilliant routing.

Once at the top of the hill, the second shot is in plain view and all of a sudden seems much more difficult than the blind tee shot.  With the green angled at a precise angle requiring a right to left shot to reach the surface, a lay up seems a viable option even from 200 yards.

Jordan,

With the tee  moved back, by or across the access road, the tee shot DZ for most would be in the bowl, leaving you with a blind second shot.


Last Sunday, I laid up to 60 yards on the left side of the fairway with the pin just over the road bunker.  I've never been more scared of a pitch shot in my life.  To me, that is a great exam ple of why the National is so great.  It's not long, but if you don't think out your shots then even the easiest of shots can be excruciatingly difficult.  At National, you have to think about every shot and this is readily evident on the seventh.

The subtleties seem endless.

Hopefully, I'll get to the 8th hole soon.



This is certainly a great golf hole.  Without a doubt, one of the hardest and most fun 480 yard par-5 I've ever played.

Noel Freeman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #31 on: September 18, 2011, 12:11:31 PM »
It is me, or should someone give a shootout to Bill Salinetti and team for how awesome it looks NGLA is playing...

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #32 on: September 18, 2011, 01:19:17 PM »
Noel I'd agree, I was there last week and the course was in perfect condition despite heavy rains and hurricances in recent weeks. As someone who has been pretty lucky to play some great courses and matches, dinners, etc at top clubs I was completely blown away by the entire National experience both on and off the course.
Cave Nil Vino

Anthony Gray

Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #33 on: September 19, 2011, 11:32:48 AM »


   It would be better if played as a par 4.

  Anthony


Bill_McBride

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Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2011, 11:34:30 AM »


   It would be better if played as a par 4.

  Anthony



Why?  Would you play the hole differently?

Anthony Gray

Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2011, 11:37:05 AM »


   It would be better if played as a par 4.

  Anthony



Why?  Would you play the hole differently?

  Most would be bolder on teir second shot.
 


Anthony Gray

Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #36 on: September 19, 2011, 11:40:35 AM »


  1-Blind tee shot

  2-Deep front bunker

  3-Narrow green

  4-Par 4

  5-Road optional

  Anthony


John Mayhugh

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Re: The Enchanted Journey, # 7
« Reply #37 on: October 17, 2012, 10:39:55 PM »
In response to a request, I've updated the Patrick's text for the 7th hole as well.  The first two pictures are Jon Spaulding's.  They were added to Patrick's original post, so apparently he does know something about working with photos.

As you leave the back of the 6th green, either euphoric, content or disappointed in your perfomance on the short "short" hole, you head toward the 7th tee which sits between the 6th and 12th greens.

Upon reaching the 7th tee, one usually glances over at the 12th green, noticing the hole location, especially as it relates to the mound running through the back third of the green.  The hole location, relative to the mound, will later dictate or heavily influence play on that hole.

Now, you turn and look down the playing corridor and are struck by a disturbing question.

"Where in the hell do I aim ?"

Suddenly, you feel disoriented.
There's nothing out their to guide you, no defined DZ, just undulations of grass, mounds and trees on the horizon, stretching from the far left, which you realize is the playing corridor for # 12, to the far right, which looks unappealing, due to the long heavy rough.


Having said that, to a degree, Mother Nature has come to the rescue in that a prevailing wind is directly in your face or coming in your face slightly from the left.  And, often it's a heavy breeze, laden with moisture off the sea.

Based on the yardage, you were thinking "birdie" but, with no definition and a little wind in your face, you take aim at the caddy and swing away.

Should hour ball sail right, it's eiither in tall rough or the bunker complex.
Extraction from there is a chore, and the prudent golfer, depending upon their lie, merely seeks to exit with a shot decent enough to allow him to get home in regulation.


Drives hit left face a similar, and perhaps harsher fate, as the  configuration of the left side bunker can be more difficult than the large sprawling right side bunkers..

If one has hit a good drive, where the caddy directed them, they're probably in "The Bowl", unless they've hit a really good drive which would bring them up onto the plateau, giving them a good glimpse of the green.

For those in the bowl, they're faced with another blind shot..






Irrespective of your position off the tee, a critical factor now enters the equation.

The location of the hole.

It is absulutely critical to the tactics you will or should employ.

If you can't get home in two, and most can't, the next question is, where do I want to be for my third shot, what line and what distance.

The green is angled, basically from High South to low North,
It falls off steeply to the rear to a huge, deep bunker.
The green is slightly elevated, and starts out very narrow at the low North end, and gradually expands.
While the green is 43 yards front to back, measured on it's angle it's probably closer to 50 yards, tip to tip.
Fronting the green is the famous Road Hole bunker.  It is deep, and seems to have an affinity for attracting golf balls.

Getting to a hole location directly behind the bunker is a significant challenge.

Flanking the entire right side of the fairway starting at about 100 yards from the center of the green is a set of deep bunkers.
An ideal third shot approach to this angled green would seem to be right next to those bunkers, except for that huge damn tree, branching out so ominously.

 

To the left, would seem llike a far more benign and safer route.


However, those taking that route would subsequently face a daunting third shot approach, as they would be faced with a dreaded shot to a narrow, firm, slightly elevated green, with the fear and almost certainty of going long, down, into that deep right side bunker.




So, here you are, after hitting your drive, back in the fairway or rough, contemplating your fate, trying to determine your method of play.

By now, your caddy probably has a more realistic assessment of your game than you do. so, his advice can be invalueable.

And, the location of the hole is THE determining factor.

The caddy tells you to hit your 3-wood or rescue or 4 iron down the right side, so that you'll have the best angle and shot to approach the green to.

But, you're afraid of those bunkes on the right, and the wind, which will push everything further right, so, you err on the side of caution and hit to the center or right center of the fairway.

And now, now, the FUN begins.

It doesn't matter if you're 100 yards or 10 yards from the green, the approach shot can be incredibly intimidating.


My old friend, Joe MacBride, a great golfer, showed me how to hit every club, from putter to driver, from 10 or 100 yards from this green.  For him, it was all a matter of feel, how he felt that day.  Now Joe had a great short game, and he was intimately familiar with NGLA, so he was very comfortable with almost any choice.

But, I can assure you, the fear factor, for what seems like such an innocent, short, easy shot, is extremely high, due to the consequences if you fail.

Now, it you're out for a casual, doesn't count round, well, so what ?
but, if you're trying to qualify for an event, you know that this simple little shot, can decimate your round.
You can make birdie, par, or far worse.  So you'd better think this through properly and you'd better execute properly.

Remember, these greens are FIRM and FAST, so the slightest mishit will cost you dearly.

Shold you go right and wrong, the right side bunker is DEEP.  You are well below the putting surface.




Hit the ball short, and you're left with deja vu all over again.
And if the hole is located low North, you can end up playing ping pong, going back and forth as the strokes mount up.



So, let's go back in the fairway, knowing all of the above, because unlike TEPaul, you paid attention while reading my posts.

Sometimes  the more important issue is where you don't hit it.
You don't want to hit it right, you don't want to hit it into the Road Hole bunker and you don't want to ht it far left.

While most don't think of this, on # 7, being a little long isn't a bad thing.


Georgh Zahringer, a terrific amateur, advised me long ago, to err long when approaching # 7, esecially with your second shot, and even on your third, depending upon hole location.

If the hole is cut front, your best bet is to go for the center of the green.
If the hole is cut center, your best bet is to g for the back of the green.

Knowing this and being comfortable with it are two different things.
\
So, depending upon your lie, flat, uphill, sidehill, bunker right, bunker left, rough right, rough left, the wind and your confidence level, you make an informed choice, hoping to execute the best plan possible, given the state of your game at that moment.,

If you've executed a prudent, as opposed to an ego shot, then, you've optimized your chances of getting a birdie and minimized your chances of taking a big number, but, it's not over yet.

I"ve always liked having a breeze in my face as it provided an extra magin of error for my L-Wedge, which I could hit with more authority, from 5 to 70 yards., depending upon hole location.

Once on the putting surface, the challenge is reasonable.  The green, while subtle, doesn't have the slope, tiers or  mounds found on other greens at NGLA.

However, like almost all of the greens at NGLA, the edges do feed ball into bunkers, fairway or rough, so care must still be exercised, especially in the narrow, low North section.

With the hole cut front, low North, I've seen seasoned members, who are good golfers, play short of the green, attempting to two putt from just short of the green, get thier par and head to the next tee.  It's not a bad strategy when the hole is cut front, low North, as I've seen golfers take big numbers, from just 20 to 60 yards from the hole.

Hitting into the "Road Hole" bunker will almost always lead to a bogey or worse.






Having to traverse the Road Hole bunker will almost always lead to a bogey or worse.

For such a short hole, 478 yards, it can be a killer.

How to overcome the distance problem.

There's a simple solution and it's NOT changing par on the hole.

It's moving the tee back 30-50 yards, such that the "road Hole" bunker complex is brought back into play as CBM intended it.
There's a plateau back by the maintenance road, that could be a tee, and a tee could be crafted just beyond the maintenance road, making the hole play as CBM intended it.

That would bring the right side bunkers back into play, the Bowl back into play, and the positioning of the second shot for the longer hitteres back into play.

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