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JESII

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Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #50 on: January 13, 2011, 02:03:58 PM »
How does Facebook generate revenue?

Take what google knows about you and what advertising companies know about you and multiple it by 400.  That's where facebook has its value.

Think about what facebook knows about the users:  their friends, things they like, what they wear, what they buy, where they shop, when they shop, where they live, who they're related to.....etc.

It knows everything about you.  You know why?   Because we're all telling it.

It wouldn't shock me if in 30 years we find out that the CIA started facebook.



Ryan,

None of that tells me how they make any money.

The obvious answer is "Advertising Revenue"...is that the only answer? "Information"? Sure, how long will I spend on Facebook once the high school reunion phase wears off and the vendor barrage begins? Maybe I'm a cynic, but at least Google is responding to why I went there, the Facebook model seems like an end-around that is bound to annoy its users...but maybe not, it's likely most people are more tolerant than I am.

Brian Marion

Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #51 on: January 13, 2011, 02:40:54 PM »
I hate to say this but FaceBook really doesn't care about most us. Most of us are too old and the wrong demographic.

They are aiming their sites at your kids and your grandkids. That's the next generation of consumer and the earlier they can be influenced, the stronger the engagement will be moving forward.

Some people didn't like the horseless carriage, some didn't like the airplane, or the phone or the tv or the computer ..............

It truly doesn't matter if YOU get it or not.......they know that already.

Joe Bausch

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #52 on: January 16, 2011, 11:39:00 AM »
The Phoenix Open is being progressive and have put together an app for the iPhone for their upcoming tournament:

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2011/01/15/WM-Phoenix-Open-gets-iPhone-app.html
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #53 on: January 16, 2011, 11:28:32 PM »
The Blackberry (or whatever smart phone you use) has saved my golfing life.  If it weren't for the ability to read and respond to email and return urgent and semi-urgent phone calls I'd never be able to get out and play.  I still do plenty of business and entertaining on the course, but if it weren't for the ability to have that device with me it would be far less, and I'm positive my customers and business partners wouldn't have the time either.

Mixed feelings.  I've had a few experiences where business-minded playing partners lose touch with the game's camaraderie.  I think a major change in private club etiquette will be the gradual acceptance of cell phones on the course.



Patrick Hodgdon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #54 on: January 17, 2011, 01:04:50 AM »
That is kinda like my grandfather used to say how he doesn't need a PC. Social Network has exploded with under 35 generations. This is the future. The participation rate among under 35 with social network is astoundingly high and is the reason why Facebook IPO will be as big as Google IPO was.

I know far more about my friends and what they are up to with Facebook then I ever did before. That is only going to get more and more comprehensive as today's kids grow up and become adults.

Actually, Richard, no it's not like your grandpa saying he doesn't need a PC.  Businesspeople, and even retirees, need PCs for good and productive reasons.  They are business tools.  They're productive.    They save time.  

Conversely, Facebook - and you said it yourself - lets you know more about your friends.  What you're basically saying is that it's an unproductive tool to screw around during time you have to waste.  Facebook is, literally, a waste of time.    There's a big difference.  

BTW, watch the participation rate on facebook drop like a rock when the next must-do stupid waste of time comes along....Facebook is more like the hula-hoop than the PC...


I love this assessment of the value of Facebook. I never realized it was simply a waste of time. I should probably go delete my account now that Shivas has revealed the truth! 

You do realize that 'the next must-do stupid waste of time' will more than likely come from within Facebook or be a game you play on Facebook, right?
Did you know World Woods has the best burger I've ever had in my entire life? I'm planning a trip back just for another one between rounds.

"I would love to be a woman golfer." -JC Jones

Patrick Hodgdon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #55 on: January 17, 2011, 01:14:48 AM »

I'm not as bullish on Facebook as others are.  It is a complete waste of time and people are getting tired of the privacy issues.  That being said, I am very bullish on social networking, generally.


I had to laugh at this.

Comparable statements could be, 'I love steaks but not Filet Mignon."

'I'm into GCA but not so much Pine Valley'

You need to get with the 21st century and finally join my friend.

So far Brian Marion has given the best answer to Jeff's question IMO.

It will be very interesting to see what the memberships and club policies look like at the top older classic clubs In 20 years.

For instance will a club full of CEO's from this generation say like Seminole for instance still have an extremely strict no phone policy?

Did you know World Woods has the best burger I've ever had in my entire life? I'm planning a trip back just for another one between rounds.

"I would love to be a woman golfer." -JC Jones

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #56 on: January 17, 2011, 01:58:41 AM »
The Blackberry (or whatever smart phone you use) has saved my golfing life.  If it weren't for the ability to read and respond to email and return urgent and semi-urgent phone calls I'd never be able to get out and play.  I still do plenty of business and entertaining on the course, but if it weren't for the ability to have that device with me it would be far less, and I'm positive my customers and business partners wouldn't have the time either.

Mixed feelings.  I've had a few experiences where business-minded playing partners lose touch with the game's camaraderie.  I think a major change in private club etiquette will be the gradual acceptance of cell phones on the course.




This is what I envision as well.  Its still quite rare for a chap to be on the phone while playing golf, but I do know a guy who does it often and I have cut back my games with him.  I feel the same about talking on the phone in inappropriate places/situations as I do about people being habitually late; why in the hell do they think their time is worth more than mine?  Its a very selfish and self centered attitude, but I am afraid these devices help foster self centeredness rather than promote a sense of community.  The really stupid thing about this guy is he can't do anything for the clients that call, all he can say is he will call back when back in the office.  Bottom line, we will see phones on the course and in the house more and more and I think this a bad thing.  You either have time for a game or you don't.  We all have to make choices.

So far as face book goes, I am not involved, but it is obvious that my daughter's generation rely on it completely.  Again, its a mixed blessing.  I do think people who rely heavily on it will tend to sit in chairs rather than get outside and meet people face to face, but I don't think its because of face book, face book is merely one of the more recent devices that foster this behaviour if folks aren't careful in how they use it.  At least with face book peope are still talking - unlike tv.

Ciao
« Last Edit: January 17, 2011, 02:07:04 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #57 on: January 17, 2011, 09:30:10 AM »
Leave the cell phone in the car and play golf.  If you have to be taking calls all afternoon, that means you should be in the office...
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Patrick Hodgdon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #58 on: January 17, 2011, 09:34:17 AM »
Leave the cell phone in the car and play golf.  If you have to be taking calls all afternoon, that means you should be in the office...

What are your thoughts about a vibrate only, e-mail/text only policy?
Did you know World Woods has the best burger I've ever had in my entire life? I'm planning a trip back just for another one between rounds.

"I would love to be a woman golfer." -JC Jones

JR Potts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #59 on: January 17, 2011, 09:55:50 AM »
Leave the cell phone in the car and play golf.  If you have to be taking calls all afternoon, that means you should be in the office...


Talk about the fastest way to kill the game of golf.


JMEvensky

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #60 on: January 17, 2011, 10:00:31 AM »
Leave the cell phone in the car and play golf.  If you have to be taking calls all afternoon, that means you should be in the office...


Talk about the fastest way to kill the game of golf.



Sad,but true.All you can do is hope that people show a little courtesy.

I would guess the number of clubs with cell phone bans is close to the number that still ban jeans--probably the same clubs.

Brian Marion

Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #61 on: January 17, 2011, 10:45:31 AM »

I'm not as bullish on Facebook as others are.  It is a complete waste of time and people are getting tired of the privacy issues.  That being said, I am very bullish on social networking, generally.


So far Brian Marion has given the best answer to Jeff's question IMO.


Thanks Patrick.

I'm a marketer and communications specialist by trade, so I, of course, see the value in Facebook in reaching new markets. I do agree that it can be a huge waste of time if one chooses to sit closed in a room and typing all day to people they consider friends but rarely meet.
(wait, that's what I'm doing right now!)  ;-) However, most consumer use Facebook to keep up with friends they would normally have lost touch with due to jobs, travel and relocation.

That point aside, the facts of usage and target markets cannot be denied. Like it or not, think it stupid or not, the facts are there. It will affect golf's future, as will smartphones as they become even more powerful with more features.

If a club chooses not to use Facebook or the internet or any other new "tool", and that's what they are a tool just like the newspaper or magazines or the diner placemat, my question to them is, "have you considered the effect on your future?".

If the answer is no and we don't care, that's dangerous and not good business and clubs are a business. Maybe nothing changes in 15-20 years but it will change. If the answer is yes, and we don't care, then fine, you accept the consequences, good or bad fair enough.

The other example is cell phones. I understand a "no cellphone policy" and if your club can get it to work and not be a detriment to membership, great but for most it does not work. Everyone I know and do business with "works" 24/7 to some degree due to many factors, computers, emails, cell phones, a global economy...etc. Not being able to have my phone with me at the club would mean I can't be a member and most people I know in my generation would be the same.

That doesn't mean I get to abuse making calls while playing. That's rude, period. Anyone I have ever played with who wanted to take calls while playing, and I mean talk, set phone down, hit ball, continue talking, only got to play nine holes with Brian. I politely excused myself after the front nine but the message is clear. Take the calls at the clubhouse or at the turn, easy enough, all common sense. Probelm is, some don't have common sense but, did anyone speak to them directly about it or just enforce a policy on everyone because a minority are being idiots.

Sort of like slow play...punish the offender, not the entire community. But that's another thread.....



Patrick Hodgdon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #62 on: January 17, 2011, 11:21:07 AM »
Since playing there back in May I've been impressed with Holston Hills' use of Facebook. I'm surprised more clubs don't realize that it is a tool they can leverage for marketing to new members. (something almost every club needs to be doing these days)
Did you know World Woods has the best burger I've ever had in my entire life? I'm planning a trip back just for another one between rounds.

"I would love to be a woman golfer." -JC Jones

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #63 on: January 17, 2011, 11:25:07 AM »

That's rude, period. Anyone I have ever played with who wanted to take calls while playing, and I mean talk, set phone down, hit ball, continue talking, only got to play nine holes with Brian.


Where did Brian go, back to the first tee or his throne?

JC Jones

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #64 on: January 17, 2011, 11:42:07 AM »

I'm not as bullish on Facebook as others are.  It is a complete waste of time and people are getting tired of the privacy issues.  That being said, I am very bullish on social networking, generally.


I had to laugh at this.

Comparable statements could be, 'I love steaks but not Filet Mignon."


Rookie.  Get a porterhouse.
I get it, you are mad at the world because you are an adult caddie and few people take you seriously.

Excellent spellers usually lack any vision or common sense.

I know plenty of courses that are in the red, and they are killing it.

Paul OConnor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #65 on: January 17, 2011, 12:08:22 PM »
"Everyone I know and do business with "works" 24/7 to some degree due to many factors, computers, emails, cell phones, a global economy...etc."

I find this comment interesting.  Does everyone really need to be available 24/7 for work?  Weekends, after midnight, during a round of golf?  Is ones work of such a time sensitve nature, or requiring such immediate response that the other party cannot wait until Monday, or normal business hours, or until ones leisure time has ended to receive a response?

I would suggest that if that is the case, then those customers need a little retraining.   

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #66 on: January 17, 2011, 12:12:56 PM »
"Everyone I know and do business with "works" 24/7 to some degree due to many factors, computers, emails, cell phones, a global economy...etc."

I find this comment interesting.  Does everyone really need to be available 24/7 for work?  Weekends, after midnight, during a round of golf?  Is ones work of such a time sensitve nature, or requiring such immediate response that the other party cannot wait until Monday, or normal business hours, or until ones leisure time has ended to receive a response?

I would suggest that if that is the case, then those customers need a little retraining.  

Who here hasn't bailed an employee out of jail?  You can't build loyalty on your own time.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2011, 12:15:32 PM by John Kavanaugh »

Paul OConnor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #67 on: January 17, 2011, 12:18:21 PM »
I have never bailed an employee out of jail. 

You can't be in control of your own time if everyone else is.

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #68 on: January 17, 2011, 12:21:26 PM »
I have never bailed an employee out of jail. 

You can't be in control of your own time if everyone else is.

I lost control of my life at puberty.

Richard Choi

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #69 on: January 17, 2011, 12:23:47 PM »
I will say this - if you are a general manager at a golf club looking for more members/patrons, you would be a fool not to have a strong presence on Facebook. It is a far more effective marketing method than sending spam emails. You should see what Cabot Links has done already on Facebook and they are not even open yet!

JR Potts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #70 on: January 17, 2011, 12:37:30 PM »
Does everyone really need to be available 24/7 for work?  Weekends, after midnight, during a round of golf?

No, everyone doesn't.  But my clients have come to expect that and that is what I provide.

If someone has a problem with my walking into the trees or walking behind the group for 2 minutes to make a quick call while not falling out of position, well, then maybe we shouldn't play together.

My life requires 18 hours of contact...6-7 days a week.  I'm okay with it....but I also love golf.  So, something has to give and if it's my work, it makes paying for golf impossible.   So, I'll have to err on the side of possibly annoying a guy while playing golf the one time we play social golf together.

It's a risk I'm willing to unfortunately take.

And just for full disclosure - when playing social golf on weekdays, I carry my phone in my back pocket, check it quite often and even blast out an email or 10 while waiting for others to hit.  
« Last Edit: January 17, 2011, 12:40:47 PM by Ryan Potts »

Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #71 on: January 17, 2011, 12:40:36 PM »
Sheryl's figured out how to use FB effectively. I suspect it's a lot like Mike Young's theory on golf course marketing, that it's a huge benefit locally. I don't see it being worth 50b, because I don't even notice the advertisements, and would likely rarely click on one. I will admit that Ran and I both sat at Breakfast one morning soon after Google went public and thought the same thing.

FB is also the #1 tool for divorce lawyers.
If the cops learn how to use, a lot of really stupids kids are gonna get in trouble.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Jason Walker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #72 on: January 17, 2011, 01:11:51 PM »
Does everyone really need to be available 24/7 for work?  Weekends, after midnight, during a round of golf?

No, everyone doesn't.  But my clients have come to expect that and that is what I provide.

If someone has a problem with my walking into the trees or walking behind the group for 2 minutes to make a quick call while not falling out of position, well, then maybe we shouldn't play together.

My life requires 18 hours of contact...6-7 days a week.  I'm okay with it....but I also love golf.  So, something has to give and if it's my work, it makes paying for golf impossible.   So, I'll have to err on the side of possibly annoying a guy while playing golf the one time we play social golf together.

It's a risk I'm willing to unfortunately take.

And just for full disclosure - when playing social golf on weekdays, I carry my phone in my back pocket, check it quite often and even blast out an email or 10 while waiting for others to hit.  

Ryan-
agreed 100%.  Let me know when you want to play on a Wednesday!  If it's a weekday, assume in my foursome that someone will be emailing, listening to a con-call, returning an urgent voicemail, etc.  But then again, in my regular group at one club there's really no bother as we play ready golf, talk in backswings, gamble a lot, drink too much, ride in carts, keep hcap's single, and play in 3 hours and 30 mins--much to the chagrin I'm sure of the "spiritual" golfers here.  But the real reason we play fast?  mainly because our wives will have our you know whats in a sling if we're gone any longer.  We're all mid-late 30's, have at least one child, and jobs that require us to be tethered either by customer or boss demands.  No phone or email--no (or at least very little) weekday golf. 

Weekend golf?  totally different story.



Paul OConnor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #73 on: January 17, 2011, 01:18:40 PM »
"But the real reason we play fast?  mainly because our wives will have our you know whats in a sling if we're gone any longer."

Dude, you need to get control of your life!

JR Potts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Do IPhones Impact Golf's Future?
« Reply #74 on: January 17, 2011, 01:21:15 PM »
Yep.

Sounds like we will get along great.

The only difference is, I always take a caddy so I can occassionally talk on the phone or email while walking and so he can hold my phone while I hit...and occassionally participate in the conference call while I'm putting.  :)

In fact, I'll be willing so say that my phone has actaully caused my golf to speed up as sometimes you have to do the patented drop phone, lash at golf ball, and pick up phone in under one second so as not to disrupt the current conversation.    

And you're 100% right about weekend golf - or golf as a guest (unless given consent to use phone).

EDIT - and Paul, you posted while I was typing.  I think I can speak for Jason - WE HAVE NO CONTROL.

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