[Adam Clayman]

On another thread the concept of beating the course versus an opponent came up. So, I'll start a discussion on what Beating the course means.

"Beating" may not have been the proper term, but I'm even more simplistic than Joe Hancock, so let's all assume I really meant something closer to overcoming.

To me, 'beating' means figuring out (and executing) what needs to be overcome. One part is the elements and the grounds and features, or, a combination of both.  The other part is the five inches betwix one's ears.

An important aspect to a quality golf experience, is how that challenge can change from day to day, even hour to hour. That's the core of my personal disdain for an everyday soft mushy canvas that most American non-thinking golfers prefer. In my mind, courses should only be soft and mushy after rains have made it so.

TePaul called me out on my inability to see how a newer golfer could care about beating the other players in a group versus overcoming the golf course. My only response is that if it is a great big world why is my version questioned?  Seriously though, in my growing up playing golf, when just golfing, I never considered my worth any greater or less because of how one scored on a hole or course. To paraphrase the words of DLII, You aren't how you golf.

[Joe Hancock]

Adam,

Thanks for posting on this.

If you're stating that beating the course is synonymous with "unlocking the design keys" to, at the very least, know what shot needs to be executed for success, I agree.

But, for me it all comes back to the sport of golf and having an opponent, in human form, to take the beating. I put the knowledge of shot requirements in the category of weapons available to sound defeat your enemy....your human opponent.

To play match play is to have an arsenal of weaponry at your disposal. At times, this allows the golfer of less physical skill to win a match against a stronger opponent.

If I were to compose a list of available weapons most useful in match play of pre-modern era of golf, it might look something like this, in no particular order:

Physical ability/ stamina
Ability to understand the effects of the ground on the impending shot
Ability to read and compensate for the wind
Ability to read and compensate for grain on the greens
Ability to control emotions and their effects on the golf swing
Ability to understand and utilize the rules to gain an advantage
Ability to call an opponent on any rules infraction
Ability to know when to be aggressive or conservative
Etc....

Joe

[Anthony Gray]

  Good topic Adam.

  Playing good to great golf is overrated much like correct spelling. One of the things that makes golf great is that it can be enjoyed without emphasis on performance.

  Anthony

[Charlie Goerges]

Adam, I have a similar, though different, idea of "beating" the course. Unlike Joe, I've not played much if any match play golf.

I look at it in two very different lights. Competative and contemplative.

Competetive: When I played in highschool, we were concerned with either having the lowest individual score, or the lowest team score. Our coach always told us to "play the course, not the other players". It was a conservative approach, but I understand it.

Contemplative: The majority of my other rounds have been either quasi-practice rounds, or all-by-myself fun rounds. The second of these applies I think. But in that case I was really trying to beat my own best score more often than unlocking the course so to speak.


Lastly, I'd like to say that your conception of beating the course is a very enlighted way to play the game. I hope to get enough non-scramble rounds this year to try and take that viewpoint when playing.

good stuff

[JESII]

Adam,

Do you enjoy making a birdie?

[Adam Clayman]

Joe and others, I don't have time right now, but on one point i'm certain.
 The scoring aspects playing against human opponents, leads down that "Game Mind" road fast.

The sport is overcoming the physical world and mental self.

If Ken Lewis would shut up I can return this thread.

[Adam Clayman]

Sully,
 When I make a birdie, I don't dance around. If that's what you mean?. Heck, I like to stay composed and I usually don't even smile until some time has gone by or someone makes a comment about either the birdie or my lack of reaction to it. I do the same thing when I drag a pot in a poker game, or, lose to a bad beat. I enjoy the sport. I like to win. But I also like being out played, or in golf, taught a lesson.

It's my thinking,,, concentrating on the other guy, or caring what he thinks, is not productive to the task at hand. Should I care what the fish(or deer) thinks? Or try to think like them, figuring out how to bag them?

Same is true with a golf hole. On a great golf hole, the thought process is the same, but the tactics (and satisfaction from overcoming) is always changing.

I think there's lots to be learned when one looks at this sport in a context outside of score.

[Charlie Goerges]

I've no conception of the answer Adam, but it's often said that the match play mentality is a better way to play the game than the medal play or "card and pencil" mentality. It seems to me that according to your theory, it doesn't really matter which you choose, they are similar enough and that the only really different mentality is in trying to "beat" or overcome the course. Is my characterization anywhere near correct in your estimation? I'm just trying to get a grip on it.

[JESII]

But Adam, you're still trying to shoot the f***ing deer...you're not there to pet the damn thing.

[Joe Hancock]

I think there's lots to be learned when one looks at this sport in a context outside of score.

Precisely why I enjoy the competition in Match Play format.

To be clear, I don't view golf as a game that HAS to be played against an opponent. It is how I most prefer to play, but not the only way. I become more engaged to the entire game.....the course, the company, the concentration...when I am actually trying to accomplish something while playing.

Joe

[Tom Huckaby]

I would just ask this:

is there really any ONE WAY to best enjoy this sport/game?

Seems to me it's all good... a Bible passage and Byrds song comes to mind....

[Joe Hancock]

I would just ask this:

is there really any ONE WAY to best enjoy this sport/game?

Seems to me it's all good... a Bible passage and Byrds song comes to mind....

No harm in identifying personal preferences, is there?

Joe

[Anthony Gray]

I would just ask this:

is there really any ONE WAY to best enjoy this sport/game?

Seems to me it's all good... a Bible passage and Byrds song comes to mind....

   

  On the course there is a time to laugh and a time to cry....Well done Mr Huckaby.

 

[Tom Huckaby]

Of course there is zero harm in stating personal preferences.

I remain curious, however, how far anyone takes this.

How about this:  a village idiot once said "I could have fun playing golf on a parking lot, if the friends are good and the beer is cold."  Comment?

[Anthony Gray]

How about this:  a village idiot once said "I could have fun playing golf on a parking lot, if the friends are good and the beer is cold."  Comment?

  That village idiot has the "spirit of the game" in his marrow.

  Anthony

[Joe Hancock]

Of course there is zero harm in stating personal preferences.

I remain curious, however, how far anyone takes this.

How about this:  a village idiot once said "I could have fun playing golf on a parking lot, if the friends are good and the beer is cold."  Comment?

Sounds like the village idiot is smart enough to identify what he/ she enjoys, and state it. Who am I to tell him/ her what not to enjoy? I also think there are many Proverbs addressing the issues involved with arguing with idiots.....

Joe

[Tom Huckaby]

Anthony:  well, not according to Melvyn.

Joe:  that was good! But you miss the point.  Said idiot is not stating his preference, but rather commenting on the game as a whole.  He also tends to enjoy all that Adam does, at different times and different places. He just remains curious if anyone takes it so far as to NOT enjoy the "other side" from whatever his preference might be... and also if he finds any preferred form of enjoyment to be a superior way to go about things.... the idiot sure doesn't.

 

[Adam Clayman]

Where did this 'one way' to look at it come from?  Charlie. I'll get back to you didn't mean to ignore.   

[Tom Huckaby]

Where did this 'one way' to look at it come from?  Charlie. I'll get back to you didn't mean to ignore.   

Just asking, Adam.. in fact my obtuse posts here are pretty much asking the same questions Charlie did. 

So may we assume you do not look at this one way you've stated to approach the game as the only way or the superior way?

And also, care to comment on the village idiot's take? Is he an idiot for enjoying beating the course (as you state) AND just playing for playing's sake, course be damned, as the statement implies if not outright states?

[RJ_Daley]

It seems to me that golf is so great because it gives you the variety of all sorts of opponents, or none at all. 

You can play golf with your own mind as the primary opponent.   
You can play golf with the course as your opponent.
You can play golf with one or multiple opponents, including a whole field in your tournament.
You can play with nothing but a walk and a series of hit and find and hit again, no opponent.

Or you can play with any combination of the above.

I most often play with a couple of these opponents at a time.   I always have my own self to overcome in terms of game-course management, ego or timidity on various shot challenges.   I usually have a match or fellow playing competitor opponents, even if it is a quarter skins game, $2 nassau or whatever. 

The course is often one of my co-playing competitors.  Particularly, if it is a course I am intimately familiar with. 

I know if I beat the course when even if all the other playing competitors have beaten me, I can still say I shot my handicap or a number that is appropriate for that day's conditions, and I did it with some skill, knowledge of how the course plays and execute a percentage of the time that yields a score in relation to my handi.

It doesn't always have to be about that score relative to the handi or the number approriate for that day's conditions, but I do have that concept in mind more often than not as a desire to beat the course.  I can play mindlessly with no opponent at times.  Or some say I do that all the time.... 

[Adam Clayman]

Charlie, Huck, The match v. stroke play differences in mindset might be corollary. Par or birdie shouldn't matter, if overcoming the elements, and yourself, to make what is at that moment a great score. Who cares what the aggregate is? Learning the little things, about yourself and the golf courses. during the contemplative rounds, should be helpful during the competitive. However, it is necessary to be aware and receptive to these lessons and then trust them when the situation arises.

Sully, I'm more satisfied with a birdie if the wind is blowing 35 MPH in my face, or, I have some other massive obstacle to overcome.  Round here they have different seasons for different weapons.
The main deer season where any average Joe can shoot one with a regular rifle is like American Golf. Every Tom Dick and Butthead is out there. During Muzzle loader season the numbers are much fewer. And Bow season, even fewer. Who do you think the real sportsmen are? 

 

 

[RJ_Daley]

Sully, I'm more satisfied with a birdie if the wind is blowing 35 MPH in my face, or, I have some other massive obstacle to overcome.  Round here they have different seasons for different weapons.
The main deer season where any average Joe can shoot one with a regular rifle is like American Golf. Every Tom Dick and Butthead is out there. During Muzzle loader season the numbers are much fewer. And Bow season, even fewer. Who do you think the real sportsmen are? 

Well sure, who isn't more satisfied with the birdie in the teeth of a gale.  Or, even figuring out how to play the shot down stream of a big wind, evaluating the right altered club distance, trajectory, getting it stopped or running it along the ground in the most advantageous manner.

But, the analogy of the gun hunting season, muzzle loader or bow is only appropos of golf if we are talking about a bag full of techno-new toys, a traditional older club player (like perssimons and blades and no hybrid in place of 3-4 irons, and the most extreme hickory shaft players.  Seasonal weather is more a matter of knowing the architecture and your game, regardless of the era of equipment. 

I wonder if one could break down the question of 'beating the course' if you want to take it to the individual hole basis, rather than the whole course and its architecture.  Then, would equalling or beating par or your handi on the hole if you get a stroke, be 'beating the course'?  Which par of holes might be more satisfying to make par or beat it? 

Making par might be more satisfying on a par 3 whereas making birdie might be more satisfying on a par 4, and making eagle 3 more so on a par 5... IF you take the lucky shot of an ace, albatrose for long shot for eagle2 on a par 5 or long shot eagle on par 4,  out of the equaton.  When, you actually had to get to the best position on the green in reg with a plan and make a putt, rather than dunk one from a ways away off the green, might be more satisfying.  So, you might like you have 'beaten the course' with a well planned out birdie, or par on individual holes, it seems to me.

have a good plan, Stan...

[Adam Clayman]

I'm not convinced score in relation to par is germane. Score in relation to the specific Situation might be. I can recall making scores higher than par that were remarkable scores considering where I was prior to holing out.   Dick. I'm not a hunter but it seems the guy who uses the old equipment needs to be much more aware of the elements and their own limitations then the guy with the laser sighted howitzer.

[Joe Hancock]

Adam,

I think your hunting analogy is more along these lines:

The old timer goes looking for signs of the animal, learning it's tendencies and habitat.  He learns to do the things necessary to remain undetected.....odor control, position in relation to wind, noise control, invisibility, etc. He is truly a stalker.

He is patient, and waits for the most opportune time to make a quick, sure kill.

Unlike the modern hunter, who builds a small enclosure somewhere easy to get to by car or truck, places food in the area several weeks before hunting season, then engages in target practice on opening day, without any knowledge or skill whatsoever.

Joe

[Tom Huckaby]

Learning the little things, about yourself and the golf courses. during the contemplative rounds, should be helpful during the competitive. However, it is necessary to be aware and receptive to these lessons and then trust them when the situation arises.

Now that is a GREAT thought and very very true.  Well said, Adam.  I get you much better now.

TH

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