[Jeff_Mingay]

John,

It's important to note that the 6th green is not original, Thompson. It's one of (at least) a few greens there, at Cap., that have been significantly redone. 11 and 14 are two others. And, I've always suspected 13 is not original... though, I could be wrong.

[Bob Jenkins]

Jeff,

The 14th green was wiped out when the adjacent stream overflowed about 20 years ago if I recall correctly. I do not know about 11.

Likewise 6 was damaged at one point in time (cannot recall when) but I understand the rebuilt green complex, including the depression in front, are not unlike what Thompson originally designed. I have a copy of the hard cover history of Capilano at home and there is very little description of the course included in the book. Mostly talk of early tournaments and the story of how Thompson was retained, lots of his correspondence, etc. It would have been good to get more course information.

Sean, we have not met but I gather you are in the UK and it has puzzled me as to why the Red Wings "flying wheel" appears on your posts. I agree there could always be some thinning of the trees but trees in themselves are not bad. We get a lot of rain here and even more up on the mountains where Cap is located. Large areas devoid of trees would be totally out of place. At Capilano the trees:
   -  rarely come into play. Fairways are wide. Sean's wild duck hooks on the first 3 holes that day were saved by the trees but he knows he had no business being over where he was.
   -  the trees really frame the fairways well and with the views, not onlly of the City below, but on the back nine of the mountain tops behind, give Cap a special feel. See 15-18 in particular.
   -  some of the later holes will show how wide open portions of the course are.

On another point, the clubhouse, especially the men's lounge, is unbelievable. Great feel and history to the place.

Bob Jenkins

[Jeff_Mingay]

Bob,

Don't take this as gospel but, for whatever reasons, 6, 11 and 14 greens were redone by Les Furber and co., as I understand.

I'm not entirely sure about 6, but I'm certain 11 and 14 are not faithful reproductions of Thompson's work. And I really have my doubts about 6 as well.

[John Mayhugh]

John,

It's important to note that the 6th green is not original, Thompson. It's one of (at least) a few greens there, at Cap., that have been significantly redone. 11 and 14 are two others. And, I've always suspected 13 is not original... though, I could be wrong.

Thanks for the comment.  I'm not very familiar with the details of Capilano's evolution, so anything you could add would be great.

[Bob Jenkins]

Jeff,

Les Furber's website does say that he did do a re-model of 3 holes at Capilano. If he did remodel the green complex on 6, he certainly had Thompson in mind, what with the "islands" of grass in the left front bunker which were, from what I know, a feature Stanley Thompson loved to incorporate.

Re 13, the green is built into the hillside and I do not recall the bunkers if any but if they are their, I do not recall them being in play. The whole idea, as I understand that holes, is to be able to carry the gully in front of the green and not be too long. A chip back down and onto the green has a great chance of going long and over the edge. It does not seem to have been tinkered with but I could be wrong.

I just sent an email to a long time member of Cap to see what he recalls and I will let you know what I find out.  Thanks for your input.

Bob

[Bill_McBride]

#13 was the most unusual hole on the course, a little out of place or out of context but worked to get back up toward the clubhouse.

[Jeff_Mingay]

There simply seems to be something a bit odd -- and un-Thompson-like -- about the 13th green. It's shallow and wide, kinda like something Mike Strantz would do. Not Stanley Thompson.

Again, though, I'm not entirely certain about the history of this particular hole.

[Ian Andrew]

Gents,

I worked on Capilano with Doug Carrick for quite a few years.

Some things that I know:

1. The course drops 400 feet from the 1st tee to the 6th green. I have the contour drawings for the property.

2. The bunkers between the 4th green and the 12th were all one bunker built around that enormous cedar stump.

3. The course was cut out of an old growth forest which I’ve posted pictures of in the past. Many of the 4-5 foot stumps can still be seen between the holes.

3. Jeff is correct on the greens, and none match the originals. A picture of the 14th, and its three tier green is in the clubhouse.

4. Over a 5 year period most of the course has been slit drained and sand capped to deal with the excessive rainfall it receives. The conditioning has really improved, first through Dennis and then through Adam.

5. There already was a major tree removal program about 5 years ago for sunlight. They took down what they could using sun studies.

6. The irrigation system has NO pumps. Its water is collected from a mountain stream by a 12” pipe made from cedar planks! The water goes to a shallow pond to be warmed, and to a second pond to be stored. That goes to the golf course (right under a house) and the entire watering system works using gravity for pressure.



Sean,

The course is surrounded by large beautiful houses all the way around and many of them would be in danger without the thick stand of trees along the edges. The corridors are larger than they look because the trees are taller than you may think looking at the pictures. It’s not as congested as you may first think.

As for the species – there is a greater mix than you think, but its all conifers (shades of deep green). That’s what naturally grows here – after all this is on the side of a mountain that gets an enormous amount of rain.

[Garland Bayley]

Bill

You didn't answer the question! 

It sounds like you folks are saying there is nothing which can be done about the mono stands of trees. If this is the case, more is the pity.  At least in the pix and imo, they really detract from the aesthetics of the course.  I reckon the place would have to be a cracker for folks to overlook this glaring issue - which let me make it clear, has nothing to do with the playability of the course.   


Ciao

Sean

Sean,

I think one of your major assumptions as indicated by this post is wrong. These are not "mono" stands of trees. There are at least Douglas fir, western red cedar, and big leaf maple in a brief look through the pictures. The course was cut out of a natural old growth forest, and I believe it would have all the variety of such a forest.

Your criticism to me sounds like saying the Rocky Mountains in the US are ugly, because all you see are ponderosa pine trees. Of course once you get up close to any old growth area, you see all the natural biodiversity that is there.

Not only nothing can be done about the stands of trees, nothing should be done.

You people in the BI. Your golf courses would be decent if only it weren't for all the mono dune culture.

[Sean_A]

Bill

You didn't answer the question! 

It sounds like you folks are saying there is nothing which can be done about the mono stands of trees. If this is the case, more is the pity.  At least in the pix and imo, they really detract from the aesthetics of the course.  I reckon the place would have to be a cracker for folks to overlook this glaring issue - which let me make it clear, has nothing to do with the playability of the course.   


Ciao

Sean

Sean,

I think one of your major assumptions as indicated by this post is wrong. These are not "mono" stands of trees. There are at least Douglas fir, western red cedar, and big leaf maple in a brief look through the pictures. The course was cut out of a natural old growth forest, and I believe it would have all the variety of such a forest.

Your criticism to me sounds like saying the Rocky Mountains in the US are ugly, because all you see are ponderosa pine trees. Of course once you get up close to any old growth area, you see all the natural biodiversity that is there.

Not only nothing can be done about the stands of trees, nothing should be done.

You people in the BI. Your golf courses would be decent if only it weren't for all the mono dune culture.

Garland

You are quite correct, I obviously exaggerated my claim.  That said, the biggest feature displayed in the pix are green walls.  Its not my bag.  Luckily, I didn't pay for the bag so all is right with the world!

Yours Sincerely

Sean Duneland Arble AKA Bunkerman

[John Mayhugh]

The 7th hole is a 430 yard par 4.  The hole curves slightly to the right and the fairway slopes from left to right.  It's about 200 yds to the bunker complex on the left and 230 to get past it entirely.


The bunker on the left side is about 60 yds short of the green.  The only purpose of this bunker seems to be to keep you out of the stand of trees.  We're also heading back uphill here.


I wish I had taken another photo closer to the green.  The green is pretty narrow and not an easy target.


The 8th hole parallels the 7th and shares the large bunker complex on the left size.  The 8th is pretty level and only 370 yards. I liked how the tee shot on the 7th called for a fade and the 8th for a draw.  It's about 220 yards to get to the bunkers where the fairway begins to narrow.  At 250 yds from the tee the fairway is probably only 20 yds wide. 


This photo was taken maybe 180 yards from the tee.  Note the narrowing of the fairway and the mounding around the bunker on the left side.


From 140 out, you see a lot of sand.  The bunker on the left was huge, beginning maybe 30 yards from the green.


The 9th hole is named "Bunker Hill."  175 yards and very uphill, with 42 feet elevation change from tee to green.  The tee signs at Cap are great.


Here's the view from the tee. Lots of bunkers here, but they are mostly short of the green. The green is at a diagonal to the tee, making club selection even more difficult.  Unfortunately, I didn't take photos closer to the green.....probably trying to catch my breath.

[Ryan Chin]

I have had the great fortune to have played Cap many times over the past 12 years. Some observations:

- The member's first tee makes #1 play about 450. For some tournaments, part of the putting green becomes the 1st tee - playing the 472 printed on the card. Makes for some kind of nervy tee shot, 20 feet from your competition, especially with trees on both sides!
- The green on #7 is world-class. At the end of what was the longest par 4 on the course, and uphill no less, a green about 40 yards long and about 10! yards wide, heavily guarded on the left by a steep slope and right by a bunker, then trees from which you cannot recover from. It's pretty flat though.
- #15 - 18: the toughest finish I can remember. #15: 430 yds, dogleg left, fairway sloping right, uphill approach to a raised green guarded front right. Best tee shot: a hard hook for a good angle. #16: 240 yds, flat and usually a 3 wood within view of the clubhouse behind. #18: 580 yds, split fairway for the 2nd shot, the tiny right fairway affords a view down the length of the green and some depth perception to the enormous, flat raised green - which has to be the largest on the course. Otherwise a semi-blind pitch! The view from the back of 18 green is phenomenally satisfying. You can sense how difficult the topography would have been to negotiate for Thompson back in the 1920s.
- Though very wet in the shoulder seasons, the city forced the club to build their own water reservoir and not take from the city's supply causing severe drought-like conditions at times during the summer.
- The downstairs men's grill, which is technically in the locker room, is killer.

Easily the finest course in my home province of B.C. And I'm a member elsewhere in the city, thankfully the interclubs allowed me to play there alot.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Ryan,

Not only is 15-18 a tough stretch, it's an amazingly good stretch of golf. Four QUALITY holes. Looking forward to this four hole finish at Capilano is a neat psychological component of a round there.

The men's grill is cool, too... overlooking the beautiful par-3 16th, with beautiful snow capped mountains in the distance. Awesome spot! No doubt.

[John Mayhugh]

The 10th at Capilano is 424 yards, but since elevation from tee to green is about 50 feet it plays as a member's par 5.  The hole doglegs left slightly and most of the uphill portion of the hole seems to be on the approach.  The bunker that you see on the right is within 100 yards of the green.  The fairway slopes left to right.


Each of the bunkers end short of the green.  There is a pretty steep drop-off from the right rear portion of the green.


The 11th is 164 yards and a little uphill.  It's pretty much an island green with either bunkers or water all around.  The water stops about 10 yards short of the green, but balls can easily roll back in.


The 12th is 362 yards and doglegs to the right.   The ideal tee shot is around 220-230 and carries the bunker on the right.  The carry is probably 180. 


Not visible in this photo is a narrow creek at the bottom of the hill about 80 yards from the green.  Sean Arble is sure to admire the large stumps to the right of the green.    The fourth green is also just visible to the right.

[John Mayhugh]

The 13th is a dogleg right par 4 of just under 400 yards. I failed to take a picture of the tee shot.  The best look at the green is from the left side, but anything in the fairway gives you a pretty open approach.  The approach carries a pretty deep gully, but it's just grass down there if you come up short.  The hole is notable for being the only one on the course without a bunker. 




This is the green from behind.  If you're going to miss, right or long is your best bet.


The 14th is a 150 yard par 3 that is very much downhill.  Capilano's website says that tee to green elevation change is 25 feet, but it seems like much more.  Given the downhill nature of the hole and the way the green is protected, it's a tough short iron tee shot.  The tee shot also carries the entrance road.


The 15th is 424 yards and is a slight dogleg left.  The trees encroach on the left side tee shot just a little bit and tend to point you toward the right side.  There is more room left after you get past the first few trees you see in front of the tee, but it doesn't feel that way standing there.


The left side of the fairway slopes down toward the middle, so you can get a nice bounce if you manage to keep the tee shot left.  The bunkers to the right begin about 60 yards short of the green and protect that side all the way up.

[John Mayhugh]

The 16th is a 245 yard par 3.  The green is surrounded on the back and sides by bunkers, but open on the front to a running shot on the correct line.  The fairway bunker you see on the right side begins about 175 yards from the tee and ends 30 yards short of the green.  This adds a little more interest to the running shot.  Anything pulled will end up in the left bunkers which start around 200 yds from the tee and continues to the side of the green. There is also a small creek running along the right side of the hole that cannot really be seen in the pictures due to the trees.





Note the clubhouse in the background.  Outside of the men's grille is a great place to sit.




The 17th is another long hole, just under 440 yds.  The first of bunkers on the right are only 170 yards from the tee and not really in play.  The fairway bunkers in the distance are right at 300 yds.


This green is rather well protected.  A group of trees pinch into the fairway just short of the green while the right side is guarded by a bunker.  Tee shots that are very far to either side of the fairway require curved approaches to. 


This green is pretty small given the length of the hole.


Capilano finishes with a par 5.  At 556 yards to an elevated green, it's a true three shot hole.  The first challenge is the tee shot, where there are fairway bunkers on each side at about 240 yds. All you can see from the tee is the desired landing area.
 

The second shot is uphill and pretty much blind. It's best to play to the left side to avoid bunkers. 


The green is elevated.  Anything short is dead.


This is from the green looking back to the fairway.  Note the elevation change.


From just short of the green.




And the green viewed from the right side.


Great finishing holes and a sublime golf experience.  If you ever have the chance to play Capilano, don't miss it.

[Jeff_Mingay]

John's right. Capilano is a really special place.

I'd love to see more trees taken down behind #16 green. It'd be really neat if you could see more of the clubhouse there, high on the hill behind.

[Bill_McBride]

That's a great finishing four holes.   They are the only holes in that area behind the clubhouse so it feels very private.  Too bad it was so cloudy that day, as I recall there are mountain peaks centered in the 15th and 17th fairways, a beautiful sight.

Nice write up, John, thanks for the great photos and thoughtful tour.

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