[Brian Noser]

I am just curious how many of us play at an architectural good/great course regularly. No naming names this is just to see how many of us play somewhere that you feel strategy REALLY plays a part in how you play the course. Most people on here that preach strategy, strategy. Do you have to use it weekly/daily or do have to get your architecture fix elsewhere. Just trying to figure out how often we as a group actually get to practice what we preach.

I personally play at a little rinky dink 6000 yard course with a group of guys and have a great time par is 71 the rating id 67,  there is no architectual merit really at all. I just hit driver on every hole and hit it as far as I can. So I find my self searching St. Louis for courses of interst every so often, which does not happen often!

[Tom Huckaby]

My beloved Santa Teresa requires very little in the way of strategic choices; tee shots on 11 and 12, sometimes 15.  But other than that it's bash away.  There is little in the way of architectural merit.  The greens are fantastic though, almost Pajaro-like.  And it's a good group of guys.  So if I have a home, that's it.

THis is kinda why I seek out courses that DO offer strategic choices... I think in the end that's more fun.

TH

[Andy Troeger]

I can't even really claim to have a home course. I'm trying to think, but I'm not sure I've played anyplace more than once all year, which is odd by now even for me. Almost all of my golf this year has been either when I'm travelling myself or someone comes to visit. Otherwise its not been worth the frustration and expense unfortunately.

[Adam Clayman]

Brian, Currently I play both.
 I've been fortunate to play a lot of places, frequently. The result has been a deeper appreciation for all types of courses, but, the real benefit... being able to tell the difference. Without the mediocre, distinguishing the quality would be almost impossible.

[Tom Huckaby]

Brian, Currently I play both.
 I've been fortunate to play a lot of places, frequently. The result has been a deeper appreciation for all types of courses, but, the real benefit... being able to tell the difference. Without the mediocre, distinguishing the quality would be almost impossible.

Adam - so very well said - and therein lies the weakness in every argument made by Pat Mucci, but most particularly the one that would have us believe Spanish Bay sucks.

TH

[John Kavanaugh]

I can't even really claim to have a home course. I'm trying to think, but I'm not sure I've played anyplace more than once all year, which is odd by now even for me. Almost all of my golf this year has been either when I'm travelling myself or someone comes to visit. Otherwise its not been worth the frustration and expense unfortunately.

Andy,

Haven't you played any courses this year that you have liked.  Why so many one play and outs?  What new courses have you seen in 07 and 08?

[Dan Herrmann]

I actually joined my club solely due to the architectural merits of the course, which was still dirt when I joined.   It's been open for 5 years now, and it's getting better every year.

Yes, the architecture keeps each and every round interesting and fun.    

[Dale_McCallon]

Brian,

My home course and yours sound similar--even though mine is a bit longer, it is by no means a great course.  I think  most peoples home course the strategy element is eliminated by familiarity.  I'm sure a course with greens with a lot of movement or  a course in a windy area have to think around the course much more.

Probably the only time I really think about a strategy is when I miss my drive and have to come up with some type of recovery shot.  Then I will think about where I can hit it to give me the best chance for an up and down.

BTW, is that the Webster Univ emblem on your sign-in?  Isn't it called a Gorlock?

[RJ_Daley]

I have only played 3 different courses this year from my home course.  It has been a slow spring with weather, gas and now back severely hampering play.

The home course is solid with some strategy options beyond hit it straight or draw or fade it.  The greens are sufficiently contoured, and well bunkered, though the wide collars between bunker and green surface for easier mowing.  It held the State Am field to over par for 4 days, except the winner at -1.  The back tees are just 6800 and we play it at 6450.  It is all I can handle and at those tees rates at 70.8 128,  back tees 72.1 133.  So it is no pushover.

Most of my pals play it 3-6X a week.  None of them feel complelled to seek new pastures and don't get bored here.  So, that says something.

[Brian Noser]

Dale,

Yes it is, very observant of you, and it is a gorlock. How would you know that??

[Dale_McCallon]

Brian,

My wife went there for a year and loved it, but it just became too much of a financial burden on her parents.  But she has driven me around the campus several times and I've always thought the mascot was pretty funny.

[Andy Troeger]

I can't even really claim to have a home course. I'm trying to think, but I'm not sure I've played anyplace more than once all year, which is odd by now even for me. Almost all of my golf this year has been either when I'm travelling myself or someone comes to visit. Otherwise its not been worth the frustration and expense unfortunately.

Andy,

Haven't you played any courses this year that you have liked.  Why so many one play and outs?  What new courses have you seen in 07 and 08?

John,
There have been quite a few good ones but with most of them being on trips playing multiple rounds sometimes works better than others. I've played courses this year that I had played multiple times before (Paa-Ko Ridge, Arroyo del Oso in New Mexico, Warren at Notre Dame, Point O'Woods), so its not like I've never seen any of them, I just haven't played multiple times this year. Others, like the courses at Promontory in Utah, Butterfield Trail in El Paso, and a few in Arizona were courses I was rating for GD. Paa-Ko and Point O'Woods would be my two favorites for the year so far, with Promontory's Dye Course and Desert Highlands in AZ being the two best new additions.

[Carl Rogers]

As stated previously on this site, I live 10 minutes from Riverfront in Suffolk, Virginia (having serious and profound strategy and merit) and 2 minutes from Sleepy Hole (having more merit than one might think).

I am very lucky.

[George Pazin]

As stated previously on this site, I live 10 minutes from Riverfront in Suffolk, Virginia (having serious and profound strategy and merit) and 2 minutes from Sleepy Hole (having more merit than one might think).

I am very lucky.

I'd love to hear more of your thoughts on Riverfront.

[Jim Franklin]

I belong to a very nice Tillinghast design that is more fun everytime I play it.

[Bart Bradley]

I belong to a very nice Tillinghast design that is more fun everytime I play it.

Similarly, I belong to a course that I learn more about strategy every time I go out.  I still haven't figured out the best way for me to play the course...I currently hit 4-6 drivers per round.  It is definitely not a no-brainer.

Bart

[CJ Carder]

As stated previously on this site, I live 10 minutes from Riverfront in Suffolk, Virginia (having serious and profound strategy and merit) and 2 minutes from Sleepy Hole (having more merit than one might think).

I am very lucky.

Definitely don't sleep on Sleepy Hole, particularly after the renovation a few years ago.  Carl, are they still keeping it in decent shape?

[Dave Givnish]

I joined my club in Arizona because of the architecture.  Loved it when I joined and appreciate it more now.  Turns out that the members are the better part of the equation.

We also play at Farmington in Charlottesville, VA.  This course is a really enjoyable par 70 track that doesn't get a lot of respect because it wasn't designed by a "name". 

My measure of a well-designed club course is one that you wouldn't get tired of playing several times a week.  How I play the course should vary with the weather conditions, the seasons, and my ability that day (or lack thereof). 

Dave

[Carl Rogers]

CJ,
Sleepy Hole is in very good condition ... at least the greens are.  The fairways are very very firm and fast right now (and sometimes threadbare), coupled with a number of doglegs that create a lot of forced fades and draws to keep out the trees.  That is the major challenge of the course and then there is holding the several elevated greens.  The course is interesting how it weaves in and out of tree lined to open areas which at times makes play in the wind interesting.  The 18th hole at Sleepy Hole is monster by anyone's definition.

Mr. Pazin,
The reason why I asked the moderators to join this site is a thread a while back titled something like (I think), 'Tom Doak's lesser known courses'.  Riverfront gave something to talk about that I knew something about.  In my golfing life, I have had only a sporadic  and limited opportunity to travel to play.  It was Riverfront the got me interested in GCA, because of its subtletly, themes and variations (by trade I am an architect as in buildings, as a golfer I am a mid single digit handicapper).  By the third time I had played it, I realized this was a very different course than any I had ever come across.
At multiple times in the past on various threads discussing relevant themes, i have chimed in on how Riverfront relates to this or that topic.  I can send you a bunch of pics on a cd if you want.  Each hole has a whole lot to talk about.
The reputation of Riverfront will probably always suffer because of the ever present housing development on many holes, but given the goat pastures disguised as golf courses I grew up on, Riverfront is like going to heaven without having to die first.

[John_Conley]

I play anywhere and everywhere, which will be evident when my entry for "My Home Course" makes its way onto the site.

[John Moore II]

My main club (I actually work at 2, but rarely play the other one) has quite a bit of strategy involved in playing, as I found out yesterday when I played. Sometimes, I missed shots by no more than 4-5 yards and was in real jail. And there are many, many times where the options involve hitting shorter for a better line or longer for the shorter shot and many different angles, etc. While I will will say I do not work at the greatest architectural club in Pinehurst, mine is quite nice and able to work with many different strategies.

[PCCraig]

While in no way shape or form was I entitled to call this my "home club," I sure felt like I spent enough time at TCC-Brookline last summer to call it a home course away from home. I would say I caddied it approx. 80 times and played it 25 times (nothing like getting in 36 on a monday afternoon after morning classes.)

[Ken Moum]

I play nearly all my golf at a Ross that has suffered mightily from a lack of $$$ over the years.

I love the place, but most of its greens are tiny and nearly perfectly round and the fairways are now 25-28 yards wide.

Thanks to the genius of our superintendent, we have good conditions except during the hottest, most humid days, which start in late July and extend past Labor Day most years. His budget is 60 percent of what the two local public courses spend, and conditions nearly always better.

It's still a lovely place to play, but there's precious little strategy.

FWIW, I don't think most of us amateurs are good enough to do anything about strategy, but I believe the strategic courses can test the best without beating a 16 handicapper into a bloody pulp.

Ken

[Lou_Duran]

Brian, Currently I play both.
 I've been fortunate to play a lot of places, frequently. The result has been a deeper appreciation for all types of courses, but, the real benefit... being able to tell the difference. Without the mediocre, distinguishing the quality would be almost impossible.

Adam,

This goes along with that without failure there can be no success, or ecstasy without anquish.  Unfortunately, for some raters and other golf critics who get around, the top twenty or so courses seem to become the standard and everyting else pales by comparison.  I've heard numerous delightful, challenging courses savaged by these folks.

ALL golf courses require strategy.  Relatively few golfers have the necessities to take full advantage of even the simplest design (often unitentional) opportuities.  How often do you hear about the ground game and the virtues of firm and fast?  Now, how many golfers do you know who benefit from such conditions?  How many would recognize that opportunity you showed me at Black Mesa and then be able to execute the shot?  I should be thankful that I enjoy all types of course given that these days I am mainly samping from the low end of the range.  Even here, there is much to like.   

[Jed Peters]

I am lucky enough to play on a regular basis what I consider a "great" course, the best in the area.

Even though it's a 35 minute drive from my house when there's a cheaper alternative/private within 2 minutes of my house, I'm glad every time I make the trek because of the fun of the golf course and the design.

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