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Brian Cenci

A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« on: January 09, 2008, 01:52:10 PM »
Recently went with fellow GCA'r Dave Neveux down to Tennessee to play some golf.  We played 4 courses and I supplied my thoughts below.  I'd love to hear others opinions on any of these courses.

Holston Hills - Just love this course as we played it again after first playing it in March of 2007.  Its still my favorite Donald Ross I've ever played (played Pinehurst No. 2, Oakland Hills, Inverness, Pine Needles, Mid Pines, Franklin Hills).  I really don't know what else I can say about it.  Has great variety of holes, love the routing and the bunkering is superb.  It is a very very very underated track that desrves more national attention.

Black Creek - What a great track.  Very impressed with the variety of the course and I felt it was very challengining.  The bunkering style is something that I'm not used to but it worked very well.  Felt the houses surrounding the first 9 holes (and 18th) detracted a little from the feel of the course but hey, its a residential course so that is to be expected.  Overall, a solid course that will provide a different style and feel for most and worth a play if you get a chance to get on.

Lookout Mountain - The pics on this site in the course profile don't do it justice.  We only played 15 holes because of time restraints but from the holes we played (and the rest we did look at) were fun, classic and some great holes.  You can tell that they're working on a tree removal program and it really opens up the course.  Out there I felt the more open the better as some native grass areas were present.  Really liked #2 and the short par 3 #6.  The greens are lightnining out there and the break is some of the most deceptive I've ever played.  Hope we can make a return visit as this is the type of course you need and want to play 10 times to get a feel.

Tennessee National - Nice new modern residential track.  Had two contrasting bunker styles that sometimes worked well on some holes.  Although, at times I felt that I liked the same bunker styles used for each hole (#8 was all sod wall and #10 was all normal finger bunkers) a little better.  Overall a good track with a good mix of holes.  Certainly used all the clubs in the bag.  Haven't played too many Norman tracks but this would certainly spurn my interest in playing a few more.  It is a nice piece of land and overall the course fits it very well.  Definetly worth a play if you can get on and you're in the area.  i'd still like to know what "paste" they used on the sod wall bunkers to make them so hard.

Anyone have any thoughts on these courses, I'd be interested to hear.

-Brian
« Last Edit: January 09, 2008, 02:21:58 PM by Brian Cenci »

PThomas

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Re:A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2008, 02:04:51 PM »
thanks for your thoughts Brian...i was talking to a friend about playing some golf in TN this year and after your review i want to go more than ever!

i thought it was esp. noteworthy that you said Holston is your favorite Ross...of the others you mentioned i've played #2 , Pine N , Mid-  P, and Franklin, so your statement is saying a lot

how much elevation change on the courses you've played??
199 played, only Augusta National left to play!

Brian Cenci

Re:A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2008, 02:11:34 PM »
thanks for your thoughts Brian...i was talking to a friend about playing some golf in TN this year and after your review i want to go more than ever!

i thought it was esp. noteworthy that you said Holston is your favorite Ross...of the others you mentioned i've played #2 , Pine N , Mid-  P, and Franklin, so your statement is saying a lot

how much elevation change on the courses you've played??

They all have a fair amount of elevation change.  Probably Holston or Black Creek (especially the back nine) have the most but Lookout Mountain has a lot too and so does Tenn National.  Now that I think about it they all do.

As far as Holston is compared to other Ross' I've played it just has a greater variety of holes and the bunkering is second to none.

Joey Smith

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Re: A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2008, 10:27:25 PM »
Brian - Nice thoughts on the 4 courses you visited in Tennessee.

I agree with your comments.  Holston Hills is one of my all time favorites.  The members there have been very respectful of the original design.

When you were at Lookout Mountain and Black Creek - you were just minutes from The Honors Course.  The Honors is a must.  Mr. Lupton has done an incredible job with his vision there.  It's a top 10 for sure.

I'm a Tennessean and a new member.  Just wanted to to say hello...
I've only seen one that really stinks...but I seen a lot of really good ones...

Chris Cupit

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Re: A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2008, 11:08:39 PM »
Don't worry Joey, Brian will be playing there very shortly ;)

Tim Bert

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Re: A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2008, 11:22:55 PM »
I grew up on the wrong side of the state (Memphis), so I've never played any of these courses.  I've heard marvelous things about Holston Hills.  It sounds like it has a case for best in the state, though I'd definitely give The Honors Course a look if you have the opportunity (and it sounds like you do.)  That's one of only two course I've played on the east side of the state, and it is absoutely fabulous.  I haven't played a ton of Dye courses, though I have played Bulle Rock and all of the courses at Kohler - I'd take The Honors over any of those.

PS - While I grew up in West Tennessee, I've migrated to the middle of the state after some time away.  It sounds like all the golf course action is in East Tennessee, so it looks like I didn't go quite far enough!

Paul Richards

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Re: A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2008, 11:25:31 PM »
holsten is indeed very special - my first time around it i tied my career best 33 on the back nine there, so it holds an extra-special place in my heart.



black creek is also a lot of fun


"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

David Neveux

Re: A few thoughts on Tenn. courses...
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2008, 02:16:10 AM »
    Playing Holston for a 2nd and 3rd time on this trip was a real treat.  The bunker restoration project, which was completed some time ago, really makes this course look a lot better than in did from the pictures I've seen previous to it's completion.  I cannot comment on the playability, but they really are sharp looking!!  I cannot call it my favorite D. Ross design, I really don't know if I can single one out as a definite favorite.  However, I think the course holds it's own with likes of the Pine Needles, Pinehurst No.2s, and Oakland Hills of the world.  Certainly this design felt closer to a Pine Needles or a Number 2, than Oakland Hills, in terms of FEEL.  Simply a fun, engaging round of Golf, if I could only figure out that 2nd hole????  Sounds to me like a good enough reason for another visit!! ;D

  Lookout Mountain was kind of a dissappointment in my mind, and I'm not talking about the golf but merely the circumstances which limited our round.  I only wish that we could of played the entire course, without rushing to beat the setting sun and on a fresh set of legs which slowed us down a little.  (Not to mention the bonnie situation ;))  The day we played the weather took a turn for the better, unless you weren't prepared to walk 36 holes in the 75 degree heat complete with a shining sun.  I was not.  The course itself however was fantastic, the greens as Brian said were lightning.  We both putted off the first green (up the hill I might add).  The property did have quite a bit of movement elevation wise, and its unique setting a top of a mtn. was like nothing I've ever experienced.  A big thanks to Mark Stovall for setting us up and really treating us to some of the history surrounding the design.  A returned trip has already been discussed and we're hoping to make it back down for a more thorough examination this year. 

     Tennesse National was another pretty good golf course.  I did really enjoy the 3 pars out here as well as the 5 pars.  I couldn't however get over the contrasting bunker sytles.  Occasionally they worked, but I think overall it was a failing attempt.  I can understand why the sod faced bunkers don't work in the fairways, as they would be nearly impossible to advance a ball, as a result turning off a good number of golfers.  However, the contrast looked very awkward in some cases and I'm not usually one to harp on issues like these but for some reason they really did bother me here.  Other than that, the course was certainly enjoyable and I would definitely return for another game.

    The real surprise for me was Black Creek Club.  The style demonstrated here was unlike anything I've ever played.  We had the pleasure of playing the front nine with head pro Todd McKittrick, and he was really able to "show us" around the course.  That especially was useful at the par 5 6th, where a blind shot played to a generous punchbowl style green would of really left us guessing.  I can say that this style (template GC?) was pulled off in a way here that makes me crave more.  If I'm not mistaken I think that Todd said it was the only non- Seth Raynor course to be a member of the Seth Raynor society.  We did get a taste of Raynor later that day at Lookout, but like I said, under the circumstances, I couldn't truly appreciate what I was looking at / playing.  Well done Brian Silva. 

Tennesse seemingly is a great place to play golf.  I can assure you that it was a welcomed relief in the middle of probably the snowiest (is that a word?) winter we've had in Michigan since I've been living.  At a about an 8 hr. drive from Lansing, I can see returning to this state in the coming winters to find a game. 

P.S.  Chris I can't freakin wait!!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.S.S.  We left on a saturday night, around 12:30 a.m.  Drove straight to Tenn. Nat and played 36 holes.  The next day we did 18 Black Creek / 13-14 Lookout.  Third and final day 36 Holston. 

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