[JMorgan]

They live, Man, LIVE!

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Peter, Absolutely, sandy soil. But what would one think of a course built on the scale of a Yale, or Winged Foot which both are in terrains loaded with granite?

Mind you decomposed granite makes some pretty interesting golf too. But your post makes me regret further this year, while in the Spokane area, twice, that my beloved Canon A 70 which had taken so many great trips with me and shot as equally fun shots as I did while golfing my projectile, developed, Neonitis--a brutal and crippling disease for digital cameras where each and every picture has you thinking you just had decided to turn your mind into that of Peter Max. (the pictures literally were flourescent in colors)

What I missed providing was some spectacular terrain which I think could produce a world class golfing experience, not unlike the terrain one would have found in Westchester N.Y., sometime around 1920.

[Gene Greco]

   They grab a part of your soul and NEVER let go.

[Peter Pallotta]

Tommy - sorry to hear that, seriously.

On your question, the reason sandy soil came to mind was because it connected to my other post about the individuality and uniqueness of great courses, in that sandy soil seems to make it easier to create something that's 'site natural', and to subtly move and shape the ground, and to not have to worry as much about drainage (which gives even more flexibiity, I'd imagine, in terms of routing decisions), and even to be able to create really interesting greens and green surrounds more easily and naturally --- all of which factors seem to foster individuality/uniqueness.

I'd guess that building on granite just makes it a heck of a lot harder to pull off.

Peter  

[Tommy Williamsen]

The shots into the greens are fun, demanding, and interesting.  By that, I mean you have to think about where you need to hit the shot and how it should be hit to get close to the hole.  Will the green's slope affect the shot?  Can you run it on?  Does the shot require something high? Where do i need to be just to make par? Where can't I be if I want to at least two putt?

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Absolutely! Sandy soil makes the best golf. But if you saw some of the other dramatic, nautrale qualities of the land of which I speak, I don't think there is an architect alive (or teets up) that wouldn't die to get at it.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Oh, and as far as the camera, things got much better as now I'm playing golf with a Samsung SLR which is pretty cool. I just got to learn how to use it!

[Sam Morrow]

They all generate great conversation?

[Jim Thompson]

irregular undulation

[Jim Thompson]

a benevolent dictatorship  

[Tom_Doak]

Mike:

Only three of the top 100 courses in the world have wall-to-wall cart paths:  Pebble Beach, Riviera, and one other I can't think of right now.

However, all 100 of the top 100 courses are walkable, most of them easily walkable.

[Adrian_Stiff]

The GREAT golf courses all seem to be fairly difficult. They are generally fairly long, they are usually very expensive to play. Par is almost almost always between 70 and 72.

None of those factors should matter really, but they do seem to count.

History also adds to the greatness, very few new courses get accepted quickly.

[Mike_Young]

Mike:

Only three of the top 100 courses in the world have wall-to-wall cart paths:  Pebble Beach, Riviera, and one other I can't think of right now.

However, all 100 of the top 100 courses are walkable, most of them easily walkable.

Tom,
That was what I was trying to get at......I guess I should have phrased it....How many great courses have cart paths?"  Oh well.....

[Bill_McBride]

"Memorability" is the #1 attribute for me.  After I've played a "great" course, I find I can remember the routing and every individual hole very clearly.  By contrast and by example, I can remember only half the holes at World Woods Pine Barrens clearly. Not saying that's not a very good course, it just doesn't meet the "memorability" test of a great course.

Of course as I get a bit older, the memory is less reliable!  

[Ted Kramer]

I would say that "appropriate scale" is something they all have in common. While some are big like Bethpage, others are smaller and more cozy like Merion. I think that the great course know what hey are in terms of scale, and that ability to fit the land/property helps them to be great.

-Ted

[Mark Smolens]

All truly great golf courses make you think -- whether it be in hitting a drive, an approach, a chip, or whatever.  They sometimes make you think about the beauty around them, they may make you think about why in God's name did they put the green over there, but if you can walk (or worse, ride) around a course with your brain turned off, just hitting shots, it's not a great course.

[wsmorrison]

Mike:

Only three of the top 100 courses in the world have wall-to-wall cart paths:  Pebble Beach, Riviera, and one other I can't think of right now.

However, all 100 of the top 100 courses are walkable, most of them easily walkable.

I figured the number was small, but that small?  Wow.  That is something.  How many of these courses without cart paths are walking only (without a doctor's note)?

[Mike Nuzzo]

Mike:

Only three of the top 100 courses in the world have wall-to-wall cart paths:  Pebble Beach, Riviera, and one other I can't think of right now.

However, all 100 of the top 100 courses are walkable, most of them easily walkable.

Tom
Muirfield Village is the third....
Which I got from you -- thank you.
I keep your top 50 analysis close at hand.

[Mike Nuzzo]

Wayne,
Tom's full analysis from the Top 50 in Golf Magazine:

"29 have no cart paths at all (20 of these never allow golf carts);
18 have some cart paths, and
3 have continuous cart paths (Pebble Beach, Muirfield Village, and Riviera)"

- Tom Doak

[Eric Smith]

I have to believe that all or most of all the greats were built on good to great sites.

[Greg Krueger]

I have to say variety, which covers alot. Length of holes,uphill downhill, sidehill, different directions, occasional
blind shots, skyline greens, punch bowl greens, large greens,
small greens, undulating greens, flat greens.................
You have heard the saying "Location, Location, Location,"
I say Variety, Variety, Variety!!

[wsmorrison]

In his youth, Tom Paul debauched a debutant at each club?

[Gary Daughters]

I think Mike and Tom are onto something.  Fascinating.

[JESII]

Wayne,
Tom's full analysis from the Top 50 in Golf Magazine:

"29 have no cart paths at all (20 of these never allow golf carts);
18 have some cart paths, and
3 have continuous cart paths (Pebble Beach, Muirfield Village, and Riviera)"

- Tom Doak

Am I correct in assuming that "never allow golf carts" means except for with a medical reason?

[A.G._Crockett]

In terms of not allowing carts, the reason would have to be great routing on a great site.
In terms of not having cart paths, the reason would have to be sandy soil, which would again come down to a great site.

So I'll go with "a great site" as the answer, with the absence of carts and/or cart paths, as well as the presence great greens, being happy outcomes of the quality of the site.

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