[Bob_Huntley]

Have there ever been more putts sunk from enormous distances than we saw in today's play?

The greens certainly didn't look complex.

Don't get me wrong, I love putting on the greats in Scotland and Ireland and of them all all, Royal Birkdale had the simplest of the lot.

Bob

[Rich Goodale]

Bob

You need to get HDTV!

IMNSHO there were some very interesting slopes in them thar greens, and the speed seemed to be ideally matched to the contours.  Yes, a lot of bombs dropped in the hole, but then a lot of tiddlers went wanting.  I atribute the former to the incredible luck of the GBI side and the latter to lack of proper military training of the Americans.

Rich

[Tom_Doak]

Bob:

I believe Martin Hawtree rebuilt several of the greens at Birkdale before the last Open there, so they may not be as flat as they used to be.  (Haven't seen it since then myself.)

[Brent Hutto]

Which greens at Birkdale were recontoured? I'll be glad to report on the flatness of the redone ones relative to the rest of the course after I play there a week from today. Unfortunately, I hadn't seen the course before the recent reworking.

[John_Cullum]

It certainly appeared that the putts broke very little, although the surrounds looked pretty substantially contoured. It looked like someone went across the putting surfaces with a motor grader and knocked off the contour

[JESII]

I agree that there is not a tremendous amount of internal contouring on the greens at Royal County Down...they seem to be like flat plates tilted in one direction or another...

[Bob_Huntley]

I agree that there is not a tremendous amount of internal contouring on the greens at Royal County Down...they seem to be like flat plates tilted in one direction or another...

JES,

Thank you for your observation. Without HDTV and my own memories of RCD (from a long time ago) the INTERNAL contours loooked quite benign.

The home team sure had some good putters aboard.

Bob

[billb]

Gosh, like RCD isn't tough enough already? We played it in true links weather in the spring of 2000 and it was just brutal. The fact that the greens were straightforward was the only thing that kept us sane. Nothing like a 15 footer for bogey to lift ones spirits!

A couple questions concerning RCD: the 16th is a new hole, does anyone know when it was built? The 15th green looks new also, is it? What other changes if any were made to the golf course? As mentioned above the front 9 is one of the very best 9 holes in the world, was it changed at all?

[Brad Tufts]

I played at RCD two months ago, and I found that the greens, while not simple, were not the focal point of the course.

They do tend to tilt in only one or two directions, and the edges have Pinehurst-style fall-offs (at least Pinehurst-style at half-height of today's #2 green edges).  I found that if you missed a green slightly, the subsequent chips or putts were not difficult to gauge.

Maybe it's just a result of the main focus being the difficult tee shots requiring long carries over aiming rocks, gorse, and whins, or perhaps the greens were always set in the hollows where the flattest ground existed.

To answer Bill's question, I think RCD has been modified no less than 10 times, and there are multiple people on here that have done some research on this stuff.

[JESII]

Bill B,

I do not think Bob or I were suggesting it was a weakness of RCD to have fairly benign greens, just noting it.

Brad laid out a pretty good synopsis of possible explanations...


Brad,

Interesting comment about the ease of guaging chips and putts from off the green...I would agree, but it seems the US side thought it too tight to chip so they putted at every opportunity. I think it must be a good thing in circumstances like the Walker Cup to eliminate as much indecision as possible...but...I thought chipping around there was easy because of the firm, tight turf. No significant difference in how the ball reacts (bounce and spin) from the green to the edge to the approach areas.

[Dave_Miller]

I agree that there is not a tremendous amount of internal contouring on the greens at Royal County Down...they seem to be like flat plates tilted in one direction or another...

JES,

Thank you for your observation. Without HDTV and my own memories of RCD (from a long time ago) the INTERNAL contours loooked quite benign.

The home team sure had some good putters aboard.

Bob

Bob:
Played RCD last October and the contours are not what I would term benign.  They were very challenging with interesting rolls.  Circuit City and Best Buy will be glad to install the HD TV for you
Best
Dave

[Johnny_Browne]

I had the pleasure of being at the Walker Cup and it was a fantastice experience - extremely good golf played in the most part in a really sporting manner.  I think the R&A asked for the greens to be slightly slowed down just before the competition started as there was a danger if the wind blew that some of them could become unplayable.  I think the high quality of the putting (although there was also some very poor putting with quite a few 3 putts from under 15 feet which you would probably not see on TV) was due to a variety of factors -
1. The greens were exceptionally true and all the same speed except for 16.
2. The greens are nicely countoured with only the 13th being markedly countoured.
3. The teams practiced all week on them and so by Saturday knew the speed and the lines well.
4. All the players had good caddies.
5. Match play putting is generally easier than stroke play.
6. Amateurs tend to be more aggressive putters than professionals

Johnny Browne

[JESII]

And I would add to that very good list, Johnny, if I may...

7. the ratcheting up of ones focus in that sort of environment.

[Padraig Dooley]

Johnny

Interesting points, especially 5 and 6.

How is putting easier in matchplay then strokeplay?

The pros that I know are far better and more aggresive putters then most top class amateurs.

[Johnny_Browne]

Paidraig,
I think in match play you have a lot of putts you must hole and do not consider the 2nd putt.  In stroke play you always are more aware of the second putt.  I agree that pros are generally better putters but probably not better than confident (cocky) 18 -22 year olds at the top of their game.
Johnny

[Padraig Dooley]

Johnny

I agree that a lot of golfers have a different mindset in matchplay, but a 10 foot putt is still a 10 foot putt regardless of the situation.

Pros are far better putters then walker cup players, if they were better they would walk on to the tour and win, but that happens very rarely.

[Eric Franzen]

The new re-modelled two tier green at the 17th at Royal Birkdale.

The members that I spoke with before playing wasn't too happy about it. "Out of character" was the general opinion among them.

A better picture can be found at the clubs web site: http://www.royalbirkdale.com/images/Image17.jpg

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