[RJ_Daley]

Dr Bill, that is just it, Paulie Walnuts and all his pals don't pay full freight.  Only chumps do in their world.

Be careful with that expensive gasoline on the fire, use ethanol or even cheap whiskey!  

I see a coalition forming here with Jay and Bill and me; the fair dinkum on the pennisula party.

[David Kelly]

Turnberry is 200 pounds or $397 US to play on a weekend from May 1 - Oct. 1 but you need to stay at the hotel to get a tee time more than 2 weeks in advance.  Rooms start at around $600 US.

[Rick Shefchik]

-That so much "Business golf" is played at PBGL is a national disgrace for the USA

There's one statement I can get behind. Business can be conducted almost anywhere; why do I have to subsidize some corporate exec's round at Pebble Beach?

[Jay Flemma]

Brother William, thank you for having my back.  When good guys like you are happy, I know I did something right.  Huck...we are still buddies even though you think my plane drifted into the wrong airspace.  But as for telling me I shouldn't fight for lower pricing and/or rollbacks, I'm glad to spill my blood in that fight.

Kalen and Tom...alot of what you say makes sense, no question.  but I choose to fight for those that cannot fight this for themselves.  That's what my book is all about, that's what alot of my columns are all about, that's what I'm all about.

Maybe you are right...maybe my love of BM blinds me a bit...but of all the places I could pick - alot of people are saying to themselves "you know what though...that's not a bad one to choose."

I'll trust my hunches.

..and ATTA BOY REDANMAN!

You me and Brother William...Bro william, whaddya say?  Which monk is Bill?  Maybe Michael of Cesena?

[Eric_Terhorst]

I just really do think that the "just say no" policy will straighten this all right out to a rational level, and in no time at all.  Perhaps a year of public golfers just saying no to anything over $200.

Certainly a lot of nonsense to choose from on this thread, but this has to be the topper.  Boycott the high end!  That's the ticket!

RJ Daley, Jay Flemma, and W. Vostinak, just wondering in your dealings with your employers/customers, do you--heaven forbid--charge what the market will bear--or is all your work pro bono?  

RJ Daley's suggestion above reminds me of a song:

"You know, if one person, just one person does it they may think he's really sick and
they won't take him.  And if two people, two people do it, in harmony,
they may think they're both faggots and they won't take either of them.
And three people do it, three, can you imagine, three people walking in
singin a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out. They may think it's an
organization.  And can you, can you imagine fifty people a day,I said
fifty people a day walking in singin a bar of Alice's Restaurant and
walking out.  And friends they may thinks it's a movement.

And that's what it is , the Alice's Restaurant Anti-Massacre Movement"

[Kalen Braley]

Brother William, thank you for having my back.  When good guys like you are happy, I know I did something right.  Huck...we are still buddies even though you think my plane drifted into the wrong airspace.  But as for telling me I shouldn't fight for lower pricing and/or rollbacks, I'm glad to spill my blood in that fight.

Kalen and Tom...alot of what you say makes sense, no question.  but I choose to fight for those that cannot fight this for themselves.  That's what my book is all about, that's what alot of my columns are all about, that's what I'm all about.

Maybe you are right...maybe my love of BM blinds me a bit...but of all the places I could pick - alot of people are saying to themselves "you know what though...that's not a bad one to choose."

I'll trust my hunches.

..and ATTA BOY REDANMAN!

You me and Brother William...Bro william, whaddya say?  Which monk is Bill?  Maybe Michael of Cesena?

Hey Jay,

Its all good, I love a good lively debate.

I'm just curious who in the crowd that can afford $200+ green fees can't fight for themselves??  Sure if we are talking about a poor family who scrapes by to cover thier monthlies and struggling to fight the man to keep thier utilities hooked up, then that is one thing.

But the people who are shelling over massive amounts of money to play Pebble at that rate?  I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess they can look after themsleves just fine.

That being said, I can really appreciate what Mr. Vostinak is saying about us paying for the corporate fat cats to spend thousands on golf.  I'm just not really sure how to get around that one because it likely includes every major business in the country.

I am however still waiting to hear all the moaning and bitching about TOC's outrageous green fees...    At least at pebble I'll get green, luscious fairways for my money  

[Wayne_Kozun]

I wouldn't be surprised if in the next century, the long gone and dead current syndicate of investor owners of the PB golf company will leave it to heirs that will ultimately donate it back to the public in some sort of grant donation foundation thingy.  Of course, I doubt anyone on this forum will be alive when that happens, either...  

That sounds kind of like the St Andrews Links Trust and golfing on TOC is free right?  

Oh wait, they charge about $250.  

[Joe Hancock]

I'm off to the Lexus dealer, demanding Chevrolet pricing....

Joe

[Tim Bert]

Having played the three courses at Bandon Dunes and Pebble Beach, I might be the only chump here that would take another round at Pebble Beach over three rounds at Bandon Dunes Resort.  In reality, I'll likely do neither as there is too big of a world out there.

I believe Pebble Beach is that good.

Mike

I don't think of anyone as a chump for expressing their opinion, and I'd bet that your opinion is probably the more popular one.  I will say this... I've spent 5 days of my life playing either 36 or 54 at Bandon Dunes resort and those 5 days rest comfortably amongst my favorite 10 days of golf EVER.

Again, I have not played Pebble Beach, but I think I can draw one of two conclusions:

1) You've had a much different experience at Bandon than I have and you don't enjoy it nearly as much I do

or

2) You enjoyed Pebble Beach so much that if I were to experience the same feeling my head would probably explode, in which case I'm better off not forking over the cash.

I cannot fathom ONE round at ANY course (even those with access issues that I will never overcome) - 18 and done - exceeding my 54 hole experiences at Bandon.  The only days that have come close for me on the golf scale are those that involve at least 36 holes somewhere.

[Jay Flemma]

Come on baby!  Champagne golf at beer prices!  Mike Strantz and baxter Spann...and on occasion, Doak!

[Wayne_Kozun]

I cannot fathom ONE round at ANY course (even those with access issues that I will never overcome) - 18 and done - exceeding my 54 hole experiences at Bandon.  The only days that have come close for me on the golf scale are those that involve at least 36 holes somewhere.

But Pebble Beach has some great history, if you care about such things.  When walking up the hill on #6 you think about the shot Tiger hit in the 2000 Open.  When you are on 17 you think of the 1 iron hit by Nicklaus and the chip by Watson.  I think about the shot by Hale Irwin that bounced off of the rocks and into the fairway stealing the Crosby from Jim Nelford who would never win a PGA tournament.  You don't have that at Bandon.

And don't forget about the bunker will Bill Murray pitched that old lady  And the house behind #10 that Gene Hackman lost in a divorce settlement!

[Tim Bert]

I agree with the history, and the course is pretty darn incredible as well.  I have no doubt that if I make it I'll almost certainly enjoy Pebble more than 2 of the 3 courses at Bandon and quite possibly more than all 3.  I will be surprised, however, if at the end of the day I enjoy the entire day more from a golf standpoint assuming that day consists of only 18 holes at Pebble - even if I like the course more than any of the three at Bandon.

Not trying to knock Pebble or the experience.  I'd love to play it when the time is right.

[Matt_Cohn]

Couldn't Pebble Beach charge $800 and maintain a mostly full tee sheet with a stronger bottom line? The course is completely booked almost every day. Why don't they charge more?

[redanman]

(Not picking on you in particular, but this post is an easy target for
my points)

-Your math is bad, check again £100-130 is not $300 for *TOC
-You could sleep in your car and play TOC, you virtually must pay the hostage
prices of the PB folks.  Last I checked the $535 rooms got you a view of the
dumpsters at Spanish Bay.  -Walk-on-ability ratios are TOC:PBGL::30:1 or higher
-e.g.Your chances of *walking on Turnberry Ailsa are also much higher than PBGL
(and you can carry/pull)
-e.g. For £420 you get *two courses at Troon
-Cartball or drunken unprofessional know-it-all caddies at PBGL vs. Walk &
carry, walk & pull, professional caddies at TOC
-under 4 hours vs. close to 6 hrs TOC:PBGL more often than not
-If you get paired up at either you will find the interesting /knowledgeable
golf partner ratio to be TOC:PBGL::50:1
-You will get TOC:PBGL::Links: NOT!

-and the Eurofighter air
maneuvers at TOC are not to be missed.  There is no added charge for them.  

Even the Tornado pairs are worth watching.


* These prices are driven up by the same know-nothing belt-notchers crowding up
PBGL. It helps subidize the Links Trust.  Eden is £36, New and Jubilee £70 - all
worth playing, maybe not Spyglass but certainly Poppy Hills and Spanish Bay but
not $300.

Lots of denial around here.

[Tom Huckaby]

Jay:

Fair enough.  Tilt away.  I just never realized your were so altruistic.  I assume your book will be given away gratis?

 

[Tony_Muldoon]

This thread’s title reminds me of the following.


The first of Mickey Rooney’s 8 marriages was to a 19 year old unknown starlet. The marriage did not get off to the most promising start. He confesses that due to him overindulging at the celebrations he was fast asleep before his virgin bride joined him in bed.

So what did he do to make it up to her?  Well for the rest of the week he played 36 holes a day at Pebble Beach.  The marriage lasted barely 2 years.


The reason why I wonder if golfers have any sense of priorities in life? His bride’s name was Ava Gardner   – PRICELESS.

[Bob_Huntley]

I cannot fathom ONE round at ANY course (even those with access issues that I will never overcome) - 18 and done - exceeding my 54 hole experiences at Bandon.  The only days that have come close for me on the golf scale are those that involve at least 36 holes somewhere.

But Pebble Beach has some great history, if you care about such things.  When walking up the hill on #6 you think about the shot Tiger hit in the 2000 Open.  When you are on 17 you think of the 1 iron hit by Nicklaus and the chip by Watson.  I think about the shot by Hale Irwin that bounced off of the rocks and into the fairway stealing the Crosby from Jim Nelford who would never win a PGA tournament.  You don't have that at Bandon.

And don't forget about the bunker will Bill Murray pitched that old lady  And the house behind #10 that Gene Hackman lost in a divorce settlement!

Wayne,

Not quite true. He sold the house before moving to Montecito owing to his then wife's reluctance to live in Pebble Beach. It was probably the Montecito house that he lost.

How do I know? My wife was to have done the interiors for the architect chosen for the job.

Bob

[Wayne_Kozun]

I cannot fathom ONE round at ANY course (even those with access issues that I will never overcome) - 18 and done - exceeding my 54 hole experiences at Bandon.  The only days that have come close for me on the golf scale are those that involve at least 36 holes somewhere.

But Pebble Beach has some great history, if you care about such things.  When walking up the hill on #6 you think about the shot Tiger hit in the 2000 Open.  When you are on 17 you think of the 1 iron hit by Nicklaus and the chip by Watson.  I think about the shot by Hale Irwin that bounced off of the rocks and into the fairway stealing the Crosby from Jim Nelford who would never win a PGA tournament.  You don't have that at Bandon.

And don't forget about the bunker will Bill Murray pitched that old lady  And the house behind #10 that Gene Hackman lost in a divorce settlement!

Wayne,

Not quite true. He sold the house before moving to Montecito owing to his then wife's reluctance to live in Pebble Beach. It was probably the Montecito house that he lost.

How do I know? My wife was to have done the interiors for the architect chosen for the job.

Bob

Then my caddie embellished the story a wee bit - imagine that.  You don't happen to also know the lady that Murray through in the bunker do you?

[Buck Wolter]

What's Pebble worth if the owners decided to put 200 1 acre home sites on it instead? 40 acres of beachfront just went for $100 million in the Hamptons so I'd guess they could get $500 Million very conservatively for the land (Hell # 18 might go for that). If they invested that at 6% they'd net $30 Million/ year and still have the hotels, Spyglass and Spanish Bay and nobody would ever have to complain about getting 'gouged' at Pebble. Sounds like a better business model than running a golf course.

I can see not wanting to pay what Pebble costs  but I can't see complaining about other people being willing to.

Buck

[redanman]

What's Pebble worth if the owners decided to put 200 1 acre home sites on it instead?

Uh, err they can't even if they want to.  In an odd sort of way with the CCC, it's really "not their land".

Dream on .....

[Bob_Huntley]

I cannot fathom ONE round at ANY course (even those with access issues that I will never overcome) - 18 and done - exceeding my 54 hole experiences at Bandon.  The only days that have come close for me on the golf scale are those that involve at least 36 holes somewhere.

But Pebble Beach has some great history, if you care about such things.  When walking up the hill on #6 you think about the shot Tiger hit in the 2000 Open.  When you are on 17 you think of the 1 iron hit by Nicklaus and the chip by Watson.  I think about the shot by Hale Irwin that bounced off of the rocks and into the fairway stealing the Crosby from Jim Nelford who would never win a PGA tournament.  You don't have that at Bandon.

And don't forget about the bunker will Bill Murray pitched that old lady  And the house behind #10 that Gene Hackman lost in a divorce settlement!

Wayne,

Not quite true. He sold the house before moving to Montecito owing to his then wife's reluctance to live in Pebble Beach. It was probably the Montecito house that he lost.

How do I know? My wife was to have done the interiors for the architect chosen for the job.

Bob

Then my caddie embellished the story a wee bit - imagine that.  You don't happen to also know the lady that Murray through in the bunker do you?

Wayne,

Yes.

Bob

[Buck Wolter]

They don't call it the People's Republic of California for nothing.

[Bob_Huntley]

Let me see if I have got this straight. I raise 850 million dollars from well heeled investors and borrow several hundred million dollars from the Bank of America at junk bond rates and buy the corporation and its holdings from a foreign bank.

At the time of purchase I have 900 lots of record that I could sell for a million or more apiece. I don't,  because I want to build an additional golf course and add to the infrastucture already in place. I intend to place many hundreds of acres into a permanent greenbelt.  

I need to pay down my debt and charging a bunch of money at my golf courses is just one way of doing it.

I am not press-ganging anyone to come through the gates and play.

I think this is called capitalism. I love it.

There are a whole bunch of other people that do not agree with me. The opposition comes from lovers of a small flower, diseased pine trees, and any amount of other nonsense that you can think of.

For a fuller look at the opposition see:


http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-03-13-monterey-golf_x.htm



Bob

 

[Tim Pitner]

For those that regard links and golf courses with links characteristics (e.g., Sand Hills and Ballyneal) as the greatest form, Pebble Beach is never going to be that high on their wish list.  Add to that the price tag of $450-500 plus hotel and it's an easy pass.  

Mickey Rooney was married to Ava Gardner?  How is that possible?

[Dan Kelly]

Mickey Rooney was married to Ava Gardner?  How is that possible?

The same way Jackie Coogan was married to Betty Grable (i.e., unsuccessfully).

Life is a mystery.

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