[tonyt]

I played Royal Melbourne for the first time since I got my camera and became trigger happy. In light of some current works on the East course, I thought now would be a good time to post pics, both to show some Aussies the changes and to show everyone else simply the course itself.

I started not taking loads of photos of the early holes, as they are well known to fellow Aussies and we had a pair right behind us which we eventually broke further away from.

The approach into #1 (331y). After either hitting over the fairway bunker on the right and ending near the green, or hitting down the slope to the wide open left for what is often a better angle in (but can leave for some a much longer shot), the green complex sits in this manner and is fairly welcoming for most of the year. In firm conditions, it is dynamite to get safely into the hole in 4 from almost anywhere if the approach isn’t spot on





#2 (438y) The rules of those waiting in the fairway at #1 for those on #2 to hit off and move on precluded me from taking a pic of the good tee shot it is. Hit down into a valley from a tee set at an angle to make the straight fairway a slight dogleg right from atop the hill and with the aggressive landing zone hidden from view, leaving this shot in from the middle. The green is deep and its size very welcoming, though wrinkled ever so slightly here and there and tilted from back to front also to mess with putts that have to cross these tiny features.




#3 (382y) approach. Another green with portions, this time a trough in the centre right that influences play on all approaches




#4 (200y) When does a club know its courses are really good? When you have this wonderful hole, and it is only the second best long par 3 on the property (Ran’s profile of West has a photo of #16 on that course). A great hole in tournament play and especially a pivotal one when the Composite course is played to its PROPER order of play where this hole falls as #16. Up the hill and with the land feeding to the left, it almost cuddles your ball towards the hole rather than blockades it. But the length, the ability to hide weekend pins behind the foreboding sand, and the possibility of having to come back down the slope from just over the back fringe are all reasons this guy still throws anything from 2 to 6 at the pros, with only the good shots setting up a 2. The pic is larger because at that late afternoon time of play, it just looked gorgeous and I couldn’t decide to shrink it further





Those four holes round out the opening stretch on the main paddock. Interestingly, we will next head to the middle patch where changes to all three holes (#5, #6 & #15) make for a very different feel.

[Mark Chaplin]

Tony a fine set of photographs, I'm interested to know if the green on #3 has been changed at all other than the relaying of the greens 5 or 6 years ago. On my last visit it was impossible to stop a ball anywhere on the green playing a soft shot from the front left bunker.

[tonyt]

On my last visit it was impossible to stop a ball anywhere on the green playing a soft shot from the front left bunker.

On any given day, certain shots can in some circumstances become brutal. RM relies on either hard and fast as a whole or certain occasions make certain hole locations much harder than normal. Not unlike how you can go to Uluru half a dozen times and never see the same colour twice.

Over the past 23 years since I first played here and ever since, I've never had untoward trouble with that example you've given. And in tournament play during very firm conditions, I've seen it play quite benign to ANY part of the green so long as the ball is down well in the bunker. But I've seen plenty of other days when it would be dead.

But then I might play there and experience a mischief from one point to another that leaves other relatively experienced RM players scratching their heads when I tell them. The week to week members can tell you of the various scenarios they've faced over time. Some, they've faced only once or twice, and those conditions aren't frequently replicated to the micro degree. Many of today's standard recovery scenario could be next week's knee jerker, and vice versa.

[tonyt]

The new look from the tee on #5 (345y). With the rise being scalped for safety reasons, I hope it gets grassed in keeping with the rest of the property. Currently, all three holes on this middle paddock have a very ill-fitting sandy waste look. Something I’ve called a “faux Pine Valley” look ever since it started with #15. It is a poor choice in my books, and denigrates the beginning and end of the always lovely journey on the outer paddocks of East. My solution on #5 would have been to replicate the look on #11, a lower rise (more blind due to a drop to the fairway over the crest as opposed to a rise in front of the tee), but grassed similarly to the rest of the property to not stick out like a sore thumb



The approach



From behind the green






#6 (175y) green has been moved left further away from the boundary fence. To date, there is still a large area between the new green and the fence which no doubt the club will vegetate appropriately in due course because they naturally in their wisdom won’t leave it in the horrid state it is in now. Perhaps they aren’t putting in the grasses until the other growth is sorted, because it is still undone to this stage. But that’s to look at down the track.

I don’t mind the new green at all, though I’ve thus far only played the new hole once. The right bunker seems to fit the club’s look better than the left, but time may meld the edges better. I am mildly concerned about the results of the construction within the floor of the bunkers, which sit poorly. The archies will not have seen this, because they’ll no doubt take steps to repair it when they do. In all, I can’t wait until this bunkering work is finished, because the results may turn out to be excellent once properly completed.

[Mark_F]

Tony,

Nice pics.

Never having seen the East, I do trust you managed to get one of each hole?

How much of the rise on the fifth was scalped,and what exactly are the safety reasons work was required?

[tonyt]

Tony,

Nice pics.

Never having seen the East, I do trust you managed to get one of each hole?

How much of the rise on the fifth was scalped,and what exactly are the safety reasons work was required?

An ISG thread goes better into it than I can, if you do a search.

The right hand fence was too close to play. It was a very foreseeable issue years ago. The scalping is only a few feet at most, but looks a lot more just quickly in the flesh. I am happy with that concept, just not the leftover look just yet.

The pics will continue, and cover all holes. Hoping for a few other posts in between to break up the loading of too many pics per page.

[tonyt]

After the sixth hole, we crossed the road from the middle paddock to the far paddock, though it feels more like I walked on to a completely different golf course. I have always loved the far paddock of East, an eight hole wonderland that has always been high quality golf among tranquil surrounds. When these changes bed in, I hope they can recapture this feel, because for now during these works, all of that is lost. #7 (517y) just for the moment (I have no idea what the future holds) looks completely terrible. Some of the poorest holes on courses ranked nowhere near the Australian top 100 look exactly like this one now does. And many of those other holes look a lot better.

The openness of the tee shot look is not per say an automatic bad thing, but it heavily jolts against everything else on the property. It looks fine, but it looks like it can’t be Royal Melbourne. But I will say with absolute conviction that it is impossible for a sane man to be able to think of one positive thing to say about the bunkering and sandy waste areas as they look now. It looks like a bomb was dropped on this hole and as yet, no decision has been made to clean up the mess or gather in the debris. Now of course, this work is still ongoing so I might be premature here, but make no mistake, this is no “bedding in” issue. As is, it will never bed. I only hope there is much more to do. I look forward to seeing what the club has in store here for the eventual results with this hole. Though for now, my wait is a nervous one. I can find nothing anywhere among the brilliance of Russell, Morcom or Crockford that was ever remotely sympathetic to this look.

At the time this photos were taken, the fairway was being top dressed, thus the grey lining visible.

#7 tee. Am I on the Gold Coast at a tacky resort? Or am I at a bottom tier Melbourne club in the middle of undertaking some low cost in house renovations? The waste area to the left (which mercifully, I haven’t taken a closer pic of) spreads to abut the new fairway bunker on #8


From the right side just over the first fairway bunker


From the left side, a better look in, from near the bunker that probably is poorly shaped because it is trying desperately to run away from its new neighbouring sandy waste area


The approach. The green is less altered, but has been re-aligned and I actually quite like the result. The subtle tweaks in its internal contouring are as enjoyably challenging as those on say #2





#8 (431y) second shot

[Jason Topp]

Tony - thanks for doing this.  Since I only played the West on my visit, it is interesting to get a detailed view of what I missed.

[Ash Towe]

Tony,
Thanks for the pics and the detailed descriptions.  I thought it was a terrific course, on the one occasion I played it but it will always be in the shadow of the West.

[tonyt]

It thought it was a terrific course, on the one occasion I played it but it will always be in the shadow of the West.

I agree, only from what I read on here about Winged Foot, Merion and the like, the difference in quality between the two is far less.

At worst, East is still in the top half dozen courses in the country. For me personally on the sandbelt, only Kingston Heath surpasses it.

[harley_kruse]

Tony

Great photos of the East

You might be shocked by the new works on the East and the sandy waste,  but it is important ot consider that what you are comparing is an old mature landscape and one which is being newly established from scratch.   It is too early to make judgement on character as the sandy waste areas need time to develop.

If you have achance to see photo's of the East or West Course when they were first built you will see an open treeless landscape with plenty of sandy heathland  waste about - not unlike what you can see today on the new works.   In fact heathland sandy waste was a much bigger part part of RM's character in the beginning  and if anything it has reduced over the years and somewhat due to the invasion of Coastal tee tree which tends to preclude other understorey species.  Where tea tree has been removed the club has had great success in the return of the heath by natural regeneration or helping nature along with seeding and planting.

These areas on the East are expansive sand at the moment deliberately to ensure weed species are kept to a minimum so that a programme of native grass seeding and heath planting can be successful.  You can be confident that in 1-2 years time these areas of sandy waste will be much smaller as they are colonised with the idigenous heathland rough for which RM is famous for.

reagrds

Harley

[Brian Walshe]

Harley,

Is that the approach that was used on the right of 15?  If it is then 2 or 3 years down the track it still looks awful.

Tony,

One thing I was curious about with 6 is whether the right greenside bunker was moved futher up the green than it was on the original.  Seemed to me that on the original the bunker was at the front of the green and now it goes about halfway down the green.  The green itself is tilted right to left.  From the old bunker you played up the green and could use the sideslope.  Now it seems that if you get in the back part of the bunker you play across the green and straight down slope with the end result you end up in the left hand side bunker.

[harley_kruse]

Brian

They are having another go at the area you mentioned given the recent success of other areas where they have collected seed and got successful germination and also establishment of planted tubestock

If you took the plants away from the inside corner of 6th West you would have a similar look to right of 15E in its bare form. ...just takes time and the favourable seasons to get things established.

[Andrew Thomson]

At worst, East is still in the top half dozen courses in the country.

I'd have agreed with you 12 months ago Tony, but that 7th is a black mark on a favourite course.  I'm told the tee on 15 is being fixed, obviously the stuff to the right of 6 will see some vegetation, and as you mentioned, hopefully they take the 'tier' out of the bunker.

Harley,

I'm not as concerned as Tony is about the sandy waste, though I do hope it seeds well as you've said.  But surely 7 sans the waste is still an issue that needs addressing?  As another gentleman correctly pointed out to me.  There are 35 holes on the property that don't have bunkers both sides of the fairway at drive distance, and one that does.  The bunkers are also considerably different in 'look' to the rest of the property with tongues pointing skyward like sunflowers.

Cheers

[Tyler Kearns]

#6 (175y) green has been moved left further away from the boundary fence. To date, there is still a large area between the new green and the fence which no doubt the club will vegetate appropriately in due course because they naturally in their wisdom won’t leave it in the horrid state it is in now. Perhaps they aren’t putting in the grasses until the other growth is sorted, because it is still undone to this stage. But that’s to look at down the track.

I don’t mind the new green at all, though I’ve thus far only played the new hole once. The right bunker seems to fit the club’s look better than the left, but time may meld the edges better. I am mildly concerned about the results of the construction within the floor of the bunkers, which sit poorly. The archies will not have seen this, because they’ll no doubt take steps to repair it when they do. In all, I can’t wait until this bunkering work is finished, because the results may turn out to be excellent once properly completed.

Tony,

I was told by my host at Royal Melbourne East that the new green at No. 6 was built to the same elevation as the old green. Not only were the contours copied, but so to was the elevation change from tee to green. The problem with this literal translation of the original design is that the new greensite required fill to meet the desired elevation, thus the resultant greenpad has steeper tie-ins to the existing contours than the original. If Alex Russell had chosen the new greensite as his original, would he have built it to this elevation or let the land dictate his decision? I'll assume the latter.

I really enjoyed my experience at Royal Melbourne East (and really need to post my pics shortly), a really terrific golf course. It deserves a lot more recognition than it is given, but that is simply because of the high quality of it's sister course the West. The course has 3 outstanding stretches of holes in 1-4, 10-13 and 16-18 which adds up to a marvelous golf course. It is hard to imagine the No. 17 has escaped the renovation, that road must see a much higher volume of traffic than the one border No. 6?

TK

[tonyt]

The course has 3 outstanding stretches of holes in 1-4, 10-13 and 16-18 which adds up to a marvelous golf course.

Harsh! You didn't think #9 to be incredibly good? I think the tee shot look relaxes the player into ending up with a less than advantageous look at one of the better second shots on the course.



#9 (382y). From the tee, a very understated look for RM, and the beginning of one of my favourite holes. The width here is even greater than it appears in this pic. The strategy is not so much in angles, as all players have a similar line in from all parts of the fairway, but in that the left side is wider open and welcoming, feeds down a gentle slope, and results in a second shot that is played from below the green surface and from a long way further than he who has hugged the right


The second shot zoomed in. From 180-190 away, it looks a little more elusive and places an artificial seed in the player’s head about execution requirement


That said, if you DO miss, make sure you miss it in a good spot. Left bunkers or over the back are usually dead (less so in the cooler months). This taken from over the back left





#10 (498y). From the tee, wide as wide can be. Like #9, the key to a shorter route home is to hug the right, here lined by bunker and an old grass mound


The right hand line off the tee can become important for the club golfer, as the cross bunkers in front of the green are a demanding carry if the tee shot is hit to the left half. For the proficient, not so. Though they still influence the good player’s decision depending on how some hole locations can affect the landing zone and shot shape. Together with the tier and green size/shape, the cross bunkers work to ensure even the better players have to plan their shot. I like this effect, and in a way it challenges Mark’s sad notion of cross bunkers not affecting all. For some, they may influence the carry. For others, it may be the lay up. But here, it is also about what happens to your ball once it traverses them. Brilliant!


From back left of the green looking back

[Shane Gurnett]

Tony, the second shot into 10E may be one of my favourite shots on the whole property. A very under-rated hole.

What condition were the greens in when you were there? Have they overcome all of the issues they had last summer?

Shane.

[tonyt]

The greens had been recently aerated and lightly dressed.

Plenty of poa in them, but unlike some, I fail to see the problem in that.

[James Bennett]

I have only seen the East holes on the main paddock (1-4 and 16-18) and the minor paddock (5-6 and 15).  Until this thread, I didn't know which holes were which, so thanks Tony.

A couple of comments.  When I stood on what I now know is the first tee of the East, I looked down and didn't know which green was the target - the hole is set up to play equally well to the West course green just to the right..  Three of us 'virgins' at the course discussed 'which green' for a good three minutes whilst waiting for our tour guide to come over.  I cite this to give a feel for the open space and use of large bunkers one side of the hole that is so common at RM.

The second comment.  I saw back-to-back par 3's, the second I have never seen at all when viewing the composite course on TV.  It follows what used to be #16 Composite.  I now understand that whilst these holes are placed next to each other, and composite players walk the second par 3, in actual play on the East one is #4 and the other is #16.  Pretty cool.

The only real addition to this thread that I can make is to post a Google Earth of the East course routing.  Here it is.  You can also see part of Victoria GC north of the larger East Paddock, much of the West Course and some of the Sandringham public course.  The Google Map is aligned so that north is up.



#1 plays from upper left in a SSW direction to the boundary.
#2 plays E along the fence
#3 plays SE along the fence
#4 plays N along the fence (par 3)
then cross the road to the East
then #5 along the south of that property
#6 along the east of that property.
than cross the road into the larger East paddock.
I assume #7 is the southern most hole.  Don't know what is what, till you cross back into the small paddock
Then #15 on the northern side of small paddock
cross road back to main paddock
#16 par 3 (not in the composite layout) to the north along boundary
#17 par 5 north along boundary (was old #17 in composite)
#18 par 4 WSW from the top right of the property back to clubhouse.  General line of play is to north side of island bushes, although some have played down other fairway to the south (old #1 of composite, more recent #17 of composite .)

Hope this helps some of you to work out what goes where.  It also shows the proximity of the sand belt to each other, and to residential Melbourne.  All set in 'Black Rock', Melbourne!

James B

[tonyt]

On the far eastern paddock, the three bottom parallel holes are #7-9. #10 then hugs the far eastern boundary and the holes wind their way back logically around the norhtern edges to return to the main paddock.

Take a look in James' pic above at the waste area to the right of #15 (northern hole middle paddock). It looks just as disgracefully vandalised on the ground as it does in that pic.

Here is a pic of #15 taken not long before the destruction. Note how looking at it and #5 above it, that Harley is mistaken if he believes that with growing in, the eventual feel will return to anything like the former, which is amazingly unrealistic an expectation.

[Mike_Clayton]

Shane,

I think the second shot to 10 is the best shot on the whole property. Its really a par four now but just imagine how great is would be if the ball went as far as it did when they built the hole.
The shots to 4 west and 17 west are pretty close though.

[RichMacafee]

That Google Earth shot is great James (and great photos Tithers!)

The 7th is the lowest (furthest south) hole on the Eastern paddock. Have a look at the drive zone, and then compare it to all the other par 4 holes on the course - especially the many doglegs. Not good.
------------------
Mike,

How closely do you think the new 6th green resembles the contours of the old one? I can't seem to recall it that well, but when I played the East a few weeks back it didn't seem that similar to me, especially at the front and right.
------------------
Tyler,

17 certainly has huge boundary issues, especially considering the row of cypresses along the boundary will have to come down in the near future. It will be interesting to see how they deal with it, because shaping the hole left will then have implications for the 4th West. 2 pretty special holes to have to alter, lets keep our fingers crossed that it is handled well!

[tonyt]

#11 (358y). View from the tee


View from 50 yards forward of the tee, over the low crest


The inviting width which abounds from both where the second shot is played and around the green. Hole high and off the green is deadly!


Behind the green. The left is bordered by the steep drop away, angled from the green and with the greenside mound toying with the difficulty of the recovery shots. To the right, a large bunker nest that not only plays back to a shallow zone from the right to left edges, but many balls feed back into the bunker well away from the putting surface. Such an open sleeper of a second shot look has dire results if you miss improperly






#12 (449y). I have always loved the simplicity of this hole too, played to a drive zone that is very wide and unencumbered by hazards. The left rough if anything further widens the landing zone because it is light enough to more often than not allow for relatively normal advancement and yet just dense enough to prevent further mischief from the ball otherwise heading into the thicket. So many would relax and strike away uninhibited. Especially since the bunkering is too far away to be in play, and too close to affect any second shot from an open position


From the centre of the fairway, and here is where the fun begins. Further right, and the approach in looks welcomingly flat, and the smaller short left green side bunker is visible. Further left, and most of the green becomes hidden, the exact location of the front left bunker in relation to your ball in the air is unknown, and the shot looks far less assured


From behind, the expanse of receptive and welcoming off green zones never seek to overly test the player on the fringe or beyond, since the hole achieved most of its testing of the player coming from left by hiding the front bunker and not allowing him to visualise the distance and thus makes for a tougher par and much tougher birdie

[Tyler Kearns]

[quote author=Tony Titheridge Harsh! You didn't think #9 to be incredibly good? I think the tee shot look relaxes the player into ending up with a less than advantageous look at one of the better second shots on the course.

Tony,

I have only had one tour of the East, and #9 did not stir the emotions like the other holes I mentioned. It is still a strong hole, and perhaps much better than I can remember or decipher after only one round. The feature that stands out the most in my min d of #9 are the fairway contours in the approach which adds an element of luck or skill (depending on the benevolence of the kick) to the game when one must bounce the ball onto the green during fast & firm conditions.

TK

[tonyt]

#13 (147y). A good hole in my books. When I first stepped onto this tee as a teenager, it looked like a target that was going to demand my attention to ensure I knocked it on the green. Set into a cul de sac of mature timber after the vast open expanses on the previous few holes, it looked like it was very ready to tease and was surrounded by enough sand. It wasn’t until the second or third time I played this hole that I really noticed how large the green is in comparison to its look. The closed in look from its surrounds and the bunkering hide the generousity of the putting surface’s size, and I have remembered this forgiveness each time I have returned. But what the hole giveth, the hole by other means taketh away. The front portion is short of a subtle ridge across the dance floor a third of the way deep into it. All two putts from one side of this to the other are tricky, with birdie a forlorn hope. And on the back two thirds itself, though not significantly tweaked, offers hole locations aplenty that are close to all the edges, meaning even shots played to the correct main portion can leave longish putts. More than many other holes, this one often leaves people walking back to the tee at #14 feeling that they have just taken one too many shots on this one. All good to the player who is wary of this and avoids such a curse.


From the left side just past level with the front edge. The ability to read the line and length of the putt can be a task after the previous putting surfaces have been amongst the wide open spaces

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