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Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Conwy GC New
« on: March 21, 2006, 04:00:42 PM »
On Sunday we played Conwy GC, Mark Rowlinson's club.  The temps were still 4ish, but the wind died to a tolerable 10-15 mph.  I hadn't remembered how penal Conwy is.  Many fairways are either bunkered left and right or, near the end of the round, on holes 14, 16 & 17, there is gorse lining both sides of the fairway.  I don't like these heavy gorse holes at all.  Though the 17th I think would be good if it were the only hole like this.  Needless to say, I much prefer the front nine, but the course as a whole didn't disappoint and I would welcome another game there in the future.  

The short second.  I really like this hole because it has one of the more interesting greens on the course.  A two tier deal running from right to left.


Another view of the 2nd.


The lovely 3rd hole.  Very driveable downwind, but the bunkers are dicey.


The brutal 7th.  Into the wind it wasn't possible to reach.  One of my favourites on the course!


Another view of the 7th green.


From behind the 7th.


The ninth approach.  This is a good par 5 with a very deceptive approach.  The green is actually set back slightly down the hill, but it appears to be 20 yards closer.


The 11th, showing very typical Conwy bunkers.  These are abot 75 yards short of the green.


Bunkered at #13.  A super par 3 with a two tier green.  The view from the tee looks like the play is out to the left away from this bunker, but there is a nasty hidden bunker on the left.  Missing right is much better.  Here I am trying to take advantage of the tier.


The protecting centerline bunkers on the par 3, 15th.


The view from missing the 18th fairway left at about 125 yards out.


While Conwy has certainly fallen a bit in my estimation since the recent work to upgrade the course for the Hoylake Open qualifying, it still has a load of compelling golf which I would be delighted t play again.  For certain Conwy is the pick of the bunch in this neck of the woods and its appeal is further enhanced by outstanding walled town.  However, I would think for many visitors Conwy is more of a chance to get out for a game while visiting the area.  If one is more discerning than myself about their golf better bets are down the road at Wallasey and Hoylake. 

Ciao

« Last Edit: January 15, 2010, 06:38:18 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Jason Blasberg

Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2006, 04:32:12 PM »
Sean,

What was the temperature?


Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2006, 06:06:16 PM »
I am always interested to see what others think of a course I suppose I take for granted.  I am not going to make any comment, because I want to know what others think more objectively than I do.  The bunker escape shot is on the 13th, not the 14th - otherwise we would have back-to-back par 3s.

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2006, 06:25:07 PM »
Sean, from the 18th you have found the old 17th tee.  It was a shortish par 3 from exactly where you are standing to the current 17th green.  This was all part of the redistribution of holes following the building of the tunnel under the Conwy Estuary. Aim at the flagpole next time!

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2006, 10:35:12 AM »
Conwy really did not have the best land in terms of elevation changes or dunes to make a dramatic course.  They did, however, a wonderful job in routing the courses and I found it tough as nails.  
the welcome in both the pro shop and clubhouse was warm and inviting.  I even got a free cup of coffee.  How good is that?
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2006, 02:29:32 PM »
There are several factors which make the present course what it is.  The course was used as a big military camp in both World Wars, and most of the dunes were flattened. There are some quite famous old prints of Conwy which show RCD-like dunes - sadly nle. There is still a trace of the railway track on which the defence guns were mounted on the left of the 7th hole and a pill box, too.  During the Second World War a large part of Mulberry Harbour was constructed in a large dug out area where now the marina and associated housing are.  They then opened a gap into the estuary, flooded the dug out and floated the bits of Mulberry Harbour all the way to France.  I think it was thought that the German spies wouldn't associate this location with a possible invasion of France.  

That area then reverted to salt marsh and the road to the club used to wind down through the reeds directly from the town.  It was almost as evocative as the lane to RW Norfolk.  But Conwy was one of the worst spots for traffic hold ups on the old A55 coast road, particularly so in summer and also with an ever increasing number of heavy lorries going to and from the ferry port at Holyhead.  So it was decided to build a tunnel under the Conwy estuary and they did it in exactly the same way that the Mulberry Harbour was built, floating the pieces out into the estuary from the same construction point.  Unfortunately, the route for the new road came through part of the old course.  What is now the 16th used to be a fine dog-leg to the right, quite a long par 4 played from about the same position as today's medal tee with a ditch on the right where the fairway turned.  The green was about in the middle of today's dual carriageway.  I think that must have been the 15th, because the present 13th is a new hole put in when the road was built.  I can't any longer visualise the old 16th, but it played back through the gorse to a green somewhere about today's fiendish landing zone on the 17th.  As I said earlier, the old 17th was a par 3 played from where you found sanctuary to the right of the 18th fairway down to today's 17th green.   The new 13th, 16th and rearranged 17th were designed (if that is the right word) by Brian Huggett and Neil Coles.  The 2nd is quite a new green put in by David Williams about 5 years ago.  The previous green was in the same spot but lower down and prone to flooding in wet periods.  

The order of play has also changed and other alterations I can think of include the present 4th green dog-legged to the left, which was introduced about 25 years ago, I should think.  The old hole actually curved right to a green over the track that leeds to the present 5th tee.  You can still see vestiges of it.  In those days it was not the 4th - the order being different.  The 6th (par 3) used to play to a green low down beside the winter 7th tee - about 200 yards and it is occasionally used as a winter green even today. The present 7th, a long par 4, is a considerable reworking of a par 5 which played from a tee much further back.  I think it was abandoned when the new 13th was put in, perhaps earlier.  You will see in many places (alongside the 8th and 9th fairways, 4th and 5th, too) what appear to be grass bunkers but once were sand bunkers defending greens which have long been abandoned.  The rather dull green on the short 15th was introduced when watering for the greens was installed.  Previously it had been a punchbowl and was much missed when it disappeared.  

Conwy has had championship status for many years but golf in Wales was underfunded compared with, say, the Lancashire coast, so almost all the alterations have been done by the club itself using its own green staff.  It shows in the blandness of greens such as the 4th and 16th which are in no way tied into the surroundings.  They contrast starkly with the 2nd which, although the newest green, has been properly designed by a professional architect.  Quite a lot of new or reworked bunkering has been put in in recent years, mostly to fit it to championship play.  I just wonder if the drive area bunkers are far enough out from the tee.  We shall see.

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2006, 02:39:07 PM »
I should have added that that grass bank behind the 7th didn't exist until quite recently.  The approach was played to a green behind which was a slim strip of grass and then the beach or, at high tide, the sea.  It was a breathtaking situation.  Unfortunately erosion and a proliferation of walkers along the coast led to the grass wall.  I'll see if I can find an old photo or two.  I must have some.  

Richard Phinney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2006, 06:00:23 AM »
Thanks much for the very informative exchange between Sean and Mark.  I really enjoyed the course, and my impression was it was not only very friendly place (as Sean says) but also exceedingly lively and busy - the fact that the course is a little congested in places, and lacking in high dunes, no doubt emphasizes this.  As someone else indicated, you feel that there is a high quality, and unusual, links course there in spite of all of the constraints.


Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Conwy GC pix
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2006, 02:14:32 PM »
Sean, I like your assessment.  You've spotted the salient features.  The bunker on the 9th has only recently been made into that shape.  It was before that three pot bunkers set into the ridge.  From those most ordinary golfers hacked out only to finish on or behind the steep hill on the right.  On the other hand they did not catch every mishit ball that went there - many a time the ball would trundle happily between them, going unpunished. I suspect escape is now easier, but the mishit ball will now always finish in there.

I realise that you played the course in a very untypical wind.  Normally the 7th plays with the wind and even I aspire to get on the green in two if a get the right line off the elevated tee on the left.  It's the 8th that I rarely reach in two because that is usually straight into the prevailing wind hurtling around the headland.  

Similarly, the par-5 12th is a drive and 7-iron to a good player when the wind is absent, but for 90% of the time it plays into the wind and can be quite a slog, the drive finishing short of the many drive bunkers, the next shot failing to clear the distant ridge and a mid-iron or more over the ridge directly into the wind to find the green.  The par-3 13th also plays into the wind and I've seen good players hitting driver!  In that event, the par-5 14th runs with the wind.  There is more run on this fairway than the rest and even I have been on with drive 6-iron.  The rebunkering has tightened the hole.

With a strong prevailing wind the 11th is often unreachable in two shots, even though the hole is less than 400 yards in length even from the very back.  The 17th, too, is horrible into the wind because a safe iron off the tee does not make enough distance to put the green in reach of two shots, again though it is under 400 yards.  It is one of the card wreckers and, coming at 17, there is no chance for redemption.  A lot of gorse and a few trees have been taken out alongside the 18th and many big hitters try to drive the green.  The penalty for failure on the right of the fairway is horrendous.  

Possibly the hardest hole to judge into the wind is the 15th.  It is only a shortish iron shot but it plays into the wind and the tee is very sheltered.  I have been known to hit a 3-iron from this tee.  

I value your analysis.

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