[George Pazin]

We agree to disagree on Wolf Creek -- on that point
George -- dare I say that -- we do agree.

Works for me.

I don't have a big problem with the 15th, I just didn't find it particularly interesting, either. I don't have a problem with a penal hole with a wedge in your hand, though I think the penal nature of the 8th is somewhat overdone, given its length.

As I said, it's been a while, but my recollection was that the cart rides on much of the back 9 were at least significant enough to make the course unwalkable. Perhaps there were walking paths that were shorter that I didn't notice.

Have a good one.

[Matt_Ward]

George:

What makes #15 so much fun is because the entire hole is set on a high ridge in which the prevailing southwest wind hits you quite hard when you walk off the 14th green to the tee box.

The green is quite small -- especially when the pin is set in the far rear end. It takes plenty of guts to fire at such a location when the slightest pull or if you go long can mean a very big number on the card.

I only wish there were a bunker either to the right or left to frame the hole but in real terms having nothing there makes it more demanding to set one's mind on the target.

In regards to the 8th hole -- yes -- it's a dam hard shot indeed. But just remember -- Rider is forcing the player to hit a long iron or fairway metal. You do have a small bailout area in the very front portion of the green. But keep this in mind -- the hole does play a bit downhill and the green is sufficiently big enough to handle any hot shot that hits it in most instances.

George -- the 8th hole is where the golfer puckers up and better deliver. If golfers play the correct tee then the challenge should fall within their comfort zone -- but you still have to execute at a high level. In my book -- that's fair game for one key hole when playing WC.

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