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wsmorrison

Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« on: August 03, 2005, 10:06:41 AM »
US Amateur Qualifying results for Rolling Green GC and Llanerch CC

http://www.gapgolf.org/charts.asp?sfile=static/archive/2005_us_amateur_day_two_results.html

SPDB

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2005, 10:10:45 AM »
I hope Buddy Marucci gets in. Its a shame he didn't qualify.

John_Conley

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2005, 10:38:51 AM »
Boo Hoo Mu Hu.

wsmorrison

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2005, 10:44:14 AM »
Mu Hu has an awfully nice swing. I would've thought he would qualify.  I too hope Marucci gets in to pair up with Chris Lange and have two seniors represent the Philadelphia district.  Marucci's home course advantage will be a huge value add.

Geoffrey_Walsh

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2005, 11:34:24 AM »
I was really hoping that either Tug Maude or John Sawin was going to get in.  Both were players on the Haverford School golf team that I coached and both know Merion better than anyone other than Buddy.

John has a picture perfect swing and Tug hits it longer than just about anyone in the Philly area.  Even more importantly, both are great guys.

Jeff Shelman

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2005, 11:41:51 AM »
A question for whoever would like to address it: Why does the GAP run its Am qualifiers as two-day events? I realize it's done a few other places do it as well, but many (the majority?) of qualifiers are one-day 36-hole events.

What opinion do y'all have of essentially two different qualifying formats? Is it a big deal? Do the college kids have an advantage in the one-day qualifiers? Is either format more fair?

Just curious.


wsmorrison

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2005, 11:47:26 AM »
Jeff,

This was a super-regional qualifier.  They had well over 200 (~240) contestants for 9 places and two alternates.  The tournament had to be held over two days.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2005, 11:47:51 AM by Wayne Morrison »

JSlonis

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2005, 11:57:25 AM »
Jeff,

Usually our qualifiers are 36 holes in one day.  I believe due to the US Am being here in Philly, the qualifier here was extra-large, therefore requiring the 2 day format.

Yes, the majority of Mid-Am's and Senior guys that are trying to qualify prefer the 2 day format.  Myself, I don't mind the 36 holes in one day.

Jeff Shelman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2005, 11:58:54 AM »
Wayne,

I don't think you can say it had to be played over two days. They chose to play it over two days. For the US Open qualifier in Columbus, OH each year right after the Memorial, they have that many guys and get it done in one day. Two courses, split tees. Start early, get an hour or so between rounds and play the other course (about 20 minutes away).

For this USAm, there was a qualifier in the Cleveland area that used two courses on the same day. Same with in Lawrence, KS (though those two courses are part of the same facility).

With as many great courses as they are in the Philly area, it certainly seems realistic that they could have done it all on one day had the chosen too. They might not have been able to play it on the same two courses, but it could have been done. They also could have chosen to have two separate qualifing events rather than one large one.

I guess I was curious what the opinions were on here of one-day vs. two-day and whether one of the two is better and whether they are equitable.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2005, 12:11:31 PM by Jeff Shelman »

JohnV

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2005, 12:13:46 PM »
Jeff,

This was a super-regional qualifier.  They had well over 200 (~240) contestants for 9 places and two alternates.  The tournament had to be held over two days.

That is because they chose to do it that way.  

When the Amateur was at Oakmont, we chose to have 3 qualifiers rather than try to run on giant one.  We had 234 players (78 at each).  

When the US Amateur was held at Pumpkin Ridge in 1996, the OGA had one qualifier in one day with 192 players at two courses.  You played one in the morning and one in the afternoon.

The Georgia State GA usually has one big two-day qualifier for the US Am, but has a cut after the first day so only those with 7 shots of the lead (or some such number) get to come back.

My personal preference is for how we did it 2 years ago.  With a huge field, you run the chance of bad weather really messing you up.  As it was, we had bad weather at one of our sites and had to go to a second day for that one, but otherwise it worked great.

This year we had 2 qualifiers with a max of 78 at each one.  We got 69 at each site.  I'm glad we didn't have to do a 138 player qualifier over one or two days.  Of the 6 players who qualified, 3 are mid-ams so playing 36 in one day didn't hurt too much here.

The USGA usually prefers the 36-hole qualifiers to be held on one day, but will allow other formats such as Philly or Georgia use.

peter_p

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2005, 12:53:54 PM »
Jamie,
Sorry you lost out in the playoff for first alternate against Marucci. I'm guessing this is one where the 1stA has a good chance of getting to the show.

JSlonis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2005, 12:58:23 PM »
Pete,

Buddy Marucci is actually the 2nd Alternate.  I didn't stick around for the playoff for that spot.  The 1st Alternate spot went to Mike Danner who lost a playoff to Chris Lange for the last spot.

Matt_Ward

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2005, 01:21:33 PM »
For those who might know -- what is the 2nd course that will be used for the US Amateur on-site qualifying? A friend asked me the other day and I could not answer.

One other thing -- given the knowledge of the folks in the neighborhood -- what will be the prediction for the cut-off for the low 64 for match play?

I'm thinking 150 on the nose will be the number.

Mike_Cirba

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2005, 01:23:38 PM »
Matt,

Philly Country Club.

Rob_Waldron

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Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2005, 01:37:51 PM »
The USGA offers several options for running the US AM Qualifier. In the Baltimore / Washington area we had two local US Am qualifiers this year. The Association coordinating the event decides which format option is used.

The MD State Golf Assn. ran the Baltimore qualifier and played 36 holes in one day at Hayfields CC (70 players for 3 spots). We (Washington Metropolitan Golf Association) held the 36 hole qualifier over two days at one golf course, Four Streams. Since we were only using one golf course 154 players for 5 spots) we chose to have a cut after the first 18 holes. Obviously the cut can only be used with one course scenario. Using two courses requires all players to return the second day.

wsmorrison

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2005, 01:55:44 PM »
"One other thing -- given the knowledge of the folks in the neighborhood -- what will be the prediction for the cut-off for the low 64 for match play?

I'm thinking 150 on the nose will be the number."

You say that without even knowing the other qualifying course?  Not a very robust analysis if you ask me--which you didn't  ;)
« Last Edit: August 03, 2005, 01:56:35 PM by Wayne Morrison »

JSlonis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2005, 02:53:54 PM »
I'd be surprised if the cut for the low 64 gets as high as 150.  They will probably play the 6th hole at Philly CC as a very long par 4, making the overall par 70 there.  140 will be Par for the 36 hole qualifier.  I would guess , that if conditions are not crazy, it'll take 146-148 to make it.

For the last few US Am's the cut has been:

2002- Oakland Hills, +4
2003- Oakmont, +8
2004- Winged Foot, +10, there was terrible weather during the qualifying rounds, a lot of rain.

I wish I was playing :'(...but I'll defintely get to Merion to check out some action. I'm very curious to see the scoring at Merion.  Playing Merion throughout the years, and knowing the course pretty well,  I think you'll see one of the widest spectrum of scores for any host course.  Merion can be just so tough if your game isn't totally on.  If a player is swinging or even thinking poorly, he'll get exposed quicker than Michael Jackson at the Boy Scout Jamboree.  ;)

Philly CC will hold its own as well.  If the weather cooperates, and Mike McNulty is able to prime the course to his wishes, the guys will have a great test on their hands.  Hopefully they'll have a nice firmness at Philly CC. Similar to other local Flynn designs, it is a course that really comes alive when the ball is bouncing around.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2005, 03:47:58 PM by JSlonis »

wsmorrison

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2005, 03:00:49 PM »
Jamie,

Its hard to take a fellow's guestimate as worthy of consideration when he didn't know the second qualifying course.  Even though you haven't seen 2000 courses like the self-esteemed Matt Ward ;) I think your estimation is an informed one and likely close to the needed score.

We all wish you were playing; you'd have had a pretty big GCA.com booster section cheering for you.  Take it out on the Brits in next week's tournament!

See you at Merion.

Best,
Wayne
« Last Edit: August 03, 2005, 03:01:47 PM by Wayne Morrison »

Matt_Ward

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #18 on: August 03, 2005, 04:26:50 PM »
Leave it to Wayne to throw his predictable verbal BS grenades. I simply asked a question and I ventured that a two-day total of 150 -- given what has happened in past years -- might be the magic number to get into the match play portion of this year's Amateur.

Whether I knew the name of the second course is irrelevant to the total I predicted. Merion East will likely be prepared to be a tough but fair examination. Philly CC will likely also be ready to handle the best amateurs.

Count on Wayne to interject such inane comments as, " Even though you haven't seen 2000 courses like the self-esteemed Matt Ward."

What does that have to do with what was asked?

Go to the previous results from years past and you will see what I mean. That's if you don't want to simply carry on with the juvenile Ward bashes. I thought you were above such things. Forgive me for being wrong to believe that. ;)

wsmorrison

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2005, 05:02:40 PM »
Matt,

You're right.  Time to put an end to bashing you.  I hearby cease and desist...until the next stupid thing you say ;)  Just kidding.

Whatever the scores are, it should be a fine tournament.  Even better if Mother Nature complies over the next few weeks.

See you out there?

Matt_Ward

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2005, 05:57:06 PM »
Wayne:

Thanks -- I'm glad you came to your senses! ;D

Gents:

I'm looking forward to being present -- does anyone know the "official" length of Merion for the event?

TEPaul

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2005, 07:25:59 PM »
The reason GAP did a two day qualifier is just a numbers and timing thing. With a field that large to get everyone done, do an accounting and get a playoff done is pretty dicey. The chances are good the qualifier will be coming back the next day for something and even a short weather delay and it's certain.

If, and it may be a big IF----the weather cooperates and they can get both those courses just the way they ideally want to set them up for a US Amateur qualification---eg firm and fast "through the green" and greens that're firm (only a light dent) and a good speed on the greens I have  a feeling 147-8 will make match play.

However, if they get lucky with the weather going in and during qualifying I don't think they're 64 players in that field who can shoot better than 75 on Merion East---maybe can't even shoot 75 or better. If it rains and the course is soft 64 will do better than that.

Will the weather cooperate going in and during qualifying? I wouldn't bet much on that this year.

Qualifying is all the playing test Merion needs to go through. Match play doesn't really matter that way.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2005, 07:28:29 PM by TEPaul »

TEPaul

Re:Results of super-regional US Am qualifying in Philadelphia
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2005, 07:57:47 PM »
Buddy Marucci, as the second alternate from here won't likely get in. But if he really wants to get in he can---all he has to do is call me and tell me he wants to get in.

I have this Russian mafia goon who's very efficient at rearranging kneecaps. But I know about half those qualifiers so it can't be any of the ones I know. But we have about four or so to pick from.

Marucci is a big Mercedes/Porsche dealer in this area and if he wants to get in I want one of his top of the line Mercedes or Porches in my driveway by Monday morning. I'll take care of the Russian mafia goon's fee myself.

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