Hidden Creek revisited

[blasbe1]

Pat:

I'm about to ask the Judge's permission to treat you as a hostile witness

To say that C&C would have cleared it if they wanted to is non-responsive.  To say that it's the widest course in history would be equally non-responsive.

I find it bizarre that, given as much as they have cleared, and as much fescue was planted, that you think clearing some more pines in a handful of places would be "artificial."  I completely disagree and still think the course would be better for it, but that's just my opinion.  Again, I dislike corridor effect golf, on any scale and of any width, if you have adjecent fairways you should see them, you should walk past the green you're about to play and peak at the pin placement, see the countors, see how much the wind is blowing, you should look back at wher you've been, etc.

Like man, no hole is an island and I'm surprised you would rather not see 4 green before stepping on its tee, a green that good should be seen as early and often as possible.

Jason  



   

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jason,

Fair enough, a hostile witness I am.

Then you wouldn't like Pinehurst # 2 or Pine Valley.

The notion that inland courses, especially courses built in the middle of pine forests should have unobstructed views of the rest of the golf course is absurd.  It's forcing a golf course built in the pines to look like a links golf course by the sea.

As to # 4, walking off the 3rd green and seeing # 4 for the first time is rather impressive.

I happen to like the sequence of viewing the expansive sand pit as you're playing  # 3 and then seeing the 4th hole after you round the corner of trees after walking off of the 3rd green.

Because it's so startling a view, seeing it from # 3 would detract from the experience presented at # 3.

P.S.   Under your theory CBM would have located # 16 green at NGLA directly above its present location.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jason,

I don't know why I didn't think of this earlier.

Even if you cut the trees on # 3, the green at # 4 is not visible from the fairway on # 3 as it's below grade, which rises as you approach the green and the right side of the green.

At best, it could only be seen once you were in the middle or back of the 3rd green.

[blasbe1]

Fair enough, I wasn't sure about the topo. so I also wasn't sure if that would work.

I'm not at all suggesting changing the nature of the inland pines, it's just a feature that I like to see in a couple of spots.

   

[Mike Worth]

Jason, i know you only saw HC once, and I think Pat accurately answered your point about seeing #4 and 5 from the par 5 3rd hole, but most of the areas behind the greens are cleared out pretty well.

In most cases there is a good 30-40 yards of open space that was purposely created in the back of the greens to create the look you describe.