[Tommy_Naccarato]

[Paul Richards]

Tommy

Thanks for the pictures.

I still can't find that 'amazing' waterfall, though.  


>"The major thing is a big waterfall behind the 18th green, where we recirculate tens of thousands of gallons of water. As you leave the green, you walk under the waterfall to get to the clubhouse,"


 

[SPDB]

Is there any rough? I have to admit to being intrigued by what i see. Even if it does look like the golf course equivalent of the bumpers you see bowling alley's put on their lanes for the kids.

[PThomas]

I wonder if one gets a discount if one plays both SC and this course on the same day ...

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Photobucket reduced the size of the shots, so if you want to see them, tell me which one and I'll post it seperately.

[Kevin_Reilly]

Is there any rough? I have to admit to being intrigued by what i see. Even if it does look like the golf course equivalent of the bumpers you see bowling alley's put on their lanes for the kids.

Time on course = time not at tables?

[SPDB]

Yes, Kevin. Word is Wynn has figured out how to take the mounds out of containment. He has hired 200 illegals to roam the trees and when a ball comes in they're instructed to throw it back out. Don't tell the shareholders

Does anybody know the acreage of the golf course? I've heard the entire parcel (hotel and golf course) is 192 acres.

[DMoriarty]

Tommy

Thanks for the pictures.

I still can't find that 'amazing' waterfall, though.  


>"The major thing is a big waterfall behind the 18th green, where we recirculate tens of thousands of gallons of water. As you leave the green, you walk under the waterfall to get to the clubhouse,"


 

Mr. Fazio really out did himself this time . . .

[Paul Richards]

David

>Mr. Fazio really out did himself this time . . .



WOW!!!!

That really is a 'major thing'!!!!!

 

[Joel_Stewart]

Nice sod job.

The course looks like a cross between Desert Pines which is in Las Vegas and Shadow Creek.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Joel,
Just to make one thing clear, the course was sprigged and grown-in with sod only used around the bunker areas--I don't see anything wrong with that. Personally, I think the landscaping and conditioning look phenominal here. The course has a more open feel to it then most Fazio courses.

A movie could be made on how they did the tree movement here, using existing old trees from the DI.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Tommy,

Nice pictures.

One hole does remind me of the downhill par 4 on the back nine at Shadow Creek, # 11 I believe, with it's grooved fairway to an elevated green.

It looks like a good deal of elevation changes were created.
That's interesting.

It also looks like it was intended to be user friendly, with corrective features-allowances for the higher handicap golfer,
which is smart, as a happy golfer is a gambling golfer.

As to the comments....., like Sebonack, I'd prefer to wait to hear from people who've actually played those golf courses, including myself.

What really amazes me is all the negative comments about the waterfall on # 18.

Why didn't these same people complain about the waterfall on the 18th at Applebrook, Gil Hanse's neat golf course ?  

Don't tell me they never heard of it, or didn't know it had a waterfall.

The double standard rears it's head again.

Fazio = NO
All others enjoying MFNS = YES

I also would have thought that the Wynn course would have been the diametric opposite of Shadow Creek so that no similarities or comparisons could be drawn.  I was thinking of a more radical design, a course with perhaps a combination of Pine Valley, GCGC, NGLA and TOC as its core theme.  But, then again, noone asked me.

Is there any word on whether or not Steve Wynn will author a book on this golf course, similar to the one he did on Shadow Creek ?

[SPDB]

Does anybody know if they plan to grow rough?

[Paul Richards]

Pat

>Why didn't these same people complain about the waterfall on the 18th at Applebrook


Didn't know they had one there too.



 


Must be pretty awesome, I'll bet.
 

[DMoriarty]

What really amazes me is all the negative comments about the waterfall on # 18.

Why didn't these same people complain about the waterfall on the 18th at Applebrook, Gil Hanse's neat golf course ?  

Don't tell me they never heard of it, or didn't know it had a waterfall.

The double standard rears it's head again.

Fazio = NO
All others enjoying MFNS = YES

Patrick,  Where are all the negative comments about the waterfall?  Surely not on this thread.  I see two critical comments.

Paul Richards quotes Fazio about the waterfall, and wants to see a photo.  Is this a critical comment?  Most likely.  My photo was a joke, but a pointed one.  I posted a photo of a waterfall large enough to match the hype that the giant-waterfall-behind-the-18th-green seems to generate.  

As I assume Paul was, I was being critical of Fazio's and/or the media's focus on what is surely eye popping eye candy, as opposed to focusing on the course itself.  One need not be a Fazio basher to lament the focus on the superficiality over substance.

Fazio's complete quote:  "The major thing is a big waterfall behind the 18th green, where we recirculate tens of thousands of gallons of water. As you leave the green, you walk under the waterfall to get to the clubhouse," he said. "There's beauty and drama. There's flowers, trees, shrubs and perfect grass. It's like a dream come true."

As for Applebrook, while I have heard it I know little of it.  I dont think I knew it had a waterfall, but I do recall reading that there was a waterfall on one of Gil's courses.  I think it is fair to say that this Wynn project is a bit more in the limelight than Applebrook ever was or will be.   I dont know anything about how the course was or is promoted, but if I ever hear Gil Hanse marketing Applebrook's waterfall as "the major thing" at Applebrook, I'll post a doctored photo critical of him as well.  

By the way Patrick, do the golfers at Applebrook walk under the waterfall and into the clubhouse from the 18th green?  

[DMoriarty]

Whoops.  I just remembered that Hanse and Co put in a little waterfall behind the new # 7 at Rustic.   A photo . . . .

[Mike_Golden]

I can unequivocally state, that, based on these photos, I have absolutely no desire to ever play this golf course.  I suppose it's a decent course and would be at least enjoyable but so would hundreds, maybe thousand of other courses around the world.  To tell you the truth, I'd rather play an interesting course by an unknown architect where you at least have the opportunity to find something unexpected.  An example of that would be a course I played over the weekend, Diamond Valley (sort of near Temecula, CA) where the 9th hole has something very close to a Biarritz green (although it's a par 5) and the rest of the course is solid, challenging, and fun.  Oh, and a Saturday morning round (9AM) took 3 1/2 hours walking (I was the only one on the course not in a cart)

[Paul Richards]

David

> One need not be a Fazio basher to lament the focus on the superficiality over substance.

Excellent, excellent quote.

You nailed that one.  

Thanks for putting into words exactly what I meant to express.

 

[Scott_Burroughs]

What happened to my post from last night?  Did you kill it, Mr. N?

Here it is again:

Patrick,

Doak's Stone Eagle (not open yet) also has a waterfall.


Tommy,

Photobucket has never resized my photos before.  Were they larger than 1MB?  Shrink them down and save as .jpg if they weren't already to reduce size.  My aerial of Oakmont is huge.  The aerial of Hidden Creek (the original) was even larger.

[DMoriarty]

Patrick,

Doak's Stone Eagle (not open yet) also has a waterfall.

Patrick, this reminds me . . .

If I recall correctly, the reaction around here was pretty sour when Tom Doak brought up the possibility of including a waterfall at Stone Eagle. How does something like this fit into your "bias" theory?  

[PThomas]

another great (?!) idea:  ask Mr. Wynn to host KP IV here  next year!  what publicity he'd get!

[jg7236]

Tommy did you actually get the pleasure to play the golf course, or did you get a nice tour of the golf course?

[Dan Kelly]

Was checking out the Bellagio Web site, for a good reason, when I remembered I wanted to look at www.wynnlasvegas.com, for no good reason.

Did.

Let the historical record show that these were Tom Fazio's remarks on the Web site's video:

"Can you imagine having a spectacular, great golf course on the Strip of Las Vegas? I mean, right here. Walk out the door of your room, and there is a golf course as good as any place in the world. I mean, that's shocking. That, in itself, is pretty unique."

Here are the Fun Facts:

"· Over 800,000 cubic yards of earth were moved to create the dramatic elevation changes considered impossible on the Las Vegas Strip!

"· Over 100,000 new shrubs

"· Roughly 1,200 existing trees were salvaged and relocated from the former Desert Inn Golf Course, some more than 50 years old and over 60 feet tall

"· 4,600 lineal feet of stream

"· 37-foot-tall waterfall adjacent to Hole 18

"· 45 feet of elevation change from the tee of Hole #1

"· Two marshland areas using natural groundwater

"· Nearly 6 miles of cart paths"

--------

As for the lodgings: "Michelangelo took four years to complete the Sistine Chapel. Your room took five."

[Tom_Doak]

For the record, Stone Eagle does have a water feature which is now complete.  I haven't seen the finished form yet, but I asked Eric Iverson about it just today, and he told me I would be really pleased with it, that they made it look about as natural as you could for water in the desert.  (The water feature is located in two deep natural washes which run through the site into the irrigation pond, next to the 4th green and 5th tee.)

You're welcome to bash the waterfall all you want, of course, but I don't really see the point.  Features like this really don't have much to do with the quality of the golf, pro or con ... so the only reason to rip them is if someone thinks they are actually an important feature.  In the case of Stone Eagle, the water feature isn't even the main feature of the fourth or fifth holes.  The ravines and the rock outcroppings are the feature.

[Scott_Burroughs]

Features like this really don't have much to do with the quality of the golf, pro or con

Of course.

... so the only reason to rip them is if someone thinks they are actually an important feature.  

Such as Donald Trump and GD raters ...that's really what some of the criticism is about.

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