Orientation of the Tee Box

[Adam_F_Collins]

One of the first architectural devices I came to notice on my own was the orientation of the tee box.

An architect can really screw you up by aligning the tee so that it "points" the golfer into trouble.

Does anyone know the origin of this device?
What are your thoughts and opinions on the use of this device in the design of a golf course?

[Jeff_Brauer]

Adam,

One of my bugaboos is golfers who think they deserve a tee that orients them!  Nowhere in the rules of golf, or golf design does it say that we need to give that kind of assistance.  Does the fairway need to aim right at the green for the same reason?

[A_Clay_Man]

Whines from those unaware, must bring a grin to any archie, (supers too) dead or alive.
Funny how those asleep, want their golfing to be made easier all the time.

The second at Spy, "Billy Bones"'s upper level forward teeing ground, lines the golfer up directly into a stand of Pines. You'd be amazed at how many miss that simple orientation test.

[Mike Nuzzo]

I don't like it...
Seems an ungamely trick to mess with someone unconsciously.
During a site visit of a renovation project, we were expanding the teeing ground of a par three.  It hits from a small perch to a redan type green, across a depressed area.  The old tee pointed the golfer to the right.  The builder's first try also pointed to the right.  It was an effort to get both sides of the tee pointed towards the target, so imagine how hard it would be for the golfer.  (there were 2 of us, with paint, levels, t-squares, abaci ... you name it)
Jeff, I don't disagree about the green and fairway though.
Cheers

[Dan_Callahan]

See previous discussion on same topic at http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forums2/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=7423;start=0

[Adam_F_Collins]

Oh Christ -
The dreaded, repeat thread. And it was only seven months ago.

Okay, nobody hurt themselves.

After reading over the old thread, I see that many dislike it. It doesn't bother me, personally - although I still sometimes find it difficult to overcome.

I also like the idea of architects using this common, yet simple and effective device. We all learn to watch for it - yet it still gets us. It's kind of like the same reason I enjoyed the way the special effects guys did the Lord of the Rings movies - they used some cutting edge techniques - but some old school tricks as well - as long as they worked well. And this one does - dirty or not.

It really works when tee boxes are in fact rectangular, or straight - sided.

With many modern architects opting for the 'organic' shapes for teeing ground, this 'trick' becomes more a function of the tee markers than the tee boxes themselves.

Anyone know the origin of this design device? I don't think that was addressed in the old thread.

[Phil_the_Author]

Adam,

I don't know if he is responsible for this, but you will find this used in a number of Tillinghast designs. He would "point" a tee so that it lined up with a fairway edge or at a bunker. These were usually more pronounced where they were set-up for the good to accomplished player and as a challenge for them.

[Shaun Carney]

Mind you, I'm not a scratch player, more like a 9, and this may sound stupid, egotistical, etc., but I can't recall this happening at all in the rounds of golf that I've played. Sure, the tee box/architect was trying to mislead me by pointing me in the direction of trouble, but I simply pick out my intended target, pick the appropriate club, and fire away. What happens, happens. I can see this as an appropriate defense against higher handicapped players, but never really saw it as an effective way to thwart the more skilled player (which I've stated before, I don't consider myself).

[BCrosby]

There's an old Yiddish expression that goes something like:

"The girl who can't dance says the band can't play."

Bob

[Buck Wolter]

I worked on a greens crew many moons ago and usually set up the tee markers and cut the holes. You don't have to have a tee pointing in the wrong direction -- just move the tee markers so a perpendicular line points to trouble and an amazing number of people will follow that lead. I had more complaints about that than pin placements and I could be sadistic with those!

Buck

[Richard_Mandell]

I have never heard of anyone intentionaly orienting a tee away from the intended line of play on purpose.  I have seen many a contractor screw up the architect's intention of squaring up a tee plenty of times.

Every tee I design is square and oriented to the line of play with the exception of where I have to fit the tee into the lay of the land.  Never once would I intend to intentionally skew it offline a few degrees.  

I have seen kidney shaped or other free form tees dead-ending into the woods or the rough, but I don't think the intention there is to deceive the golfer.

If an Architect says he is intentionally doing this, then he is covering up a screw-up.  If he is not, it is a terrible excuse of a design strategy.

Squaring up a tee is a challenge, but is simple to accomplish with a few flags, the correct pacing, and a few straight arms.  Of course the contractor needs to pick it up from there.

My own little irony is that I spend long hours in the field trying to get my features to look as natural as possible, yet I love square tees.  Go figure.

I also love pea soup, yet I loath peas.

[TEPaul]

Sometimes it appears that tee boxes must have been purposely misaligned but on some of them a closer inspection of the way things once may have been answers the question.

Here's a good example. On the 3rd hole at my course, GMGC, the 3rd tee box pointed quite a bit to the right off the right side of the fairway. But if you look at the old aerials you'll see there used to be about 30 more yards of fairway width out there on the right. In the last few decades that tee box pointed the golfer right at a bunch of pine trees to the right of the fairway.

Now all those pine trees are gone and we restored that 30 yards of right side fairway where they were so that old tee box now points the golfer to the right side of the fairway which is sort of the safe side to go (OB on the left).

But the Mother of all "misaligned" tees has to be Bill Kittleman's long par 3 at the new Hanse designed French Creek. That hole as been labeled by Bill as the "Abruptment". His back tee lines the golfer right at the abruptment all along the right of the hole which and makes the tee line up off angle to the green by about 45 degrees!

I've always heard that the use of the diagonal was one of the most important in golf architecture but it seems Bill K has just perfected the "diagoanal teebox"!    

[TEPaul]

"I have never heard of anyone intentionaly orienting a tee away from the intended line of play on purpose."

Richard Mandell:

Well, then, allow me to introduce you to one William Kittleman, and allow me to take you out to French Creek's #17 back tee!!

The first time I saw that hole Rodney Hine showed it to me as it was being built and he said Bill had been working on it for some time. Generally Bill will sort of stay with one thing and slowly create whatever comes to his mind. Rodney cracked me up by saying, "We've all be watching Bill create this hole for a few months and there's more damn stuff going on here than one can imagine and so far none of us have the vaguest idea what it all means strategically or otherwise."

I think the hole is completely unique and wonderful. But there will be more than a few who'll scratch their heads when they play it, particularly that back tee!

[Tom Soileau]

I have always believed that square tees should point down the flight line because of the lines of perspective that a square tee creates.  When square tees point in another direction, it makes the hole feel very uncomfortable from a perspective view.  But I believe free form tees should fit the land forms which may or may not point them down the flight line.  Personally I agree with Shaun, you should pick out a target and orient your body and club to that intended line and not depend on the tee box or tee markers to set up your alignment.  I have a hard time feeling sorry for the golfer who uses this method and feel they should probably go take a lesson.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Richard Mandell,

That's where we are SO different.....I love peas, and yet, I hate pea soup.  And, my father was a lifetime Campbell Soup salesman!

I agree that I wouldn't go out of my way to orient golfers the wrong way.  And, I more often use rounded tees.  Even round tees can provide that orientation, providing the "bow of the boat" or outermost front curve is lined up on the centerline.  Then, it seems as if the tee is aimed down the fairway.

I know of people who advocate square tees lined up a few degrees left of center to counteract both the slice, and the average players tendency to set up a bit right, wrongly assuming that if his shoulder is pointed at the target, so is the ball's line of play.  Now, that's another example of how we architects are supposed to help golfers along, but I'm not buying!

[Richard_Mandell]

Tom Paul:

I guess I stand corrected.  I don't know Bill, so forgive me, but I don't think one should deliberately skew a tee toward an offline hazard or worse, OB.  Don't get me wrong, I also don't think it is our responsibility to help orient the golfer's alignment either.

Tees are the best example of simple form following function.  they should be like Jeff Brauer:  seen, stepped on, yet not noticed.  

Just kidding, Jeff.  By the way, I love carrot cake, yet...