Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: Ben Sims on July 11, 2024, 11:40:17 AM
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The region, the courses, the city. We had a spirited conversation about golf regions in Scotland last week and none of us could figure out why Aberdeenshire isn’t more popular with golf travelers. Royal Aberdeen, Cruden Bay, Murcar, Craigewan, Fraserburgh, Balmedie, Newburgh on Ythan….seems there’s more than enough to base a trip around for golf. And the airport is a pretty easy in/out. What am I missing?
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You’re missing Balmedie… but you’re also missing the haar.
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You’re missing Balmedie… but you’re also missing the haar.
Whoops. Genuinely wasn’t making a statement by forgetting Balmedie. Simple mistake. Also, had to look that one up. Haar, not Balmedie. How often is that sea fog hampering golf?
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I've actually been working on an itinerary for a future trip to the region, so this will prove a very useful topic. I've already played Cruden Bay, CB St. Olaf, and Royal Aberdeen, all of which I will definitely revisit. Below is the list of courses I had identified so far. I need to do more reading/research on several, and will certainly add others mentioned here.
Cruden Bay (Championship)
Cruden Bay (St Olaf)
Balnagask - Nigg Bay
Fraserburgh (Corbie Hill)
Inverallochy
Kings Links
Murcar
Newburgh-on-Ythan
Peterhead (Old)
Rosehearty
Royal Aberdeen (Balgownie)
Royal Aberdeen (Silverburn)
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#1 Too many Americans are obsessed with St. Andrews
#2 It takes a little more work to get there than other regions in Scotland
#3 Cruden Bay and Royal Aberdeen are the only 2 high profile/Top 100 courses (unless you add Trump Intl and that comes with a whole other load of baggage that we won't get into)
I have played Cruden Bay, Trump, and Royal Aberdeen and absolutely loved it. We stayed at the Malmaison Hotel which was great for our group. I've sent several other groups that direction and combining with a trip to Dornoch/Brora/Nairn/Castle Stuart. Which makes for a helluva golf trip. All have raved about it.
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Ben - the haar / sea-fog is unpredictable but can definitely hamper morning rounds through the summer. I grew up in Aberdeen but it’s a long time since I lived there. I wouldn’t think it is bad enough to stop one planning a golf trip to the area.
Brian - King’s Links and Nigg Bay / Balnagask are very rudimentary courses, albeit it with proper turf. Good for a few extra holes unplanned but not worthy to work in to an organised trip.
With Balmedie 1 (and soon to be 2) added in, just north of Aberdeen has become a really good golf destination (John - I think you can include Murcar as close to top-tier). It is lacking a really good hotel on that side of the city. It is also lacking a more gentrified base village / town which could be seen as either a positive or a negative dependent on your point of view
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The region, the courses, the city. We had a spirited conversation about golf regions in Scotland last week and none of us could figure out why Aberdeenshire isn’t more popular with golf travelers. Royal Aberdeen, Cruden Bay, Murcar, Craigewan, Fraserburgh, Balmedie, Newburgh on Ythan….seems there’s more than enough to base a trip around for golf. And the airport is a pretty easy in/out. What am I missing?
Away from the immediate coast there’s Duff House Royal and Ballater.
If driving from further south there’s Arbroath, even Blairgowrie.
By the way, Craigewan is aka Peterhead.
Ally makes valid points about the haar, Kings Links and Balnagask. In the city there’s also Hazlehead #1.
Atb
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I played Cruden Bay, Fraserburgh, and Royal Aberdeen last August. The golf was superb. Neither RA nor Fraserburgh get enough attention on here. But Ally is onto something regarding the lack of a base camp. We stayed in central Aberdeen which did not offer much in terms of charm, liveliness, nor restaurants. Cruden Bay did not offer any obvious good alternatives.
I was first off the tee as a one ball at RA. Beautiful morning with no haar (yep, needed to look it up too).
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If playing Fraserburgh the 9 hole Rosehearty is a blast. About 5 miles away. Not links but clifftop . 5 par 3's and less than 2000 yards. If it's quiet play 5,6,7 or whatever group. Smiles all round, but only the careful golfer will score well.
https://www.roseheartygolfclub.com/
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I just returned from Aberdeen a couple weeks ago. First, a nice way to travel up there from London was the overnight sleeper train, the Caladonian. Thanks to DT's advice this was a enjoyable alternative to flying, it has many stops in Scotland so something for almost anyone going there.
The city of Aberdeen itself I felt, had quite a bit to offer. The Euro was being played then and very lively crowds gathered outside to watch on screens or in pubs. I hit the Grosvenor Casino right by my hotel a couple times as well. While not dozens of restaurant options, there were quite a few modern places and of course pub food. I did visit what was apparently the first Mackie's Ice Cream parlor in the city center. I didn't know the family was from the area and buy Mackie's in the grocery store internationally.
Overall, I felt Aberdeen was a nice small city which probably due to competition from St. Andrews/Highlands/Lothian gets overlooked. Played Royal Aberdeen and Cruden Bay. Loved the quirk of CB as everyone does who plays there, similar to a North Berwick which is a good compliment. Royal Aberdeen was a wonderful links, played on a relatively calm day. I hit the ball well for me and just couldn't score as the mistakes led to losing a ball in the gorse which was lush.
So why doesn't Aberdeen get more attention or priority for visitors? I would surmise that if you are taking your first trip almost all visitors want to go to St. Andrews. For the savy visitor probably Lothian or Highlands comes as your second trip if you are staying in Scotland. The entire UK/Ireland gets bundled together for visitors probably and you go where the golf is, with so many great options Aberdeen has a hard time competing with those. However, I agree with Ben in that you will have a wonderful time yet.
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Just in case folks are given the wrong impression, Aberdeen is Scotland’s third largest city, multiples bigger than St Andrews or North Berwick.
Oil made it affluent in the 70’s and 80’s. Union Street was one of Europe’s great streets but is now a shadow of itself with all retail and culture removed. However, down by School Hill, Back Wynd and Marischal College is worth walking around.
The West end of the city remains the nicest residential area (so Malmaison is a decent small hotel choice).
Old Aberdeen (where the University is based) is a must visit area, dating back to the 1400’s.
But to be close to the golf, you need to be north and there is a lack of good places to stay around there.
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I lived in the region for 8 years either side of the millennium, so here are my recommendations in addition to the good advice offered so far.
Stonehaven is well worth a visit. Pebble Beach like clifftop golf. Short and quirky. Great fish and chips in the harbour.
Heading inland (if the haar is in town) is worthwhile. Heading up the Dee Valley is one of the world's great drives and within an hour will take you past the entrance to Banchory, Aboyne and Ballater golf clubs. A bit further will get you to the dizzy heights of Braemar, the UK's highest 18 hole course.
The modern golf on offer at Newmachar and Meldrum House is good, but not what you come to the North East for.
Edzell is within an hour and another good inland track, as is the historic links of Montrose. Play it before it disappears into the North Sea
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I just don't get the love for Royal Aberdeen.
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I just don't get the love for Royal Aberdeen.
Interesting take.
“A noble links” as Bernard Darwin described it and the 6th oldest golf club in the World.
Might not be the most visually stunning course in NE Scotland but it’s plenty challenging, severely so at times, more so than some nearby courses that maybe look nicer in photographs.
Atb
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I grew up playing at Royal Aberdeen but it’s been over 30 years since I played there so I must get back to be more objective.
My feeling is that the front nine is slightly overrated - do love the 1st hole though - and the back nine is slightly underrated.
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I thought RA was terrific. Perhaps because I am a fan of blind and semi-blind shots. Regardless, the land movement is exceptional, and it uses the dunes to make even the straight holes seem as if they move one way or the other. There is good variety in the length of the holes particularly when the wind direction is factored in. The bunkering presents challenges but allows options. The greens have interesting exterior contours. I thought that the Par 3s were a bit weak as a set although I liked 17 visually and it did require a tee shot requiring distance control. 16-18 are a strong finish.
I agree with Ally that the front did not fully meet the lofty hype but the back exceeding expectations more than made up for it.
We played RA on a trip that included TOC, Gleneagles Kings and Queens, Cruden Bay, and Elie among others. RA more than held its own.
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Royal Aberdeen v. Balmedie? Strictly on the course architecture.
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I've actually been working on an itinerary for a future trip to the region, so this will prove a very useful topic. I've already played Cruden Bay, CB St. Olaf, and Royal Aberdeen, all of which I will definitely revisit. Below is the list of courses I had identified so far. I need to do more reading/research on several, and will certainly add others mentioned here.
Cruden Bay (Championship)
Cruden Bay (St Olaf)
Balnagask - Nigg Bay
Fraserburgh (Corbie Hill)
Inverallochy
Kings Links
Murcar
Newburgh-on-Ythan
Peterhead (Old)
Rosehearty
Royal Aberdeen (Balgownie)
Royal Aberdeen (Silverburn)
No Hazlehead?
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I've actually been working on an itinerary for a future trip to the region, so this will prove a very useful topic. I've already played Cruden Bay, CB St. Olaf, and Royal Aberdeen, all of which I will definitely revisit. Below is the list of courses I had identified so far. I need to do more reading/research on several, and will certainly add others mentioned here.
Cruden Bay (Championship)
Cruden Bay (St Olaf)
Balnagask - Nigg Bay
Fraserburgh (Corbie Hill)
Inverallochy
Kings Links
Murcar
Newburgh-on-Ythan
Peterhead (Old)
Rosehearty
Royal Aberdeen (Balgownie)
Royal Aberdeen (Silverburn)
If your list is that deep add Stonehaven. There are some terrific holes and the club doesn’t feel super golfy.
If in Aberdeen hit The Grill on Union St. The country needs more boozers like this.
Ciao
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“A noble links” as Bernard Darwin described it and the 6th oldest golf club in the World.
Might not be the most visually stunning course in NE Scotland but it’s plenty challenging, severely so at times, more so than some nearby courses that maybe look nicer in photographs.
Atb
There are lots of courses that are challenging, but not interesting. I'm not saying it's a bad course, but I've been there twice, and there aren't any holes I want to go back and see again.
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“A noble links” as Bernard Darwin described it and the 6th oldest golf club in the World.
Might not be the most visually stunning course in NE Scotland but it’s plenty challenging, severely so at times, more so than some nearby courses that maybe look nicer in photographs.
Atb
There are lots of courses that are challenging, but not interesting. I'm not saying it's a bad course, but I've been there twice, and there aren't any holes I want to go back and see again.
You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
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“A noble links” as Bernard Darwin described it and the 6th oldest golf club in the World.
Might not be the most visually stunning course in NE Scotland but it’s plenty challenging, severely so at times, more so than some nearby courses that maybe look nicer in photographs.
Atb
There are lots of courses that are challenging, but not interesting. I'm not saying it's a bad course, but I've been there twice, and there aren't any holes I want to go back and see again.
Interesting.
Not to name three examples the wee 8th with its narrow green where trajectory is so important or the 9th with its use of the diagonal ridge and fall-offs or the 14th with the diagonal wall in front of the green? Might be worth another look-see as the 1st green and a few areas along the front-9 are under sea erosion threat. The first-6 and the last-3 on the Silverburn course are worth a look too.
Atb
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
If I recall, at the time, a 7 for you translated as something in the running for top 100 world...no?
Ciao
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I had a fabulous trip to Aberdeen two years ago. We played Royal Aberdeen, Murcar, Trump, and Cruden Bay. All thoroughly enjoyable.
We stayed at the Bridge of Don Premier Inn. It is ideally situated and perfectly acceptable. I paid £100 for three nights.
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
Is there a more disparate world top 100?
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale .
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
8 seems high, but 5 must be from a blind man. That is a crazy low score.
Ciao
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
Is there a more disparate world top 100?
Finally, a course without groupthink.
What's a rater to do?
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
Is there a more disparate world top 100?
Finally, a course without groupthink.
What's a rater to do?
Go play it again! :)
Atb
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You sound harsh, but I don’t know what that translates to on your scale 😎.
Ciao
I think it translated to a 6, if I recall correctly.
Tom gave it a 7; Ran an 8; Masa a 5; Darius an 8.
Is there a more disparate world top 100?
Finally, a course without groupthink.
What's a rater to do?
Honestly, it’s immediately right behind TOC and NB as a course I must play in Scotland as a result of this thread and the historical lack of consensus for RA on here.
Also, maybe I’m a ‘neck from west GA, but the West End and Rosemount areas of Aberdeen sure seem nicer than the average neighborhood in bigger UK cities.
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I grew up playing at Royal Aberdeen but it’s been over 30 years since I played there so I must get back to be more objective.
My feeling is that the front nine is slightly overrated - do love the 1st hole though - and the back nine is slightly underrated.
I don't know who authored the article about Royal Aberdeen in the "Courses by Country" section of this site, but it opens with " Royal Aberdeen... is widely known for possessing one of the finest first nines in golf. This is unarguable, but what seems debatable is the merit of second nine."
Link to photos of the course from the summer of 2022.: https://www.flickr.com/photos/golfcoursepix/albums/72177720300035980/with/52168431024/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/golfcoursepix/albums/72177720300035980/with/52168431024/)
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The region (and the Scottish Highlands in general) certainly got a lot of love on GD's list this year https://www.golfdigest.com/story/worlds-100-greatest-golf-courses-2024-2025 (https://www.golfdigest.com/story/worlds-100-greatest-golf-courses-2024-2025) . Trump Aberdeen up 33 spots, Cruden Bay up 30, Castle Stuart up 21, Nairn in the top 100, Dornoch up to #2...
Maybe that's a sign that more visitor attention is coming.
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My first trip to Aberdeen coincided with the annual Offshore Europe, a huge event I was completely unaware of. This was the early days of the internet and while I managed to get the golf booked, finding a hotel was impossible and we ended up having to stay in Keith and driving for 1 1/2 hours each way for two days to play Royal Aberdeen, Murcar, Newburgh and Duff House Royal. Well worth it in retrospect but beware of Offshore Europe in early September.
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My dutch nephew graduated from the Univ of Aberdeen. I really liked the attractive old part of campus.
Is this an itinerary you could largely do via public transportation with some supplemental Ubers/Taxis ?
Looks like you can take a train from Glasgow airport to Aberdeen. R Aberdeen and Murcar look easy to get to.
Next year I will have more time to travel and would like to find a golf "home" in Scotland and also play some with friends in the Lothians and up in Dornoch as well. Looks like there is a train to Inverness from Aberdeen.
Possibly a membership, too if available.
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Go play it again! :)
Atb
I went to St. Andrews and Iona and Machrihanish and The Machrie and Ardfin and Durness instead, and I do not regret any of those choices.
Going back to a course in Scotland you don’t love is kinda dumb, because there are so many others to try.
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Go play it again! :)
Atb
I went to St. Andrews and Iona and Machrihanish and The Machrie and Ardfin and Durness instead, and I do not regret any of those choices.
Going back to a course in Scotland you don’t love is kinda dumb, because there are so many others to try.
Maybe it’s changed? Never mind.
What did you think of Ardfin?
(Note: A recent GB&I Top-100 ranking placed it at #15)
Atb
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Peterhead looks pleasant - sadly no Arble tour (yet?)
https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm (https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm)
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8 seems high, but 5 must be from a blind man. That is a crazy low score.
Agreed. I absolutely loved it (though Ally may be right regarding the two 9s) and have it as one of my favourite courses in Scotland. I'd be interested to understand better what Tom didn't like about it (though a 7 is, I thought, a high standard?). But a 5 is lunacy. Bad hangover, perhaps?
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Peterhead looks pleasant - sadly no Arble tour (yet?)
https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm (https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm)
Brian
I'm not sure Sean has played Peterhead but sure he'll advise. I have played it, several years ago with Jon Wigget, and we both enjoyed it but I wouldn't rate it above RA, Murcar, Fraserburgh etc. For a start the first few (4 holes ?) are a bit of an open meadow in terms of character. They have also suffered a bit with dune erosion in recent years and lost at least one or two holes from memory which has meant the course has by necessity been redesigned on a smaller footprint, and as a consequence feels a bit disjointed. That said, worth a hit if in the area as it does have some very fine holes.
Niall
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Peterhead looks pleasant - sadly no Arble tour (yet?)
https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm (https://youtu.be/9ym9xs8NVi4?si=IdaUW1o1xaSeiUQm)
Brian
I'm not sure Sean has played Peterhead but sure he'll advise. I have played it, several years ago with Jon Wigget, and we both enjoyed it but I wouldn't rate it above RA, Murcar, Fraserburgh etc. For a start the first few (4 holes ?) are a bit of an open meadow in terms of character. They have also suffered a bit with dune erosion in recent years and lost at least one or two holes from memory which has meant the course has by necessity been redesigned on a smaller footprint, and as a consequence feels a bit disjointed. That said, worth a hit if in the area as it does have some very fine holes.
Niall
That's useful info. It seemed like it might be worthwhile if already in the area, so glad to hear you think it is. Sad to hear about the impact of dune erosion. Perhaps I should move this up the schedule, as I did with Montrose.
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I recently saw Fraserburgh, which was my wifes favorite walk, is offering an international life membership at a very attractive rate. I loved the course and the out of the way sort of place. My wife rolled her eyes when I told her about it. Maybe it will be of interest to someone here.
https://fraserburghgolfclub.org/view-article?newsarticleid=3303
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We stayed at the Bridge of Don Premier Inn. It is ideally situated and perfectly acceptable. I paid £100 for three nights.
£100 for three nights!?!? Did you have to bring your own linens and share a bed with a stranger?
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I have stayed at several Premier Inns in Scotland and also in & around London. They have all been well run and a very good value.
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I have stayed at several Premier Inns in Scotland and also in & around London. They have all been well run and a very good value.
Agreed. They operate dynamic pricing so book early for best rates. The also have supplements, so for an extra charge you can cancel for no extra charge at a later date.
Staying in Aberdeen City Centre, for the nightlife, this July was approx £70pppn. I booked early: a core 3 days at base rate and then two separate bookings to add a day either side to allow me to fine tune the trip nearer the time. in the event I used the first night but not the last, so they retained £10 when I cancelled that.
I'm a fan of RA and I think stressing the difference in quality of the two nines is a groupthink hangover from long ago, which doesn't take into account that the back 9 did have significant work 20+(?) years ago.
Cool clubhouse too.
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My wife and i spent a week in Cruden Bay at the Kilmarnock Arms Hotel and loved every minute.Small hotel with a very fine restauraunt featuring fresh seafood from Peterhead, one of hte most active commercial fishing ports in the UK. Slains Castle is a fine walk and self guided tour.
Aberdeen features 52 castles and fortified estates and we toured Fahrie(sic) Castle and heard some of the creepiest ghost stories of all time. Lord Aberdeen's estate is a fine Country house and Pitmedden Garden is top rate with formal walled garden bedding that is something to behold. The ditillery we visited dated tp 1790 and had been bought by the Japanese who soaked up a fair share of its small prodction but the whisky was grand.We hope to go there next year for a good long spell.I remain unconvinced of RA. No one has yet described why the holes on the back nine are good. On this site the course description omits entirely any word on holes 10-16. One plays at three hideous council estate hi rises as a backdrop. I was given a print by a Scottish friend and these played so prominenetly in the view that i never hung it and put it in a garage sale. As far as comparison to Cruden Bay in the top world 100 list I consulted CR bested RA by 30 or 40 slots.But as in many debates these days proponents simply supply a narrative without facts or backup expecting us i guess to trust their veracity.Back to the original question though I find Aberdeen to be a terrifiic destination for many tastes and interests so maybe Darlene and I will see some of you up there next year.