Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture Discussion Group => Topic started by: Jeff_Lewis on August 07, 2017, 09:30:13 PM
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I have always marveled at how in the middle of May NY area golf courses are pretty much asleep and by the time the US Open rolls around they can be perfect. Is the PGA limiting their geographical options by moving the PGA to May?
Any Bethpage denizens want to weigh on in the condition of the course in May?
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I played Bethpage the year before the first Open in early to Mid May. The course was perfect and it was close to 90 degrees.
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Rob-
It will be interesting to see what happens with regards to Oak Hill hosting the PGA Championship in 2023. As you and I both know, it could be 83 and just beautiful or 48 degrees and pouring rain...
I have heard some rumblings of a potential buyout of the 2023 contract so I guess we will have to wait and see.
If the PGA does in fact buy out the contract I would venture to guess that Oak Hill and Rochester has seen it's last major.
The only other possibility would be if the renovation of the east course turns out to be so spectacular that the USGA would want to bring another U.S. Open there...although if (a big "if") that ever did happen it would likely be many years from now and you and I will be old men >:(
John
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I think you're just as likely to get good weather for May as you are August. One has a concern of cool, damp weather. The other has a concern of super hot and thunderstorms.
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I play it every weekend. The biggest difference I notice in May is that the rough isn't as thick. Most everything else is ready to go from opening day. And looks like it will be late May, the weekend prior to Memorial Day, so that helps.
Edit: I am reminded that, thanks to a brutal winter a couple years ago, the course opened with a number of temp greens and didn't reopen all greens until late May.
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I feel like this may be opening up a can of worms bringing it up but... as our world seems to get warmer could the limitations of the PGA being in May be shortlived?
Not to get too speculative as I don't know much about what will actually happen (even climate scientists couldn't tell you for sure on a region by region basis), although there's a likelihood of more severe winter storms, perhaps we'd see warmer conditions more conducive to playing earlier in the year as well.
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I think you're just as likely to get good weather for May as you are August. One has a concern of cool, damp weather. The other has a concern of super hot and thunderstorms.
This is the point I am trying to make too
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I don't understand all the hoopla about the PGA limiting its options by moving to May. I used to manage a golf course in CO at 8000 feet, and in April we were shoveling the snow off the greens. But by mid May we were going strong. The supers at the courses that are considered for these events know what they're doing...and the courses can be ready. The weather might be dodgy, but isn't it also dodgy in August?
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The fescue won't be up in May so the contrast between green and gold won't be there
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The fescue won't be up in May so the contrast between green and gold won't be there
This is a secret initiative in an effort to speed up play. ;)
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I play it every weekend. The biggest difference I notice in May is that the rough isn't as thick. Most everything else is ready to go from opening day. And looks like it will be late May, the weekend prior to Memorial Day, so that helps.
Edit: I am reminded that, thanks to a brutal winter a couple years ago, the course opened with a number of temp greens and didn't reopen all greens until late May.
I understand what MFe is saying, but I find an equally tough element to the rough in mid-late May when it's first growing up...the grass is getting long, but is not yet strong, stressed or at all crispy-wispy enough to support the ball...so the ball goes right to the bottom; "bird's nest" lies are a frequent result.
cheers vk
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I play it every weekend. The biggest difference I notice in May is that the rough isn't as thick. Most everything else is ready to go from opening day. And looks like it will be late May, the weekend prior to Memorial Day, so that helps.
Edit: I am reminded that, thanks to a brutal winter a couple years ago, the course opened with a number of temp greens and didn't reopen all greens until late May.
I understand what MFe is saying, but I find an equally tough element to the rough in mid-late May when it's first growing up...the grass is getting long, but is not yet strong, stressed or at all crispy-wispy enough to support the ball...so the ball goes right to the bottom; "bird's nest" lies are a frequent result.
cheers vk
True. But in my experience, I'd rather have the consistency of it sitting down in thin rough over hoping it props up in thick rough every once in a while. And I wish I had a nickel for every time I thought it looked like it was sitting up in thick rough, only to find out I was wrong after my mighty wack goes about 25 yards.
Maybe they'll bring the fairways in another few yards to make up for it. That'll really get the tourists excited. After all, the 15th hole is only 24 yards wide in the landing area. Surely we can donate a few of those to the ocean of rough that surrounds it.
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Generally cooler temps in May, but usually better weather than August. The PGA also stated they believe more venues open up with the earlier, date, including southern region courses where it's too darn hot in August.
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Come to Texas in May for the PGA. We would love to have you and the weather will be great!
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I played the first week of May and it was in tremendous shape. A regular I played with noted how the native grasses hadn't grown in yet and how much easier the course plays without grass. I don't seem to recall any temporary greens.
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Golf Digest had a pretty good write-up with Bethpage's director of agronomy:
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/a-pga-championship-in-the-northeast-in-may-we-took-bethpage-black-for-a-test-run
Generally, the greens are their best during the early spring (FWIW, I had the distinction of playing the first public round this year!) bc of the poa issue I assume.
However, I strongly disagree that the rough might be somehow easier to deal with in August vs. May. The stuff during the recent NY State Open was nearly impossible - 3 feet off the fairway and you might not find your ball. Somehow, that didn't stop an amateur from shooting 64. Maybe it's maintenance practices, but the rough is always manageable in May. If you don't have narly rough, I don't see any purpose to the narrowness of those fairways. All it does is prevent your shot from ending up in the real crap.
They actually thinned the fescue before the Barclays last year, I assume in part to allow for spectator access. I don't anticipate the fescue being as big of an issue, with the exceptions being in the areas around fairway bunkers on holes like 4, 6, 7, 10-11, and 18.
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Wonder how the poa will be on some of these courses will be in May. A cool spring will have some seedheads lingering around....