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Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
I strongly believe the only way out of this economy for myself and many other will mean going back. Back to what?  Back to the basics of course. I am currently looking at a project and making sure I want to participate because the budget will be or needs to be very-very limited. I want to make sure that something of quality can still be produced without negatively effecting my companyīs market perception. Here are the currently realities and how I am looking at dealing with them and getting comfortable about moving forward.
1.   Irrigation cost are through the roof and taking the biggest part of the budget for naturalist or minimalist architects. Here in Argentina itīs even a bigger issue because the government is committed to support local manufactures and therefore heavily taxes anything imported, up to an additional 80%. So a typical wall to wall system is gonna price around 2 million. No thank you, to make matters worst, they are trying to stop all imports and many here are beginning to fear, there wonīt be any golf balls in three more months.  So I think we will recommend a single row system that starts one hundred yards from the tees. The area has good rainfall, similar to Oregon but dry in the summer. We should be able to establish non irrigated areas without a problem with sheep and hard fescues and let them thin out or brown out during the summer eight week season.
2.   The project is associated with a ski resort. Meaning surrounding mountains and lots of streams. We are trying to locate a source of water near and with a higher elevation.  Create a small pool in the stream and send the water to the irrigation system. No pumps, no electricity cost, less headaches. Good filtering system will be needed.
3.   Soil looks good, not analyzed yet but my experience tells me loam-maybe even a little in the sandy loam zone. I would guess infiltration between one and two inches per hour. Use this soil and make push up greens with good movement to facilitate surface drainage, as was done in the past. No six hundred thousand dollar USGA greens!
4.   Few sand bunkers and more grass bunker and grass depressions. Below the half to one meter loam you find gravel. Should facilitate in inexpensive drainage for all features and hazards.
5.   Clearing of 50 meter corridors and expanding in the landing to seventy. No trucks, no lakes, minimum dirt movement. The property has good natural movement and some great natural features. Generate some dirt for the greens and surrounding in nearby areas, fix a few drainage problems and adios!
6.    Fescue , wall to wall. This will never be a tournament course.  We currently donīt have the pressure for ultra fast greens. The golfer will be more than happy with 9 on a stempmeter day to day.
7.   Last but not least…Don has sold me, five gang and tractor for the fairways and a couple of nationals for the rough.
Conclusion,   I think with the correct property quality golf can still be developed and at a reasonable price if we just go back in time and stick with the basics. Courses like this have to be accessible to a greater economical range of clientele, which can help the game expand not retract.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2012, 02:54:34 PM by Randy Thompson »

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2012, 10:59:11 AM »
I WANT TO PLAY THIS COURSE!

Heck I don't even care if you irrigate with a hose and crawling sprinkler like was used when I was young.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2012, 11:34:04 AM »
Mendoza?   Aren't those vineyards mostly in good soil?

How much throw can you get from a single line head?

Have you moved from Chile?

Questions, questions, questions!

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2012, 11:39:25 AM »
Mendoza?   Aren't those vineyards mostly in good soil?

How much throw can you get from a single line head?

Have you moved from Chile?

Questions, questions, questions!

The best vineyards would be in very poor soil.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2012, 11:45:20 AM »
Patagonia, no Mendoza!
The heads will throw about 27 meters, sixty yards, in a circle,, so that should give a rectangula arear of 45 yards and maybe a little more. Going to do that exercise when I get home and then I can tell you exactly. Home to Chile! Still traveling a lot and golf is much more developed in Argentina than any other South American country, so more movement. May have to move back here some day, but not yet!

JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2012, 12:29:51 PM »
Good luck Randy. Looking forward to hearing the progress as you move forward, assuming you're comfotable sharing some more.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2012, 01:05:28 PM »
Randy is the "Juanito, semen de manzana" de Sud America.  ;) ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2012, 01:32:21 PM »
Randy is the "Juanito, semen de manzana" de Sud America.  ;) ;D
lol
I hope you mean semilla, although semen could be considered a semilla also ;D
Cheers

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2012, 02:20:25 PM »
Ha!  Yeah, when I looked up seed (my dictionary didn't have 'appleseed', it said 'semen' and I had sensemilla rolling around in the back of my mind.  So, I went with semen, but thought I may be risking the miss use for the kind of seed that spills out upon the ground, in sheep herding circles...  ::) ;D

I envy your position there on that frontier, as I've said before.  Chile looks do darn cool and golf land development exciting from aerials.  It must be like being in Monterey Peninsula 100 years ago.  Good luck in Patagonia!

No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2012, 04:54:16 PM »
Patagonia, no Mendoza!
The heads will throw about 27 meters, sixty yards, in a circle,, so that should give a rectangula arear of 45 yards and maybe a little more. Going to do that exercise when I get home and then I can tell you exactly. Home to Chile! Still traveling a lot and golf is much more developed in Argentina than any other South American country, so more movement. May have to move back here some day, but not yet!

Patagonia!  That is such an exotic name.

What would be the equivalent North American latitude?  Just wondering about the climate.

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2012, 05:04:43 PM »
Wild Bill, it seems to me that Inverness, in N.S. is comparable latitude and a pretty exotic name.  I thought you have already been to every golfable latitude and longitude on the globe.  ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2012, 05:07:31 PM »
Bill,
I would guess oregon. Thats what it reminds me of, anyways. Will post a few pictures tonight. 80 inches of rain, hot eight week summer!

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2012, 05:33:12 PM »
Wild Bill, it seems to me that Inverness, in N.S. is comparable latitude and a pretty exotic name.  I thought you have already been to every golfable latitude and longitude on the globe.  ;D

I have been to Buenos Aires and Santiago but only for sightseeing.

San Francisco is latitude 38.  I'm not sure Patagonia is that far south.   I thought Santiago = Los Angeles.

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2012, 06:12:22 PM »
For me Samtiago-San Diego
Buenos Aires-Atlanta
Patagonia starts about sixteen hours south of Buenos Aires....16 hours north of atlanta and you are where..conn?
but I compared with the west coast because of the 80 inches of rain...conclusion - Oregon
We have a lot of nerds on this site that love this shit, maybe one of them will take the time and give us the exact facts in relation to this. I am nerdy enough to do such an exercise but just donīt have the time right now. Take care!

Daryl "Turboe" Boe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #14 on: April 18, 2012, 06:45:09 PM »
I was about to ask Randy some questions about my first ever trip to Chile and Argentina coming up a week from today, but even with my remedial Spanish ability the fact that you described him as the "Semen from an Apple" scared me off a little bit.

Seriously though I will maybe drop you an IM here to ask you some questions.

Man you gotta love GCA, there is more information on this place, and great people I have met over the years.  Funny that a week before I leave I stumble across this thread...
Instagram: @thequestfor3000

"Time spent playing golf is not deducted from ones lifespan."

"We sleep safely in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #15 on: April 18, 2012, 07:09:35 PM »
I was about to ask Randy some questions about my first ever trip to Chile and Argentina coming up a week from today, but even with my remedial Spanish ability the fact that you described him as the "Semen from an Apple" scared me off a little bit.

Seriously though I will maybe drop you an IM here to ask you some questions.

Man you gotta love GCA, there is more information on this place, and great people I have met over the years.  Funny that a week before I leave I stumble across this thread...
Donīt be afraid, he tried to refer to me as Johnny Appleseed, you canīt use a dictionary for these things. Excellent that your coming down. Drop me a mail, will see if we can get togehter for wine or an asado o tour a course in construction...probably you have a full schedule but let me know, would love to get togehter. Need golf alternatives in Ba o Santiago can help you and maybe get you some freebies. Bring lost of clothes in case you decide to stay. look forward to hearig from you!

Daryl "Turboe" Boe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #16 on: April 18, 2012, 07:14:05 PM »
I was about to ask Randy some questions about my first ever trip to Chile and Argentina coming up a week from today, but even with my remedial Spanish ability the fact that you described him as the "Semen from an Apple" scared me off a little bit.

Seriously though I will maybe drop you an IM here to ask you some questions.

Man you gotta love GCA, there is more information on this place, and great people I have met over the years.  Funny that a week before I leave I stumble across this thread...
Donīt be afraid, he tried to refer to me as Johnny Appleseed, you canīt use a dictionary for these things. Excellent that your coming down. Drop me a mail, will see if we can get togehter for wine or an asado o tour a course in construction...probably you have a full schedule but let me know, would love to get togehter. Need golf alternatives in Ba o Santiago can help you and maybe get you some freebies. Bring lost of clothes in case you decide to stay. look forward to hearig from you!

Thanks Randy, I sent you an IM about 5 minutes ago.  I will look forward to hearing your thoughts.
Instagram: @thequestfor3000

"Time spent playing golf is not deducted from ones lifespan."

"We sleep safely in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #17 on: April 18, 2012, 08:04:39 PM »

Garland...you win a free International membership!


A shot of some of the back nine



This will be a good hole because I am using the Cooreīs method of following the animal tracks!!




Nice potential landing area after the rise...bore a few depressions into that slope and were ready to go!
« Last Edit: April 18, 2012, 08:09:49 PM by Randy Thompson »

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #18 on: April 18, 2012, 08:35:19 PM »

Garland...you win a free International membership!
...

Looks like Patagonia to me.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Don't know Argentina too well, but I recall they are wineries on the Rio Negro in Patagonia. Near as I can figure from Google Earth, that's about 41 degrees south. Bandon is 43 degrees north, so you are more likely Oregon/California border or so equiv.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
By the way, don't trust that Turboe character, he played basketball for and graduated from South Dakota School of Mines and Technology, aka South Dakota Tech.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Daryl "Turboe" Boe

  • Karma: +0/-0
By the way, don't trust that Turboe character, he played basketball for and graduated from South Dakota School of Mines and Technology, aka South Dakota Tech.

Dang, strike two!!!
Instagram: @thequestfor3000

"Time spent playing golf is not deducted from ones lifespan."

"We sleep safely in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

Carl Nichols

  • Karma: +0/-0
Randy,
How long until Cristina nationalizes your design business?

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Going forward in this economy, is the solution going back!
« Reply #23 on: April 18, 2012, 11:33:21 PM »
For me Samtiago-San Diego
Buenos Aires-Atlanta
Patagonia starts about sixteen hours south of Buenos Aires....16 hours north of atlanta and you are where..conn?
but I compared with the west coast because of the 80 inches of rain...conclusion - Oregon
We have a lot of nerds on this site that love this shit, maybe one of them will take the time and give us the exact facts in relation to this. I am nerdy enough to do such an exercise but just donīt have the time right now. Take care!

Culturally it's Buenos Aires - Paris.   Loved that place!

Turboe you will love it.  Call me before you go.

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Carl,
Wow she is really getting dangerous. Is she trying to compete with Chavez or what? Chile doesnīt allow 2 succesive terms, looking at past records of most second term leaders around the world, the more I am favor of one term stands, viva Chile! Good god, i am flying Argentina Aerolinas tomorrow, hope she doesnīt take that back and if she does I think I wll walk back to Chile! Incredible, no other words!
« Last Edit: April 18, 2012, 11:40:28 PM by Randy Thompson »