[Jimmy Muratt]

The classic short Par 3 is a hole which is often overlooked but incredibly important to the balance of a layout.  I enjoy courses which have a group of Par 3's that test a wide variety of clubs in your bag.  

Which of these short Par 3's is your favorite?

Cypress Point # 15
Pine Valley # 10
Pacific Dunes #11
Pebble Beach # 7
Sand Hills #17

That is quite a group right there.  Personally, I'd have to take Cypress #15, closely followed by Sand Hills #17.

[ted janeczek]

having played it at least 40+ times i can't see how there is a better par 3 in terms of difficulty in all types of conditions than the 17th at sand hills. they even closed down the rarely used "back tee". didn't need it.

[Mike Benham]

How about the 3rd at Spyglass ...

http://www.californiacoastline.org/cgi-bin/image.cgi?image=1117&mode=sequential&flags=0

And the 15th at Cypress ...

http://www.californiacoastline.org/cgi-bin/image.cgi?image=1123&mode=sequential&flags=0

and I think the 15th at Pasatiempo has a more difficult tee shot than the 7th at Pebble ....

[THuckaby2]

Good call re 15 Pasa, Mike.  I swear there are gremlins in that little hollow there, swatting down every shot such that the ball seems to go about 15% shorter.  I watched a very strong, very good player there hit 7iron from 150 awhile back and only then did it dawn on me that either the distance is wrong or some atmospheric anomaly is going on... one way or the other one has to hit a LOT of club to that tiny green, more than one thinks and more than one would like.

All that being said, it doesn't make the very top of this, not by my take anyway...   It is a good nomination though.

I'd put them:

Sand Hills #17
Cypress Point # 15
Pebble Beach # 7
Sand Hills #17
Pacific Dunes #11

In fact I'd put Pasa 15 in front of Pacific Dunes, as well as #11 at Applebrook GC near Philadelphia, and yeah, maybe even #3 Spyglass also (another good call there, Mike).  I don't put PD #11 as among the best holes on that course... it is a short par 3, it is damn good, it is near the ocean... but it doesn't belong with this exalted group, IMO.

I left out PV #10 because that's the only one I haven't played...

TH

[Joel_Stewart]

I consider myself lucky to have played them all and its tough to pick what would be my favorite.  Every time I approch the tee on those holes I thank my lucky stars and wonder what my friends and family are doing at that exact moment.

I think the hardest is the 10th at Pine Valley because of the slope and speed of the green?

If I had to pick one I probably would choose the 7th at Pebble.

[Jim Sweeney]

Cypress #15. It doesn't have to be about dufficulty, though that is a factor. Something that physically beuatiful just has to be designed perfrctly into the site, and I agree with the comment about anticipating the next hole.

Pebble #7. A 107yd 5 iron. Damn near had to dribbe it off the tee. A look down the coastline from 6 fairway wets one's appetite for the future.

Pine Valley #10. I hit my shot and my opponent started yelling, "get in the DA! Get in the DA!" Thought I was easily past that, until my ball struck the green about 2.5 feet over that gateway to the underworld. It was our first hole of the day, and escaping the DA probably is what allowed me to beat the bet.

Cannot comment on the others- only been there in my dreams.

[A_Clay_Man]

For all falling in the same category(short hole) they are all considerably different and almost impossible to choose an absolute favorite(Haven't seen PV). Maybe I should hedge and put one twice ayhuh TH?

I would say that I would cherish the op to have one more go at all of them before deciding

[ian]

I agree with the aforementioned.

One I really enjoyed was the 17th at TPC @ Sawgrass. Its only a wedge or a nine, but its a great once a year shot. Week in and week out, I would choose another hole.

[JIm Sweeney]

Ian Andrew:

Good call. I played TPC Sawgrass in the '94 Amateur. During the practice rounds that green looked huge. I even asked my caddie how anyone could miss a target that large with a nine iron.

You can't imagine how small that green looks when the shot really means something. I think that effect adds to the hole's character.

I did par it in qualifying and made match play, but missed it in the first round of matches, lost my one hole lead, tied 18 and lost in extra holes. Only time I was down all day.

Stupid $@*&$ hole.

[Steve Lapper]

Hey!! What about #12 at Somerset, #2 at Garden City, #2 at Prarie Dunes,....all great...given that...#17 at Sand Hills still remains the favorite!!...closely followed by #10 at PV.

Sphincter tightening at its finest....

Golf as a form of constipation!

[amen]

12 at augusta.

[ian]

The 17th at Seminole is an absolute gem.

[redanman]

Eleven Shinnecock, thank you.

[ForkaB]

I'm with you shivas.  15 CPC is the connoisseur's "dumb blonde."

redanman, thanks for noting #11 SH--hope Tom "Lucky as Hell to escape with a Snowman" Huckaby is looking at this!  Speaking of #11's, TH isvery right about Applebrook.

More 11's.....of the 5 listed (3 of which I've played) I'll say 11 PD is the "best", not just because my total score was 10 in my 4 rounds, but also because it has much more movement in the green than the others I have played (CPC and PB) and I'm sure would be even more of a bear in strong winds than the othres.

If we extend the argument from the 5 listed and others mentioned, I'll add:

2, 6 and 10 at Dornoch

Homer "Doh" Goodale

[Tom Doak]

I personally think every one of them is overrated, as far as the golf goes.  They are all great settings which is why they are so highly regarded.

The 7th at Pebble Beach is not nearly the hole it was 25 years ago, when the green was only 2/3 as big.

The 11th at Pacific Dunes is rated high mostly because it's straight into the summer wind, and therefore, not nearly as "short" a par 3 as the card says.  Most people single it out as one of the three best holes on the course, but I wouldn't.

I'd have to say the same about the 17th at Sand Hills, too.  Great background, but it's just a short shot to a tiny green, difficult to judge, and potential "x" lies all around the green.  There are lots of better holes at Sand Hills.

[A_Clay_Man]

Shivas- I'll try to slap you silly. Besides the absolute perfection and serenity of the site the 15th at CPC isn't neccasarily a tough par 3 but that depends on conditions, mostly wind. And after readings Geoff's piece on Riviera I'd have to say the natural craggy coast juxtaposed to the white sand bunkers and the uncertainty of how much room there actually is, makes for excitement in that any lack of confidence in the swing caused by the factors stated above, will likely cause a number other than par.

If we analyze the mucci maligned par 3 8th at Spanish Bay his whole justification for maligment is that you can't see the green edges when the reeds are too high. On 15 at CPC I don't believe you can see the green, at all, save for maybe back right.

[A_Clay_Man]

Now you've gone and done it. I'll bet puting #7 in your overated category has put Bob H right off his bran this morning.

The seventh at Pebble, even with it's current size and shape is by no means an easy par. Especially with a firm green the ball will likely not hold because the play is apparently to the front yardage. But that is a downslope away from the player and will likely gaurantee your ball missing long. It's quite puzzeling since you probably played a shot in the neighborhood of 85 yards. Plus, without the confidence of a caddie telling you the read, most miss that 3-4 foot par putt. Mostly cause noone knows that point lobos is the low spot and it's way across the bay.

To me the quite puzzeling part is what makes any hole, better than most. And as I recall the discussion on the 15th tee at CPC, there was a real focus and considerable discussuion on the exact number it would play under the conditions, that day. Some dumb blonde wouldn't require a tenth of that thought.

[wsmorrison]

I am fond of and often confounded by the 5th at Philadelphia Country Club.  It is a steeply down-hill 8 iron shot through a chute of trees to a narrow small green with bunker on left front and a stream that is dammed in the front to form a pond and the stream continues around the entire right side and part of the rear of the green.  There is a steep fall-off in the back.  The large tree to the left of the bunker seems to draw a lot of balls that fall straight down into the bunker.  Right after the great par 4 4th, it is a pivotal point in the round.

[ChipOat]

#11 Shinnecock
#17 TPC Sawgrass
#12 ANGC

Honorable Mention: #10 Pine Valley + at least 2 of the holes on PV's Short Course (yes, they're that good).

Really great short par 3's are HARD to build IMO - otherwise there'd be more of them.

To me, short par 3's and short par 4's need the same factor on the approach to be great: precision absolutely required with mucho problemo the result for failing to execute.

Have to agree with Shivas re: #15 CPC and Tom D re: #7 PB.
However, put PVGC #10 green on CPC #15's location and..........!!!!!!!!

Haven't played SH or PD/BD yet.

[THuckaby2]

So much to which to respond....

1. Whoops!  Yep, I sure did put Sand Hills #17 twice in my little summation... call it a Freudian Cut and Paste Error... get the picture I REALLY like this hole?

2. GREAT call re #11 at Shinnecock!  Hell yes it belongs in this company.  I may even put it at #2, ahead of my beloved California greats... ranking these is very tough though, they are such damn great golf holes.  And Mr. Goodale, oh yes, I was damn lucky to get my Frosty there, if not for a footprint SOMEONE left in the bunker I swear I could have made an easy 6.    That was the most fun I've ever had butchering a golf hole... You could likely tell I was gonna finish that no matter how long it took.  I expected you guys to desert me, and I appreciate you hanging in there.

3. Re 15 Cypress, well... Rich has made this assessment before, stating nearly exactly what shivas did.  To me, your reasoning is why it doesn't go to the top of this ranking... but that being said, it has to be among the top 5 most beautiful golf holes on this earth, so for that, it makes the list.  It's also not quite the easy shot some think... Finding the ocean is not far-fetched at all, and there are some devilish pin placements possible (out on the right tongue?).

4. Although I have debated the merits of #7PB with Rich and shivas before also and I still find it a great hole, I am working on memory really.  I last played it a year ago and it had been a few years before that... First playing, late 70's, is the hole that I keep in mind... and yeah, the green does look damn bigger today.  Shrink that back down to size and it vaults to the top.  As it is, well... Rich was right (to my wife - see, I can admit I'm wrong).  I still don't think adding odd pot-bunkers helps, but maybe it's not the great hole today that exists in my mind.  

TH

[Robert Kimball]

Mike Benham:  I love those pictures!!  Looks like I have found a good "background" picture for my screen!!

One question?  On the CP #15 photo, is that road just by the 14th green 17-mile drive?  Or is that a private road?  

Could freaks like me risk getting arrested by stopping on the road and taking pictures?  Or, God forbid, pop open my trunk and run to 15th tee with an 8-iron??  

I would never do that, of course.  This is just make-believe.

[Jeff Goldman]

I suggest the 15th at Jasper Park.  A lot of the same qualities as the others - tiny, really sloping green, very big falloff short and left with deep bunkers for fun, terrific setting coming just after the first of the peninsula holes with the lake on the left.  First time I played it the wind was whipping with an oncoming (we thought) storm, and without much though I just took a nice wedge to right part of the green, and had a putt 10-30 feet which broke hard left and down - happy for a 3.  The next day, perfect conditions, too much time to think, got too cute, short-side bunker, then above the hole, no chance.

Jeff Goldman

[THuckaby2]

Rob:  you certainly did not hear this from me... but...

the answer to all your questions is yes.  That is 17 mile drive and there are no fences.  But you run your own risk - they patrol it pretty closely, and don't take kindly to trespassers.

I know none of this from personal experience, I can assure you.  

TH

[Robert Kimball]

Oh I know, I would never be THAT stupid.  Here in Atlanta, I don't know how many almost-wrecks I have gotten into when I drive down Ashford/Dunwoody.  

You see, that road borders Peachtree Golf Club, and every now and then (especially during the winter), you can sneak a peek through the fence and see some of the course.  If I am with my girlfriend, I have her drive, so that my view will be unimpeded.

Who knows, if I live a good life, and make good friends and connections, I will be standing on that 15th tee one day legit.

And then I wake up!!!!!!

[THuckaby2]

Rob - I am the same way re several courses around here... for a long time I used to park my car right next to San Francisco GC, and well... looking through and over the fence was quite the temptation!  

Re 17Mile Drive though, it's impossible NOT to look at Spanish Bay, MPCC, Spyglass, Cypress, Pebble... you go right through or next to each of them!

I highly recommend the tour.  Just yes, do have someone else drive.  

TH

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