Norman's Course at Wente Vineyards

[John Morrissett]

Ran's post on Granite Bay inpsired this post.Has anyone in this DG seen/played Greg Norman's new course at Wente Vineyards, an hour or so from San Francisco?  I ask because I might have an extra day or so in the area in January and was thinking about renting a car and going to check it out.  The pictures and brief reviews I have read are favorable, but I would like a first-hand account.Thanks.

[THuckaby2]

John, I am new to this board, but I know some of the names posting on here and they know me, and they will likely tell you that you ought to take what I say with a grain or two or an ocean of salt.  I am not a "purist" and make no attempt to be so.  That being said, I do appreciate classical architecture, only not to the exclusion of having fun on today's courses.With that caveat, let me say that I have played Wente Vineyards three times, and enjoyed it more and more each time.  In the literature about the course, Norman claims to be "inspired by MacKenzie" in his creation there, and to me it really does show.  Knowing only the Norman of booming drives and go for broke playing style, I expected a brawny sluggers course, but Wente is anything but this.  There are quite a bit of strategic choices to be made throughout the round, pleasantly so.  The course is not overly long, but it is quite tough, especially in the afternoon wind.  Beyond that, the scenery is just plain beautiful in places, weaving in and out of the vineyards.  I would highly recommend a trip out to sample Greg's work.If you fly into SFO, you ought to allow at least an hour to get there, and do get good directions, it is somewhat difficult to find.Beyond that, if you could tolerate the company of a decent playing (4 hdcp.) non-purist, I would be happy to meet you and show you around.  I live in the area.We have several new courses in the Bay Area, and Wente is the best of the lot.Tom Huckabyps - one further caveat re Wente - the course would be very walkable, except that #10 tee is about 500 yards at least up a mountain from #9 green.  This in unfortunate but unavoidable - Greg made good use of the higher land, there are some great holes up there, and the only way to get to this was via a switchback cartpath they call "Lombard Street" after the famous windy San Francisco street.  Best to just bite the bullet and ride at this course.  If this is offensive to you, perhaps Wente will not be your cup of tea.

[T_MacWood]

Any course with vineyard in its name is worth exploring. But I must admit my first impression at seeing the photo in GOLF was, how did Dick Wilson get loose. (I think that may be a double-entendre)

[John Morrissett]

Tom--Thanks for the report -- it sounds awfully good.  What little I've seen of Norman's work has been impressive, and you confirm the high expectations.  When my plans firm up (before Christmas), I will let you know -- it would be fun to play with someone who knows the course well.  Thanks for the offer.

[Gib_Papazian]

This course is worth playing because it has some very interesting bunkering schemes and Norman obviously spent a good deal of time refining the routing because it is a lot of fun to play. I think some of the reviews on the course are a bit cloying, as the golf course looks to have been force-fed on the topography. However, with what he had to work with the results are really worth seeing. Please let me know when you are coming in and we can play the course together. It is worth seeing for sure, but there are many other new coures in the area worth a look as much as this one.

[John Morrissett]

Gib--Thanks -- it would be fun to meet and play with you.  I will let you and Tom H know as soon as I have a couple of specific dates.  Question: How many people does it take to have an "official" GCA event?

[THuckaby2]

John, I do believe you will enjoy the course, it sure is interesting at the very least.  Do let me know when your plans firm up, let's make this as close to an "official" outing as possible!And Gib, like I say I am new to this board, where do you live?  I live in San Jose and work in Oakland - yes, that is not a misprint - I have an "interesting" commute.  But at any rate, would love to hook up with you as well.  I'm your basic public course golfer, but my home course (where I keep my handicap and practice) is Cinnabar Hills - I imagine that would be one of the new courses you'd like John to see?  Not very "traditional" but I do really like it, and it sure does have a great practice area anyway.Send me an email if you like, I'd sure love to discuss this.  Haven't been to Cordevale yet, or the courses that just opened in San Ramon and Gilroy, but I have played just about everywhere else worthwhile around here. I have quite a few good friends and contacts to get me on the private courses also, thankfully.I'll be leaving this afternoon for the Thanskgiving holiday, be back Monday. Cheers!Tom Huckabytom.huckaby@clorox.com

[Tom_Egan]

Answer to John Morrissett's question --It takes a minimum of four people to comprise an "official" GCA event:  One to get the green fees comped and three to complain about the ability, indeed the soul, of the course architect.

[John Morrissett]

Tom Egan--You've clearly spent too much time with the USGA and with the Morrissett brothers.

[DBE]

John, have Lisa call the Shark to get you comped at Wente--I think she dropped your name with him at the Medalist.

[Ran Morrissett]

Other than the likes that Tom speaks about above, what are the other specific likes/dislikes as it applies to course?

[peter_p]

John,   I haven't played it yet but want to see how the Shark's work stacks up. Will be down there starting Jan 19 before a USGA workshop. Was looking at Pasatiempo, the Vineyard and one other beore hooking up with John V over the weekend.

[THuckaby2]

Peter - would love to get together with you also when you're down here, just let me know. I just had a very enjoyable day playing both Bayonet courses recently with Craig Edgmand, he mentioned you and John V were going to be down here... anyway, I'd sure like to meet you guys, play some golf!  I'll be happy to show you a different way of looking at Pasatiempo, for example (Tommy N. can tell you all about that....)Give me an email, let me know if you have room for a non-purist!Tom Huckabytom.huckaby@clorox.com

[Jim Johnson]

Wondering if anybody's played this course lately, and if so, your thoughts.

Jim

[Kevin_Reilly]

Jim, a review by Ron Whitten ages ago says: “Wente Vineyards is unlike any other Norman design I’ve played.  The challenge at Wente was to fit a golf course along the base of barren California foothills and within the framework of working vineyards.  No hokey holes, no impossible carries, no ridiculous greens.  Just good solid golf, a very attractive course in great shape, worth at least 115 bucks.  On Golf Digest’s 10 point scale (1 being Unacceptable, 5 being Good, 10 being Absolutely Perfect), I give The Course at Wente Vineyards a score of 8.5.” -Golf Digest, by Ron Whitten

I've played it a couple of times over the years and I would agree that it is "solid" but I think Mr. Whitten was more than a bit generous in his overall review of the course.  Good condition each time I've played it, good variety of holes, but it is cart golf and to my eye the vineyards make the course feel more narrow than I'd prefer. A better example though for sure than Poppy Ridge which is set on similar land.

Thanks for bumping this old thread, with Huck's old commute mentioned and a great post from Dr. Katz (RIP).

[Keith Doleshel]

A thread with multiple Huckaby posts, gotta love it.  In all fairness, missed the glory days of Tom posting regularly, but enjoy our conversations on golf courses whenever I run into him.  I enjoy Wente, there are many good holes out there, and Norman did quite well on a challenging site.  Last played it about a year and a half ago, was in very good shape.  Agree that Ron Whitten's review might have been a bit kind (perhaps it was the chardonnay talking) but all in all there are plenty of worse ways to spend a day golfing in Northern California.

[David_Elvins]

Wondering if anybody's played this course lately, and if so, your thoughts.

Jim

I played there a year ago which I think counts as lately in the context of this thread.  

I liked the course.  It is not without fault - some of the bunkering is over shaped, it gets a bit tight in places and it is a cart course.  

But the architecture is pleasantly restrained.  It isn't over bunkered and the architect didn't try to make ridiculously dramatic holes on a sight where he could have, instead he kept it very playable and whilst the sight is extreme, the holes are not.  

The highlight for me (othe than the birdie on 18) was the internal contouring of the greens.  Unfortunatly it was an overcast out of season day so hard to get photos of the greens, but to me they had beautiful rolls in them.  Npthing funky or overdone, no silly attempts to blend the contours into the green surrounds, just nice flowing contours that made for interesting putts and short game shots.  

Its a cart course!


12th green from the 10th tee