Dig it or dig it up...Victoria National

[TEPaul]

Man, you're a hard man to please Barney---that course has about 500,000 options already and you feel the need to play it backwards for some reason! That's amazing. How many times did you have to say either "By your leave" or "fore" on your way around in reverse?

[Mike Hendren]

I dig it.  I just can't play it.  As a push-fader, I felt like I had no chance with a 4-iron in hand.  It did not help that my sides were splitting as Barney had just given the come-uppance to a young whipper-snapper trying to play through cart-ball style

This is an all-world hole with a short iron in hand.  Beyond that it's too penal.  In its play, it is remarkably similar to the 8th at The Honors.

Victoria National is perhaps a golf course that photographs TOO well.  The photo of the 5th is not appealing, though frankly the hole is among the weakest there.  I absolutely love the one-shot 7th, though the web-site's photo shows little of its charm.  This hole is a visual break from the stimulation of the first six holes and rebuts the party line of the Fazio detractors on this site.  I wish I had a photo from the tee.

I like the 11th as well as it also shows restraint, for lack of a better term.  It is a long, demanding hole that gives chumps like me the option to wimp out short-right and still get up and down for a three.  

Mike

[W.H. Cosgrove]

Guys, attractive or not the two par 3's at VN are very different.  #5 is pretty frightening from the tee and in reality very playable to all hole placements except the very front.  On a course that I have been quite vocal about not liking, #5 is a highlight.  

#16 on the other hand represents a hole that has attempted to be attractive with little regard to its playability.  Difficult from the front tees it is nearly impossible from the back tees.  There is little or no area to miss a shot.  Add the wind that often blows over the site and welcome to a nightmare. If the goal was to build a penal hole providing little or no hope for the lesser player, Fazio succeeded perfectly.  I just happen to think that is poor design. I happen to beleive strongly that golf holes should offer a spot to miss a shot.  Anyone know what the handicap number is on #16?  

[Mike Hendren]

There is little or no area to miss a shot.  Add the wind that often blows over the site and welcome to a nightmare. If the goal was to build a penal hole providing little or no hope for the lesser player, Fazio succeeded perfectly.  I just happen to think that is poor design. I happen to beleive strongly that golf holes should offer a spot to miss a shot.  

Cos, substitute MacKenzie for Fazio and you have just described the 12th hole at ANGC.

Regards,

Mike

[George Pazin]

There is little or no area to miss a shot.  Add the wind that often blows over the site and welcome to a nightmare. If the goal was to build a penal hole providing little or no hope for the lesser player, Fazio succeeded perfectly.  I just happen to think that is poor design. I happen to beleive strongly that golf holes should offer a spot to miss a shot.  

Cos, substitute MacKenzie for Fazio and you have just described the 12th hole at ANGC.

Regards,

Mike

If you believe the researchers, not as originally designed.

[A_Clay_Man]

I'll volunteer to throw them some twinkies from time to time!

Tom- I think one of those xmas flasks would be better, don't you?

I must also tell you I have never laughed as hard as I have reading this thread andm all of your quality contributions. Priceless!

Could someone try to re-create what must've been one doosey of a barney post to get deleted so quickly? Thanks

[Brian_Gracely]

Adam,

The "Willie Park" thread was funnier, and in fact the two have to be read together to fully understand TEPaul's comments.  

Just looking, I'm not sure any of JakaB's posts were deleted...but you need to read both to get all the comments.