Best unwalkable course?

[goldj]

The two Mike Strantz golf courses in Williamsburg, VA.  They were originally called Stonehouse and Royal New Kent but may have different names now if they’re still open.  Royal New Kent was designed to wander in and out of  housing which hadn’t been built when I was there.


Forrest Fezler, a friend of Strantz’s,  was in the pro shop when I played Royal New Kent.  When I told him that I wanted to walk the course, he told me that it was about a 13 mile hike.  I rode. 

[Craig Sweet]

No offense Mr. Doak but RCCC is unwalkable for many....I walked it nearly 20 years ago and it busted my butt....These days I ride and walk some.

[Mike_Clayton]

I have always said it might be impossible to build an unwalkable course that makes the top 100 lists, but from what I've heard Cabot St. Lucia is pretty close to unwalkable, which everyone seems to gloss over.

Elleston? Which made the list but is now out because almost literally. now one can play it. Not even the GM.

[Tom_Doak]

No offense Mr. Doak but RCCC is unwalkable for many....I walked it nearly 20 years ago and it busted my butt....These days I ride and walk some.

Craig:


I recognize that walkability is different for each individual, and I’m a tougher judge at 63 with sore knees than I used to be.    However I did walk 18 holes carrying my own bag at Rock Creek last fall without issue.


I have walked nearly all of the courses listed also far (though I haven’t carried my bag at half of them).  The only two where I wouldn’t try are Kapalua (without shuttles they don’t provide except for the Tour) and Landmand and the two by Strantz.

[Ronald Montesano]

1. I agree with Thurman on PDGC. Very walkable.

2. A lot of Strantz courses are borderline. Of the ones I've played, Stonehouse is the trickiest to walk and the least kept-up.

3. Mountain courses in New England must be brutal. I'd start there. Also, Mountain courses in the west.

4. I agree about Chambers Bay. Walked it in November and it kicked me arse. Understood completely why Jason Day had vertigo above the 9th green. Has to be felt to be believed. Also, that one uphill transition makes the Bandon Trails heartattack hill transition feel flat. That's why they have the cart there.

5. Unwalkable is relative to age and fitness level. Also, local wildlife. Also (as mentioned by many) atmospheric conditions.

6. If the course peaks over the final third (pun intended) the challenge is enhanced.

[Michael Felton]

Lake of Isles in CT is pretty much completely unwalkable. Several of the green to tee transitions run close to a quarter mile. The holes themselves aren't bad, but little effort was made to have them close to each other in any way shape or form. It's virtually 18 1-hole golf courses.

[JohnVDB]

Kapalua is a great pick , not only for the elevation changes the wb's , good one!

Also some of the walks between holes such as 5 to 6 or where the PGA Tour shuttles players from the 8th tee to the green. As far as I know, that is the only hole where the tour shuttles players in the middle of a hole.

[Bruce Katona]

I walked (most of) Kapalua playing withthe Mrs.  She had a cart and shuttled me from spot to spot where the walk was excessive. ....that plus we teed off on a twilight rate - after 2 PM in the middle of February and still finsihed 18 in time to have  mai tai on the clubhouse veranda!

[Kalen Braley]

Forrest Fezler, a friend of Strantz’s,  was in the pro shop when I played Royal New Kent.  When I told him that I wanted to walk the course, he told me that it was about a 13 mile hike.  I rode.

I had heard this a few years back, so I mapped it using Google Earth, and confirmed the numbers again today.  The actual numbers are:

Front 9 - 3.37 miles
Back 9 - 3.55 miles
Total - Just under 7 miles (6.92)

Yes there are some very long transitions and that's still a big hike, but nowhere near 13 miles.

[Bill Crane]

This thread is incorrectly named.   It should be WORST unwalkable course.   My nomination would be Morgan Hill In PA, just south of Easton.   A few good holes and several ski slopes as well !


Best Challenging Walk - Yale, CT.    Some pretty big hills on a number of holes and tough uphill from the 9th green to 10th tee and then again to the 10th Green, and then again to the 12th green.   You get the picture with 18 possibly the biggest hill of all.
Played and walked about six Outpost Club - Punchbowl events in October, 27 holes with two shotguns out and back to the middle of the course and back to the clubhouse from the aforementioned 9th.    About 12.5 miles of walking.    Not sure I could do it now, and play any good !


The heat takes it's toll on me, this summer I'm lucky to walk the front at Springdale and ride the back, even though it kills me to have to do that.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Forrest Fezler, a friend of Strantz’s,  was in the pro shop when I played Royal New Kent.  When I told him that I wanted to walk the course, he told me that it was about a 13 mile hike.  I rode.

I had heard this a few years back, so I mapped it using Google Earth, and confirmed the numbers again today.  The actual numbers are:

Front 9 - 3.37 miles
Back 9 - 3.55 miles
Total - Just under 7 miles (6.92)

Yes there are some very long transitions and that's still a big hike, but nowhere near 13 miles.

I have played New Kent half a dozen times and walked it every time. I didn't know it was supposed to be a difficult walk.

[Ben Sims]

Stone Eagle worth a mention. Played it in spring 2009 when I got into golf architecture. I walked it on a day that started at around 70 and ended 92. The walk back up the last half of the 17th fairway made me wonder what all the hubbub was about this Doak guy even after all the solid holes and fantastic shots.


Looking back, those days of playing Pasa, going to Bandon, and then the Beagle in quick succession taught me a great deal quickly about terrain and routing.

[Tom_Doak]

Stone Eagle worth a mention. Played it in spring 2009 when I got into golf architecture. I walked it on a day that started at around 70 and ended 92. The walk back up the last half of the 17th fairway made me wonder what all the hubbub was about this Doak guy even after all the solid holes and fantastic shots.


Looking back, those days of playing Pasa, going to Bandon, and then the Beagle in quick succession taught me a great deal quickly about terrain and routing.

The uphill holes at Stone Eagle are exactly the same elevation change as at Pasatiempo - the biggest is +90 feet.  I wouldn’t have done that at Stone Eagle if I hadn’t been consulting at Pasatiempo and gotten comfortable with it.  But, Palm Springs is hotter than Santa Cruz.

[Jon Sweet]

Red Sky (Norman). It is a better course than Kapalua Plantation.


Primland is walkable but it is a difficult walk. Unique and excellent course.

Came away from Primland really unimpressed.  Played with 7 other guys, all fairly good players who held the same opinion.  Nobody was fawning over it like it seems to get from the raters.

[Wayne_Kozun]

I have always said it might be impossible to build an unwalkable course that makes the top 100 lists, but from what I've heard Cabot St. Lucia is pretty close to unwalkable, which everyone seems to gloss over.

If I were fifty, I could walk CSL, but it would be a tough walk. One and ten are straight uphill.

There are also some long walks from green to tee.  Especially from 10 green to 11 tee which will get longer and steeper once the new tenth hole is completed.

[Ira Fishman]

Red Sky (Norman). It is a better course than Kapalua Plantation.


Primland is walkable but it is a difficult walk. Unique and excellent course.

Came away from Primland really unimpressed.  Played with 7 other guys, all fairly good players who held the same opinion.  Nobody was fawning over it like it seems to get from the raters.

Jon,


I am not a rater nor have ever been. Played it eight or so times. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.


Ira

[Joe Bausch]

I have 697 golf courses in my photo album collection. I’ve walked every one of them (including Pete Dye Golf Club and Pikewood National), but two:


Country Club of the Poconos
Broad Run (fka Tattersall)


I will not put down my money to play either of them.

[Kalen Braley]

A lot of interesting stuff on this thread from last year, including my measurement of CCP, which came in at nearly 8 miles start to finish!     If anyone knows of a longer course, it'd be my pleasure to map it

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,72032.0.html

[Ben Sims]

Stone Eagle worth a mention. Played it in spring 2009 when I got into golf architecture. I walked it on a day that started at around 70 and ended 92. The walk back up the last half of the 17th fairway made me wonder what all the hubbub was about this Doak guy even after all the solid holes and fantastic shots.


Looking back, those days of playing Pasa, going to Bandon, and then the Beagle in quick succession taught me a great deal quickly about terrain and routing.

The uphill holes at Stone Eagle are exactly the same elevation change as at Pasatiempo - the biggest is +90 feet.  I wouldn’t have done that at Stone Eagle if I hadn’t been consulting at Pasatiempo and gotten comfortable with it.  But, Palm Springs is hotter than Santa Cruz.

Thank you for posting that. Every now and then a piece of info comes along that no one would ever have known had you not dropped it and it helps understand things better. I would never have guessed that.

[Jon Sweet]

"For me, the first course that always come to mind in this discussion is Pete Dye GC in West Virginia.  While I have witnessed walkers there, I would not be interested in walking this course myself.  Among my list of favorite courses, it is only one I can think of that I truly love playing but consider unwalkable.  Beyond that, I can't think of another one.  I am playing Kapalua Plantation at the end of the month, so perhaps there will soon be two on my list."


To quote the film Dodgeball, "if you can walk Pikewood National, you can walk Pete Dye."

Pikewood was not a difficult walk at all imo.  The elevation really didn't seem to overwhelm and the climbs to holes are far worse at other courses IMO.

[Jim Lipstate]

My vote would be Ballyhack in Roanoke, Virginia. Well designed and with many interesting holes but ill-suited for the walking golfer. My caddie used a motorized surfboard to negotiate the hilly site.

[Rich Thomas]

I would toss a vote in for Sugarloaf in Carabasset Valley Maine. I did not care much for the course, although the conditions were good, and the views were great (played in mid September). The climbs from greens to tees and tees to fairways would be next to impossible.
I am also playing Raindance National in Windsor CO on Monday. Tips out at over 8400 yards. I'm interested to see how walkable that course will be.


Rich

[Sean_A]

For me the question isn’t unwalkable, but more like I don’t enjoy the walk.Thats usually because there are long transitions, sometimes combined with hill terrain. A few good courses come to mind

Tobacco Road
JCB
Sandy Hills
NC St course (forgot the name)
Renaissance

Ciao

[DFarron]

Stone Eagle worth a mention. Played it in spring 2009 when I got into golf architecture. I walked it on a day that started at around 70 and ended 92. The walk back up the last half of the 17th fairway made me wonder what all the hubbub was about this Doak guy even after all the solid holes and fantastic shots.


Looking back, those days of playing Pasa, going to Bandon, and then the Beagle in quick succession taught me a great deal quickly about terrain and routing.

The uphill holes at Stone Eagle are exactly the same elevation change as at Pasatiempo - the biggest is +90 feet.  I wouldn’t have done that at Stone Eagle if I hadn’t been consulting at Pasatiempo and gotten comfortable with it.  But, Palm Springs is hotter than Santa Cruz.

Very true Santa Cruz climate is usually very cool but Pasatiempo can be a tough walk also.

[Nigel Islam]

I asked ChatGPT and it put Pinehurst #2 and the Old Course in the top 10 great courses that are hard to walk, so I guess don't look for many ChatGPT contributions to GCA in the near future.

LOL this made my night Matt!