As good as covid was for golf !

[Adrian_Stiff]

As good as Covid was for golf introducing and restoring many members back to golf, the bad UK (and north Europe) weather this last six months has taken away those Covid plusses.


Many UK courses are experiencing dramatic losses in their memberships perhaps as many as 4 times the normal amount.


Many members are now former members have had their courses closed or reduced to carry only and if you are 74, the clubs have gone away probably for good. Many former golfers would have had their last round in September 2023. It has been that bad.


Paying £100 per month month on month is no fun when you can't play.


Some clubs will escape a little bit if their renewals are not the standard April, they may not if the bad weather continues through May. Some will search cheaper forms of play or dryer courses but dry ones are often too far away. Sadly as soon as you stop being 'A MEMBER' you slide to a pattern of infrequent golf >> less enjoyment because you play badly >>>often leading to taking up another hobby.


Some members club will need to cost cut and cut their staffing (our UK wages are pretty much up 10% from April 1) will be the easiest route.


:O(

[Duncan Cheslett]

It has barely stopped raining in most of the UK since July. Most inland golf courses are built on heavy clay soil and they are unplayable. Most greenkeepers I know have not been able to get a single machine out onto their course since October. We're mowing greens by hand maybe once or twice a month when conditions allow. Normally we'd be mowing every day at this time of year with a ride-on!


Adrian has a good point. Much more weather like this and people will be giving up golf. It is simply no fun to squelch round a muddy course playing off a fairway mat. There is not much prospect of winter rules being lifted until June!


Rainfall in the Manchester area for February was up 765% on last year!!!


My membership at Silloth has never felt like better value. I've played there more than ever recently and it has been in excellent condition.


Even Silloth was closed for flooding this morning!

[Thomas Dai]

Perhaps having the annual membership renewal date in say July/August/Sept when the UK weather is good and will be good for a while ahead is likely to result in more renewals than a Jan-April renewal date when the weather is poor, playing time less, course conditions not what folks would like and thoughts of “shall I renew or not” become part of a members thought process?
Atb

[Adrian_Stiff]

Perhaps having the annual membership renewal date in say July/August/Sept when the UK weather is good and will be good for a while ahead is likely to result in more renewals than a Jan-April renewal date when the weather is poor, playing time less, course conditions not what folks would like and thoughts of “shall I renew or not” become part of a members thought process?
Atb

Your are right but. Even August and September was bad last year, plus you are going into Winter. June 1st would prob be the best date, but its hard to keep chopping and changing about. Just luck when your renewals are factored with the rain, probably half the clubs are April 1.


That thought process "shall I renew or not" must have gone through many more minds than the ones that decided "no".

[Duncan Cheslett]

More and more golf clubs are opting for a monthly payment model rather than a year's subscription being expected in one go.


The two clubs where I'm a member both default to payment in ten equal monthly direct debits. It certainly takes the sting out of paying for membership and undoubtedly helps with attrition rates.


I've yet to hear of a golf club being brave enough to go for a true "gym membership" monthly model because of the inclination many would have to drop it in the winter. Maybe seasonal pricing is a way forward?


Certainly members of "bog standard" golf clubs would be wise to think of their subscription as being for 8 or 9 months golf rather than for 12.

[David_Tepper]

Prior thread:

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,72668.0.html

[Jim Hoak]

I don't know the exact comparison, but I'd venture that the recurrent Pacific storms that have hit California repeatedly this year--and continued on into the US Southwest--have been comparable to the UK winter described.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Paying £100 per month month on month is no fun when you can't play.

:O(

I guess many on this side of the Atlantic don't quite understand this. 100 pounds is pretty reasonable to keep a course open.

[Pierre_C]

I'd like to preface this is probabilistic, not deterministic.

Based on the existing climate conditions in the Pacific there are some assumptions that can be made about possible weather forecast for Europe.

In the Pacific, a strong El Niño is weaking, with a transition to ENSO neutral (April - June). In March, NOAA predicted a 62% of La Niña this summer (June - August) - transition from neutral to La Niña is faster than normal. Historically, El Niño / La Niña - Atlantic teleconnection (specifically North Atlantic Oscillation, NAO) takes 1 - 2 months to manifest. NAO (link between air pressure near Iceland and over the central N. Atlantic, near Azores) influences the weather of UK and N. Europe. La Niña intensity varies, thus their influence on NAO is not always the same.

Looking at EU precipitation models, it looks like more rain in UK for the next 2 months.  Summer appears to be dry and hot.



Season precipitation forecast for Europe 2024 - EU Space Copernicus
https://forest-fire.emergency.copernicus.eu/apps/effis.longterm.forecasts/Seasonal



If there is a strong El Niña, I would expect a dryer climate
https://www.metswift.com/blog/spring-rainfall-shortages-in-europe-is-la-nina-to-blame


ENSO probabilities, El Niño, Neutral, La Niña (NOAA )
https://www.climate.gov/media/15871


Impact of ENSCO on European Climate
https://www.ecmwf.int/sites/default/files/elibrary/2012/12119-impact-enso-european-climate.pdf

[Niall C]

Looking at EU precipitation models, it looks like more rain in UK for the next 2 months.  Summer appears to be dry and hot.

Thanks Pierre, any chance you can advise which week summer will be this year ?


Niall

[jeffwarne]

That is very sad to hear.
I hope it is not a continuing trend.


That's not really that different than a club located in a climate where the club closes for 4-6 months due to frigid temperatures.
(at least 1/2 of the US.)
Unfortunately, golfers ever rising demands for amenities and conditioning has worked its way across the Atlantic at just the wrong time, creating a situation with rising expectations, costs(inflations + more demands) and fewer  months to enjoy.
Quality golf has generally been more affordable in the UK/Ireland vs. US due to lower expectations, climate and culture.(and soil in the case of links courses)


Hopefully there are solutions to mitigate such circumstances, otherwise supply will shrink.

[Thomas Dai]

Traditional UK private members golf hasn’t been the same since Covid. The quiet, tranquillity of the game and the respect of those playing it towards their club, their club, and their fellow players at private members clubs seems to have lapsed. Nowadays a club is more a facility than a club, which I don’t believe was previously the case. Whether these changes would have happened anyway without the unfortunate experience of Covid is debatable.
Atb

[Pierre_C]

Looking at EU precipitation models, it looks like more rain in UK for the next 2 months.  Summer appears to be dry and hot.

Thanks Pierre, any chance you can advise which week summer will be this year ?


Niall

Niall,
   Since computer models are not always accurate I plan to sacrifice a live chicken this week to validate. It did work for the Mayans for a few thousand years.


-Pierre

[Mark Pearce]

Traditional UK private members golf hasn’t been the same since Covid. The quiet, tranquillity of the game and the respect of those playing it towards their club, their club, and their fellow players at private members clubs seems to have lapsed. Nowadays a club is more a facility than a club, which I don’t believe was previously the case. Whether these changes would have happened anyway without the unfortunate experience of Covid is debatable.
Atb

I just resigned from a club I had been a member of for over 20 years because the board (not a committee anymore, since incorporation) seemed committed to turning it into a CCFD.  Amongst other demonstrations of not being fit to be directors of a company.

[Sean_A]

Traditional UK private members golf hasn’t been the same since Covid. The quiet, tranquillity of the game and the respect of those playing it towards their club, their club, and their fellow players at private members clubs seems to have lapsed. Nowadays a club is more a facility than a club, which I don’t believe was previously the case. Whether these changes would have happened anyway without the unfortunate experience of Covid is debatable.
Atb

I just resigned from a club I had been a member of for over 20 years because the board (not a committee anymore, since incorporation) seemed committed to turning it into a CCFD.  Amongst other demonstrations of not being fit to be directors of a company.

Your home club?

Ciao

[Adrian_Stiff]

Traditional UK private members golf hasn’t been the same since Covid. The quiet, tranquillity of the game and the respect of those playing it towards their club, their club, and their fellow players at private members clubs seems to have lapsed. Nowadays a club is more a facility than a club, which I don’t believe was previously the case. Whether these changes would have happened anyway without the unfortunate experience of Covid is debatable.
Atb

Thomas I think that for a while now some people see a GOLF CLUB as just a golf course, just a season ticket, just a cheaper way to play golf if you play a lot. More recently the 'some people' has become 'more people'.
When I look at the playing statistics almost half the membership don't play enough or are in the wrong category and could play golf cheaper. For many that don't value or don't use 'the club' it is the reason not to renew. In the 1.62 days it was hard to get in a club, it was dead man shoes, people joined the golf club so they would get to know bank managers, solicitors, people that might improve their life prospects.
Most golf clubs go to the same well when they have social events, a core of 100 or so with 500 having zero interest. No one really wants to attend prize presentations anymore, prefering to just see the credit to their account.
All this is modern improvement and WE are just fuddy duddys, stuck in the old world.

[Thomas Dai]

Fair points Adrian.
The World, society and golf changes.

Now where did I put my pipe and slippers?!
Atb

[Carl Johnson]

What strikes me here is the different business models, different models for different markets, or perceived markets.  The trick is figuring out which model fits your market.  I'm looking at this strictly from a dollars and cents/sense standpoint.  There's the Board that figures what they want is what the market wants, but they turn out to be wrong, either on account of wishful thinking or not caring.  One USA model is that you pay an initiation fee of $XX,000, not refundable, and then monthly dues.  You can quit when ever you want, stop paying dues, and be done with it.  If you want to get back in the same club, you get back on the end of the wait list and start fresh when your number comes up.  This works great when the demand for the club/course is high.  But at the other end, daily fee, municipal or privately owned, can work, too, if the demand is there.  It's good that we have all these options.  Gaza, Ukraine?  Not so many options.

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

Cork Golf Club's new island hole; you'd think they would have moved the flag at least 
https://twitter.com/CorkGolfClub/status/1716779356109119977


Well, it is called Little Island 

[Mark Pearce]

Traditional UK private members golf hasn’t been the same since Covid. The quiet, tranquillity of the game and the respect of those playing it towards their club, their club, and their fellow players at private members clubs seems to have lapsed. Nowadays a club is more a facility than a club, which I don’t believe was previously the case. Whether these changes would have happened anyway without the unfortunate experience of Covid is debatable.
Atb

I just resigned from a club I had been a member of for over 20 years because the board (not a committee anymore, since incorporation) seemed committed to turning it into a CCFD.  Amongst other demonstrations of not being fit to be directors of a company.

Your home club?

Ciao

Yes.  On the bright side, I have joined Goswick and Tyneside and still saved money.....