Kapalua Plantation question

[Matt_Cohn]

There was a video on Golf Channel earlier this week on #6 at Kapalua where one of the commentators threw golf balls down the left, center, and right sides of the fairway and they all ended up in the exact same spot in the right rough. I think something similar happens on #10 where the fairway can be almost impossible to hold.


I've never been there, and I know the terrain is extreme. But can/should they do something about this? It seems a little silly just watching it.

[Tom_Doak]

It's not like the whole fairway does that; it's just happening in some of the places Tour players drive it today. 


If they don't want to be in the rough, they also have the option not to hit driver, but of course they'll be coached to just let it go into the rough.


Since they don't care that much about fairway v rough, I don't think anyone should do construction to make it even easier for them.

[Jim Hoak]

Tom, I'm sure you're right.  The pros don't care about everyday rough vs. fairway anymore.  Is there any way to change that perception?  Length of the rough?  Type of grass? 
Or is this just one more example of how the professional game is not applicable to the 99%+ of the game that is not their game, and course architecture and maintenance can't change that without damaging the game for the 99%+ who should really matter?

[Jeff Schley]

Tom, I'm sure you're right.  The pros don't care about everyday rough vs. fairway anymore.  Is there any way to change that perception?  Length of the rough?  Type of grass? 
Or is this just one more example of how the professional game is not applicable to the 99%+ of the game that is not their game, and course architecture and maintenance can't change that without damaging the game for the 99%+ who should really matter?

Jim I have played there several times as a mid capper, and it is great fun to juice your drives on some of the holes downwind and feel like king kong.  The pros play such a different game, I can assure you there is wind and you will play against it and sideways on some holes and feel like you no confidence left. I really like Kapalua for it's width; also as the entire place is on a mountainside slope, putting isn't easy.

[Michael Dugger]

Tom, I'm sure you're right.  The pros don't care about everyday rough vs. fairway anymore.  Is there any way to change that perception?  Length of the rough?  Type of grass? 
Or is this just one more example of how the professional game is not applicable to the 99%+ of the game that is not their game, and course architecture and maintenance can't change that without damaging the game for the 99%+ who should really matter?

Isn't the answer here this?  It does not matter when the pros are hitting from the rough with a wedge to a soft, receptive green.


But it matters a lot when they hit 5 iron to a rock-hard Oakmont putting surface.

[Ben Sims]

Tom, I'm sure you're right.  The pros don't care about everyday rough vs. fairway anymore.  Is there any way to change that perception?  Length of the rough?  Type of grass? 
Or is this just one more example of how the professional game is not applicable to the 99%+ of the game that is not their game, and course architecture and maintenance can't change that without damaging the game for the 99%+ who should really matter?

In this instance, I’m not so sure the pro game isn’t analogous to the rest of us. I’m constantly concerned with one thought on the tee when it comes to tactics: advance the ball as far as possible while keeping the ball in the playing corridor. Fairway vs rough isn’t really a high priority. What is a priority is avoiding most bunkers (but not all) and water/OB. Other than that?


As this applies to Kapalua, I don’t remember the runoff to the margins being so severe. But as Tom says, we aren’t playing the ball from the same spots as the pros. I never had that issue there.

[Matt Kardash]

I agree. I think for average golf the concern is getting it as far down the hole as possible with a playable next shot. I am 41, and since I was a teenager I could drive it 300 yards. I never cared one second if I was in the middle of the fairway or 10 yards off the fairway as long as my next shot was clear to the green. Unfortunately for me I grew up mostly playing a heavily tree-lined course where the woods usually meant a lost ball...

[Matt Kardash]

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[Mark_Fine]

I have played The Plantation Course multiple times and there are definitely areas on the course where balls collect. I generally don’t have a problem with heavily sloped areas of short fairway/short grass (playing a course this week, The Lake Course at Olympic that has this feature on many of their fairways) which cause balls to roll out.  What I don’t like and always try to avoid are areas of slope that funnel everything to the same spot.  It is one of the reasons I hate and try to avoid with grading, catch basins in fairways and/or close to/around greens.  These areas also end up with ruling issues and lots of divots.