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Richard Hetzel

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Portugal advice
« on: April 16, 2023, 09:37:32 PM »
My wife planned a 2 week trip to Portugal in July. I am not bringing my clubs, but have been given permission to play golf 3-4 times while we are there. I have narrowed it down to these courses, but I am open to something better from those that have been to Portgal:


Troia
Praia D'El Rey
West Cliffs
Royal Obidos
Monte Rei
San Lorenzeo
Pine Cliffs 9


Any other advice for sight seeing or golf? Thanks!
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

Sean_A

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Re: Portugal advice
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2023, 02:06:27 AM »
Richard

Troija and Praia del Rey are good.

Obidos and Evora are lovely. Bairro Alto is cool.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Portugal advice
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2023, 02:56:22 AM »
Are you a week in the Lisbon area and a week in the Algarve?


Don’t forget Kidd’s Comporta Dunes which should be open by July and looks excellent.


That aside, West Cliffs is really good up north (better than Praia d’el Rey and certainly Obidos) and the small Pine Cliffs nine holer is a mini-Cypress Point down south (do NOT go in with that high of an expectation!). Monte-Rei typical Nicklaus but in a good setting without any houses built yet. San Lorenzo beautiful holes down by the lagoon but tired and very 80’s design.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2023, 03:00:16 AM by Ally Mcintosh »

Adam Lawrence

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Re: Portugal advice
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2023, 05:19:51 AM »
Are you a week in the Lisbon area and a week in the Algarve?

Don’t forget Kidd’s Comporta Dunes which should be open by July and looks excellent.

That aside, West Cliffs is really good up north (better than Praia d’el Rey and certainly Obidos) and the small Pine Cliffs nine holer is a mini-Cypress Point down south (do NOT go in with that high of an expectation!). Monte-Rei typical Nicklaus but in a good setting without any houses built yet. San Lorenzo beautiful holes down by the lagoon but tired and very 80’s design.

I love Portugal. IMO it has the best 'ordinary' food of anywhere I have ever been, there are beautiful grilled sardines and suchlike virtually everywhere.

Golfwise, I echo what Ally has said. Praia d'El Rey is nice, but has been significantly impacted by housing, whereas West Cliffs is newer and doesn't have the same issue, or it didn't four or five years ago. I saw Comporta during its original build ten or eleven years ago (the developer went spectacularly bust, and it lay fallow for most of the intervening years). I thought then that it would be the best course in Portugal as soon as it opened -- I'm going to see it next month to check if I was right.

Monte Rei I saw perhaps fifteen years ago. I think Ally is a little harsh to call it a 'typical Nicklaus', but it is big and brawny. When it opened, I remember thinking to myself 'This is the best this course will ever be' because the plan was for all the high ground between the holes to be used for housing, but they don't seem to have built many/any.

I haven't seen Troia but would like to. Ditto the Pine Cliffs nine holer.

Discovery Land has built its first European project at Costa Terra, not far from Comporta, with (inevitably for Discovery) a Fazio golf course. I assume it will be extremely difficult to get on, but am not sure. I only know one person who has seen it, and he wasn't a fan, but mileages will undoubtedly vary.

Of the older courses in the Algarve, I'm not a fan of Penina, it felt very very tired when I was last there. I liked the original version of Palmares, and liked the RTJ2 rebuild quite a lot too. In general I feel that the standard of Algarve golf is significantly higher than of that on the Costa del Sol in Spain, a couple of hours east.

Lisbon is a magnificent city, one of my favourite in Europe. I recommend taking the historic no. 28 tram, which goes through a lot of the oldest and most interesting parts of the city and will give you a good tour. I also recommend a wander through the old Alfama district, popping into bars and restaurants as you choose. And a trip down to the waterside at Belem is worthwhile too -- the maritime museum is good and there is the cafe that invented the pastel de nata, for which we should all be grateful -- a good espresso and one of them is the perfect midmorning snack.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2023, 06:22:11 AM by Adam Lawrence »
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Portugal advice
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2023, 05:58:22 AM »
I'm glad someone has mentioned Palmares.  I really like it.  But I haven't seen most of the others (other than the Pine Cliffs 9, which I also like, but not quite as much).
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Portugal advice
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2023, 06:55:48 AM »
You’ll be glad you played Praia del Rey. Some lesser holes around the turn but also some really fun stuff in a lovely setting either side of it.

I don’t believe West Cliffs was built when I was there.

Óbidos is a magnificent place to base yourself while you play one or both.

I also applaud Oitavos Dunes not being on your list!

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Portugal advice New
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2023, 08:42:26 AM »
You’ll be glad you played Praia del Rey. Some lesser holes around the turn but also some really fun stuff in a lovely setting either side of it.

I don’t believe West Cliffs was built when I was there.

Óbidos is a magnificent place to base yourself while you play one or both.

I also applaud Oitavos Dunes not being on your list!

I like Oitavos. It's not, and never has been, within a million miles of being World Top 100, and it is hampered by the owner being crazy, but it's a nice course with some really good holes (and a few iffy ones). Certainly prefer it to Praia d'El Rey.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2023, 08:44:36 AM by Adam Lawrence »
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

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