[Patrick_Mucci]

When one plays NGLA they are immediately confronted with SPINES from the very first green, to the second fairway and throughout the golf course.  The fifth hole (Hogback) has several spines, and the theme continues with both lateral and perpendicular spines.

With all of the earthmoving equipment available today, I don't see this feature very often in greens, fairways and rough.

Has the introduction of spines in golf course architecture become a lost art ?

What other courses have an abundance of spines in their fairways and greens ?

[Brian Phillips]

Pat,

Sorry to be crude...but what the hell do you mean by a spine....?

Brian

[john_stiles]

Fairway and greens' spines always present interesting shots and problems for drives and approach shots.

The 16th at Black Creek (Silva) is called the spine hole and has a very interesting 'spine' in the green, from front to back, that just about splits the green in two. It is a splendid surface split by a spine.

The line of the spine is raised enough to make putting very interesting if you are not on the same side of the spine as the hole.  If are hole high on the opposite side, then you have a very slight uphill putt ....that then has a very slight downhill finish to the hole.  

If you are putting across the spine and are not hole high (at Black Creek #16) then you always have an interesting putt.  The putt will break one way, cross up and over the raised spine, and then break the other way down to the hole.

[A_Clay_Man]

Pat- I don't think it's a lost art as much as rarely used, probably because of least common denominator effect. Your average golfer doesn't get off on having a wicked bounce or a non-level lie.

Pat- You have made these type of posts before, and while I wouldn't say spines (or mounds, noses or whatever) is standard or commonplace they are being built by some bold archies to effective use. When you hear a guy who plays golf less than ten times a year, bitch about being in the fairway and having a stance that is "unusual". You'll know what I mean about the LCD.

I know I've made this comment before but don't you think an attempt to see more of the newer courses coming online would be appropriate so that you don't assume these features are not being used?

[Brian Phillips]

I have always called them ridges...

[Steve Lang]

  Adam,

Good point.  

The WCC's Player course has spines on #1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 9, 12, 13, 15, 16, & 18 fairways..  THEY'RE DRAINAGE AIDS!  and also provide strategic possibilites for kicking you forward, to the side etc.. let alone haveing uphill & down hill & sidehill lies in an otherwise generally flat area.

Use on greens very extensive around here, again for drainage and very subtle topography challenges.

[ian]

Pat,

This is one time your wrong. I've seen them in countless new courses in both greens and fairways.

[Brian_Gracely]

In a similar vein as "spines", one of the things I enjoyed about the Fancourt Links this past weekend was the frequently mentioned "big shoulders" on a number of the greens.  granted that some of the recoveries were restricted because the areas around the green had been trampled by spectators, but they offered alot more variety of shots than the typical greenside bunkers.  they also rewarded the player that was willing to run the ball up onto the green as opposed to flying it in (see Appleby vs. Love on #18).

Why don't more architectures use this concept along with bunkerless greens anymore?  is watching the ball roll back to your feet on an approach any more discouraging than leaving it in the bunker to the weekend hacker?  or do we just refuse to limit the irrigation around certain greensides to allow this anymore?    

[Jeff_Brauer]

They are making a comeback, methinks.  For the last twenty years, they have been predominant - but only at the side of fairways as containment!

Seriously, as Adam has said, the better player thinks they should be on the outside of the fairway or green to guard premium areas, but the middle of both should be "safe haven."  And it most cases, that is probably true.  If I were to use them lengthwise in a fairway, I would make the fairway wide enough on one or both sides to hold the ball in. Or make the "better" side narrower.

I have started using them more, paritally to increase surface drainage, but as long as they are there, using them to divide fairways in critical areas (especially for long hitters) or create subtle angled carry hazards in place of typical bunkers.  For better players, I think fairway contour will eventually replace fairway sand hazards as the obstacle of choice for many reasons.

By the way, I call them "hammerheads."

[A_Clay_Man]

I fondly recall the 18th at SFGC and how the fairway appeared  to be so narrow because of all the undulation. For me, challenging the golfer in this manner at the latter stages of the round, is paramount but not mandatory. I add the qualifier because of the 18 th at BB and how the preceeding difficulty more than sufficed as a test.

[Patrick_Mucci]

A Clayman,

What is your source of information that I don't play newer courses   How did you draw that conclusion ?

Could you name five (5) new courses where spines are a repetitive feature in the fairways and greens ?

Ian Andrew,

Could you name five (5) courses where spines are a repetitive feature ?

Jeff Brauer,

Outside ridges are not spines, spines are centrally located, not perimeter features.  Containment ridges are the opposite of a spine.

[A_Clay_Man]

Pat- MAybe it's the questions or how you phrase them that leads me to believe you haven't seen the features you query.

 Pinon Hills has quite a few, The Rawls Course and Black Mesa, Wild Horse, Seven bridges (   for u Shiv)

[Dan Kelly]

By the way, I call them "hammerheads."

Possibly this belongs in the Department of Duh, but ...

Why?

[Jim_Kennedy]

Mr.Mucci,
Modern mowers and the men that man them  

[Jeff_Mingay]

Pat,

If you like spiny ridges, you need to come to Windsor to study Donald Ross' greens at Essex and Roseland.

Ross took two dead flat properties during the late 1920s and created subtle spiny ridges within nearly every putting surface; ridges that significantly effect play and dictate the strategy of many holes.

The aesthetics at Essex and Roseland won't blow anyone's socks off, but when you really study the greens Ross created, how they dictate strategy and make for very interesting play, your appreciation for his talent will rise.

As far as I'm concerned, it's all about spiny ridges  

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jim Kennedy,

At first I thought you had supplied a great answer for the fairways, but then on reflection I remembered those big gang mowers, their enormous turn radius, in comparison to today's newer, smaller equipment, which should make mowing those features easier, not harder.

Your answer makes all the sense in the world with the advent of triplex riding mowers as opposed to walk mowers on the greens.

A Clayman,

Are the spines in the fairways, greens or both on the courses you mention ?  And, are they repetitive features at those courses.

How pronounced are the spines, subtle or dramatic ?

[Jim_Kennedy]

Pat,
I don't doubt that new fairway machinery makes for an easier job of mowing spines but I think there are limitations.
The Supers on this site could give a better answer but a machine having 5- 22" reels that cut an 8' swath has tangents it can't exceed without scalping. It probably matters less if the machine is traversing them frontally or on an angle but is this practical when spines are randomly placed?
Creating steeply crested spines would appear to create more man hours mowing them which adds to the maintenance budget. I still feel that mowing issues, even those of fairways and roughs, contribute greatly to the use of less pronounced radii on spines and there is still the issue of irrigation to consider.  

[Dan Kelly]

We need enormous mowers based on those floating-head electric shavers.

[A_Clay_Man]

Pat- I guess I've been blessed by seeing the courses I see and have seen. The spines on the courses I mentioned come in all shapes and sizes and directions. At Pinon, Dye has perpendicular spines on almost every fairway and the signature par 3 has a hogsback and it even has a cross spine forming an almost bow and arrow look. Black mesa has many on the greens. As a matter of fact, the much talked about putt from the back of 16 green, needs to ride the ridge of the spine to get close. There really are too many to describe but I'd be honored to show you.

[Steve Lang]

 

Adam,

Ms Sheila showed Ran, Doug Wright, and myself that the best way to deal with that seductive spine from the back of #16 at Black Mesa was to ignore it, go left young man, go left and fall off the back ledge at its south end and go at a right angle to the hole to get close , only possible to about 8ft...  

Hmmmm seductive spines... what would a thread like that brew?  Where's Huckaby when you need him?

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jim Kennedy,

I see your points.

What troubles me is the fabulous condition that NGLA is in, even with all of their green, fairway and rough spines.

How can they maintain and irrigate them so successfully ?

Do you think their existance is highly dependent on the soil, wind and weather conditions ?

[Jim_Kennedy]

Pat,
When the spines that run through several of our greens get scalped it is due to the lack of care by the guy on the triplex mower. This mower also cannot do a good job where the spines meet the green, the cut is always uneven when mowing along the spine and forget anyone ever going out and watering them in a dry spell !
I would guess that certain soils and conditions make it easier  but successful maintenance is directly related to the dedication of the crew and the willingness of the club/owner to spend some cash.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jim Kennedy,

It is difficult to get minimum wage workers to perform like craftsmen.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Pat,
In the above scenario the workers are well paid w/benefits.

I think it's possible to get the best from anyone if you are a realistic and creative manager and you have the power to hire/fire.
 

[Doug Siebert]

Spines are an anti-technology feature, IMHO.

My home course has one hole with a prominent spine, which is a 494 yard par 5 with a downhill tee shot (steeply uphill the last 100 yards)  It constantly frustrates me that a hole which I should birdie or eagle every damn time on paper plays harder than it should, and that spine is a big reason.

The reason is fairly obvious, you need to work the ball (or hit REALLY damn straight) to put it in the fairway there, and a fairway miss doesn't leave much room for going at the green no matter how long you are.  Working the ball is becoming a lost art.  Most of the places you needed to work the ball in the old days are gone now.  Dogleg?  Hit over it.  Want to go at a tucked pin?  Hit it nice and high and it'll stop on all but concrete greens.  Want to keep the ball straight in the wind?  Don't worry, your big-faced Ti driver and Pro V1x will do that for you.

A really cool feature I hadn't thought about until I'd played that hole hundreds of times is that the left side of spine shrinks as you go longer, while the right side gets bigger.  With a trap guarding the left half of the green you want to work it right to left, so getting in that smaller area to the left sure benefits you, but it is harder to do (made much more difficult in recent years with the addition of a few fairway bunkers down the left side)  Someone who is used to working the ball (or at least used to thik that way) would probably notice that the first time they walked down the fairway.  Sadly, when you are hitting at it with a 7 or 8 iron, that front trap loses its strategic value.

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