[Ben Attwood]

Useful info for those genuinely interested.
https://www.state.gov/reports/2020-country-reports-on-human-rights-practices/

Thank you. I note that they do not do a report on the United States. For that, one could look at https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2021/country-chapters/united-states

[Ben Attwood]

There's a really interesting discussion to be had on the relationship between sports and politics in golf. However, the press really need to move past extremist soundbites. It would start by just an acknowledgement of the relationship that the USA has with Saudia Arabia, which has been extremely close if one were to look at it from an international security and oil perspective, nevermind the financial aspect.


The media around golf should set the current Saudi league discussions in this context and then people can start to really debate what is healthy or helpful. Sport has often been powerful in politics but pretty exclusively when considering human rights. When the debate is so heavily about money things are always going to be unclear politically.

[JESII]

John,


If you're wishing the world were simply a better place, fine. But if you're insinuating Phil's actions through this should somehow be obscured, I don't think you've paid attention to them.


He proactively sought to undermine the PGA Tour with a regime that is exactly as he described to Shipnuk. His various rumored transgressions through the years have been largely kept under wraps, this one couldn't possibly be...

[archie_struthers]

 


Shame for Phil that he got involved in this imbroglio. But he's always been outspoken so it's not a surprise. Really comes off badly though in this one as most people have trouble understanding his gripe about the money. He is supposedly worth close to half a billion , yikes !

[Mike Sweeney]

John,


If you're wishing the world were simply a better place, fine. But if you're insinuating Phil's actions through this should somehow be obscured, I don't think you've paid attention to them.


He proactively sought to undermine the PGA Tour with a regime that is exactly as he described to Shipnuk. His various rumored transgressions through the years have been largely kept under wraps, this one couldn't possibly be...

John,


In general, I see the positives in sports in solving/supporting cross border-cross cultural exchanges. But Jim is spot on. Phil using Saudi Arabia to stick it to the PGA Tour was bad.


My Navy son was about to check into the building at NAS-Pensacola when a Saudi Airman shot and killed his USNA '19 classmate Ensign Josh Watson:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Air_Station_Pensacola_shooting


The Watson Family has been very constructive in their response, and they got put through a lot of "stuff". I don't want to get into cross border politics, but I do feel a personal obligation to keep Josh's memory alive over and above Phil's need to stick it to some PGA Tour people...


I was a fan of Phil, especially his PGA Major win recently, but it was a mistake. Seems like he is correcting it too, so I have no interest in burying him.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

Seems like he is correcting it too, so I have no interest in burying him.

It does?

[Cliff Hamm]

Wonder why it took him a week or so to reflect and apologize?

[JMEvensky]

Wonder why it took him a week or so to reflect and apologize?

Maybe his CPA and agent couldn't get in touch with him.

[jeffwarne]

Wonder why it took him a week or so to reflect and apologize?

he was hanging in a dungeon with his new Saudi friends

[Jim_Coleman]

   Phil may have learned that he can’t shoot someone on 5th Avenue and lose no support. His only apology was to the Saudis. I suspect the PGA views him as an insurrectionist and will deal with him accordingly. Because the PGA doles out punishment privately (see Dustin Johnson), we may not see Phil for a while with only Phil saying why.

[Rob Marshall]

   Phil may have learned that he can’t shoot someone on 5th Avenue and lose no support. His only apology was to the Saudis. I suspect the PGA views him as an insurrectionist and will deal with him accordingly. Because the PGA doles out punishment privately (see Dustin Johnson), we may not see Phil for a while with only Phil saying why.

He should be shown the door by the PGA. He needs some time away. Make it lifetime. Anyone think Tom Watson has a smile on his face. I’m amazed any of the Americans go there to play. Why is no one mentioning 911? They funded the terrorists.

[Tim Martin]

   Phil may have learned that he can’t shoot someone on 5th Avenue and lose no support. His only apology was to the Saudis. I suspect the PGA views him as an insurrectionist and will deal with him accordingly. Because the PGA doles out punishment privately (see Dustin Johnson), we may not see Phil for a while with only Phil saying why.

Anyone thing Tom Watson has a smile on his face.

Schadenfreude is a dish best served cold!

[John Kavanaugh]

A strange cocktail of union busting and racism is being mixed for your pleasure.

[Steve Lang]

   in regard to the wise stewards at the PGA, let us not forget the $40,000,000 PIP program in 2021 and Phil's twitter...

I’d like to thank all the crazies (and real supporters too) for………………… Helping me win the PiP!! To get the 2nd half of the money I have to add an event I haven’t played in awhile. See you in Kapalua P.S. I’ll try and find another hot controversial topic soon

9:44 AM · Dec 29, 2021

[John Kirk]

John,


If you're wishing the world were simply a better place, fine. But if you're insinuating Phil's actions through this should somehow be obscured, I don't think you've paid attention to them.


He proactively sought to undermine the PGA Tour with a regime that is exactly as he described to Shipnuck. His various rumored transgressions through the years have been largely kept under wraps, this one couldn't possibly be...

Hi Jim,

Thanks for responding to my comments.  Mostly I'm mad at myself for taking the bait and offering my opinion at all.  I have no interest in obscuring this or knowing this.  After that, I wrote more explanations for about twenty minutes and then deleted them.




 

[BHoover]

Mostly I'm mad at myself for taking the bait and offering my opinion at all.  I have no interest in obscuring this or knowing this.  After that, I wrote more explanations for about twenty minutes and then deleted them.

What bait? I posted that Phil lost his endorsement deal with KPMG. He lost said deal because of foolish and, well, insane comments he made.


At least you didn’t respond with some crazy rant about “cancel culture” or an incorrect interpretation of how the First Amendment actually operates with respect to speech.

[JESII]

I think he just meant the bait of even entering into a gossip type conversation on here...which is fair and commendable. I find myself more drawn to these anymore, and am not too thrilled by it.

[John Kirk]

Hi BHoover,

I actually meant the opening post and story was an irresistible topic.  But yeah, mostly this is an inner struggle to not say anything about subjects of this nature.

[astavrides]

This is a golf course architecture forum, but it is also one of the only online forums that I know of with mostly smart people who have a wide variety of opinions on matters other than GCA. Most online forums are echo chambers or insult fests.
Constructive dialogue is one of the only ways to help solve problems and heal divides.

[Jeff Taylor]

Great to see s many "Newbies" on this site. 

[David Cronan]

While most of the golf world seems offended, I imagine Patrick Reed is overjoyed at these developments.

[jeffwarne]

Doubt Phil is on Norman's Christmas list....

[BHoover]

Doubt Phil is on Norman's Christmas list....

The least Greg Norman could do is send the Mickelson family a Christmas card…no doubt featuring a photo of a partially clothed Shark walking his dog on the beach.

[Carl Johnson]

Hoo boy, KPMG is dropping Phil, effective immediately. That has to put a dent in Phil’s walking-around gambling money.

Wow.  I feel like this is so harsh.  Welcome to punitive world.

In retrospect, I was kind of irritated this thread ever got started.  Mickelson shoots his mouth off a bit, and somebody sees a story.  The irresistible story gets shared on GCA, and some of us (including myself) are compelled to comment.  As hard as I try to say something sensible, I always feel a bit stupid afterwards.  The comments are polite, but it is impossible not to inject opinions about relevant politics and economics.  A few people get irritated by the comments, but this time it didn't escalate further.

I hate being yanked around by the tabloid nature of modern journalism.  The only reason I care whether KPMG dropped Phil Mickelson as a client is that I regret the original story was ever reported.  Can't we have more nice stories, and fewer efforts to exploit human shortcomings?  This is quite a price to pay for being a little cavalier and imprecise with his words.  It's sad that this hit piece strategy works so well.  I'm not biting next time.

Mea culpa.  I started the thread simply by posting a link to a Washington Post article, without comment by me  I was curious whether it would take off and what course it might take.  Now I know.

[Mike Schott]

   Phil may have learned that he can’t shoot someone on 5th Avenue and lose no support. His only apology was to the Saudis. I suspect the PGA views him as an insurrectionist and will deal with him accordingly. Because the PGA doles out punishment privately (see Dustin Johnson), we may not see Phil for a while with only Phil saying why.

He should be shown the door by the PGA. He needs some time away. Make it lifetime. Anyone think Tom Watson has a smile on his face. I’m amazed any of the Americans go there to play. Why is no one mentioning 911? They funded the terrorists.

The same reason the US Government continues to have a strong relationship with Saudi Arabia. Money, strategy and resources.

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