Anyone here play hickory golf?

[Tony Ristola]

About 5-years ago I played an event. Was a blast. Bought a set of hickories last year... not the replica's, but the 100-year old stuff. Have played only one round since with modern equipment.


It's more fun. You have to think about where you want to go. The ball spins less... and the game becomes one of angles. The entrance to the green has meaning because you're often bouncing in shots.


Hit it into the rough, and you're hoping for a good lie, and even with a good lie you're not going to get the control or spin.


I hit hickories as far as the average golfer hits their modern gear, so it gives me an even better perspective of their game.


If you get the chance, give it a go. It's more fun than playing with bomb-and-gouge gear.

[Tommy Williamsen]

What kind of ball do you use?

[Mike Hendren]

You have to think about where you want to go. The ball spins less... and the game becomes one of angles. The entrance to the green has meaning because you're often bouncing in shots.

Hit it into the rough, and you're hoping for a good lie, and even with a good lie you're not going to get the control or spin.

Sums up my game nicely - with modern equipment.  Unfortunately some of us are not as highly skilled as you apparently are.  Good for you, seriously.


Bogey

[Ian Mackenzie]

No.
But every year three of us play with butter-knife tour blades and persimmons.
I still have my Wilson Staff Tour Blades and MacGregor Eye-O-Matics.


We are, however, running out of Titleist "Professional 100" balls...;-)

[JMEvensky]

No.
But every year three of us play with butter-knife tour blades and persimmons.
I still have my Wilson Staff Tour Blades and MacGregor Eye-O-Matics.


We are, however, running out of Titleist "Professional 100" balls...;-)

I have a group that does the same but a little more frequently.


And I have that exact same set-up but occasionally use a Toney Penna driver instead of the MacGregor.


I assume you're also using a WS JP IV sand wedge and putting with a circa 1975 8802 (Neumann leather wrap grip, of course).

[Tim Martin]

I hit hickories as far as the average golfer hits their modern gear, so it gives me an even better perspective of their game.

What ball?

[Peter Flory]

I play about a third of my golf with hickories at this point.  The only reason I don't do it 100% of the time is because I still like to play tournament golf and there are limited hickory events. 

One big misconception that people have is that it is next to impossible- mainly because they see the antique clubs that might be on the wall at their club (rusted clubhead with a warped shaft and a slick leather grip).  But when you get the solid clubs with good swing weights and you put on a fresh leather grip, they aren't that much different than hitting blades from the '80s.  The biggest difference is obviously the driver.  But the 2nd biggest is that you don't have much bounce on the wedges and the putters aren't as forgiving.

The thing that makes it more exciting than modern golf for me is that there is more variability, especially is you try to push the limits and swing hard.  There is more risk reward and course management becomes a much bigger part of the sport. 

With the balls- McIntyre makes replica golf balls with the old dimple patterns.  I like the mesh pattern the best.  But you can also use a ProV or any soft golf ball that won't damage the woods.  A ProV doesn't perform any better than a replica ball because you're actually looking for more spin, especially with the woods. 

[BHoover]

I have become very interested in playing both with hickories (mostly vintage clubs but a couple modern replicas as well) and steel-shafted persimmon woods and blades (usually 1950s MacGregor persimmon woods and Hogan or MacGregor forged irons). I usually use the same ball for either type — something with a lower compression like the Bridgestone e6 or Wilson Duo Soft. I also have a few pristine balata balls that I can’t quite bring myself to play.

At this point I would say about 1/3 of my rounds are with these vintage clubs, whether hickories or steel. It also depends on course conditions as it’s more fun and easier to play old irons on firmer turf.

I enjoy it very much and always enjoy it more when I can find others also interested in playing. I’ve been trying to drum up interest at my course and also am looking forward to playing in some organized events.

[Bill Seitz]

With the balls- McIntyre makes replica golf balls with the old dimple patterns.  I like the mesh pattern the best.  But you can also use a ProV or any soft golf ball that won't damage the woods.  A ProV doesn't perform any better than a replica ball because you're actually looking for more spin, especially with the woods.

My understanding is that they McIntyre's are molded from Wilson Staff Duos which are very soft.  Probably cheaper just to buy Duos, but they don't look as cool.

[Ian Mackenzie]

No.
But every year three of us play with butter-knife tour blades and persimmons.
I still have my Wilson Staff Tour Blades and MacGregor Eye-O-Matics.


We are, however, running out of Titleist "Professional 100" balls...;-)

I have a group that does the same but a little more frequently.


And I have that exact same set-up but occasionally use a Toney Penna driver instead of the MacGregor.


I assume you're also using a WS JP IV sand wedge and putting with a circa 1975 8802 (Neumann leather wrap grip, of course).

Definitely have an 8802 (with new grip), but wedge is a Wilson JP-57 (also with new grip...;-)

[Ian Mackenzie]

I have become very interested in playing both with hickories (mostly vintage clubs but a couple modern replicas as well) and steel-shafted persimmon woods and blades (usually 1950s MacGregor persimmon woods and Hogan or MacGregor forged irons). I usually use the same ball for either type — something with a lower compression like the Bridgestone e6 or Wilson Duo Soft. I also have a few pristine balata balls that I can’t quite bring myself to play.

At this point I would say about 1/3 of my rounds are with these vintage clubs, whether hickories or steel. It also depends on course conditions as it’s more fun and easier to play old irons on firmer turf.

I enjoy it very much and always enjoy it more when I can find others also interested in playing. I’ve been trying to drum up interest at my course and also am looking forward to playing in some organized events.

My first right-handed irons (when I switched at age 15 in 1977 after playing lefty because of hockey/lacrosse) was a set of MacGregor Ben Hogans.


Wish I still had them.

[BHoover]

My preferred vintage blades are a set of Ben Hogan Apex redlines and a set of MacGregor Nicklaus Muirfields. I had a set of the Hogans in high school then foolishly let them go. I found a good set on eBay a couple years ago and love them.

For drivers, my favorites are an early 50s MacGregor M85 and a Toney Penna Mod 1.

[Aaron Marks]

I play ~75% of my golf with hickories.  They force the strategy that modern clubs allow you to use equipment to ignore. Hickory golf on a course filled with decisions is just sublime.   Bunkers are terrifying, long carries are risky and the rough is a big problem from much more than 130 yards. 

Hickories are satisfying to play well with - good shots carry more weight - you know you hit a good shot when a 22* mid iron goes straight.  It's also easier to laugh off the truly horrible shots that rear their heads - especially off the tee.

The craftsmanship that goes into a hickory, and the experience of repairing and working on them, make them feel like living things.  They take on a personality of their own and that adds some flavor to golf, too.

On the right course, I'd choose hickories 100% of time. 

[Peter Flory]

With the balls- McIntyre makes replica golf balls with the old dimple patterns.  I like the mesh pattern the best.  But you can also use a ProV or any soft golf ball that won't damage the woods.  A ProV doesn't perform any better than a replica ball because you're actually looking for more spin, especially with the woods.

My understanding is that they McIntyre's are molded from Wilson Staff Duos which are very soft.  Probably cheaper just to buy Duos, but they don't look as cool.

That is correct.  It's just the old dimple patterns weren't optimized like a Duo would be.  But even with that, I don't notice any real difference to be honest. 

One other thing is that the old 1.62" balls went significantly further than the 1.68" based on thing I read from when the transition happened.  So I've always felt like a modern ball isn't that different with hickory clubs than an original tech 1.62" ball would have been.  There are many accounts of guys hitting those 300-350 or more yards under certain conditions... obviously taking the turf into account as well.  A modern 1.68" ball will sit up higher on the turf and will roll truer, but it will also not be as spinny as what you'd ideally want. 

A newly manufactured balata ball from the mid 80s would be the optimal ball for hickory golf if someone would manufacture them again. 

[Thomas Dai]

I’ve been playing hickories on occasions for a few years now.
Playing with them is a really good way to appreciate why courses of earlier eras were designed, constructed and maintained the way they were. Also why players swings and technique, strategy etc was the way it once was. Shame however, that suitable past era balls aren’t as easily and economically available as the clubs. Mind unlike modern balls, olden era wound balls would ‘cut’ and go out of shape really easily. Indeed some olden era balls were likely never actually round or had an accurately centered core.
Atb

PS - A shorter on the card course with hickories and an older era ball can play the equivalent of a modern long yardage course with modern clubs and balls. Likely a similar number of shots.

[Jay Mickle]

I have been playing for the past 10 years. Pinehurst/Southern Pines is sort of an epicenter for it. The Carolina Hickory Golf Association (CHGA) http://carolinahickory.ning.com is the largest state hickory golf group and has regular local events (tournaments) each month. Nationally the governing body is the Society of Hickory Golfers SoHG https://www.hickorygolfers.com and the keeper of official hickory handicaps.
Playing with hickories exposes the strategic options of golden age courses in an "ah ha" moment kind of way. Niblicks and mesh pattern balls just don't stop and drop or back up. More shot making skills need to be mastered to work one's way around a course. And then there is the sweet spot, not the sweet face. It is likely the size of a dime and when properly struck there is very little difference in modern and hickory irons. Miss toe or heel and you are 20-30 yards shorter and left or right more than you would like. When properly struck an. original hickory gives you reason to want to play hickories more often as it seem to impart a connection to the game that graphite/ceramic/titanium/beryllium techno trash can't match.
I only play them occasionally but should more often as they are a good excuse for a bad game.

[Matt MacIver]

I play my hickories ~4x a year, nine holes after work mostly. I’ve only played 18 holes one time - with Jay in Pinehurst (thanks Jay!).  I love everything about what’s [size=78%] been said above. And after seven years my beloved spoon shaft broke under the stress of an incredibly long and challenging green approach - such happens in this version of the game. [/size]

[Jim Sherma]

I play vintage equipment a few weeks out of the year as a change of pace. I have kept every set that had extended runs in my bag over the years and my preferred vintage set includes black-face MacGregor MT's (saddle-back) 4-9 with an 11-wedge (I have the 2 and 3 but don't carry them), 1950's era Walter Hagen 2-wood with a driver shaft that I in it back in 1982 or so, Toney Penna persimmon 5-wood, and a Ram TW-55 sand wedge. Last time out I putted with an aluminum shafted Wilson 8813, sometimes I'll use a brass Spalding Cash-In. I found that last-year's 3-piece Kirkland worked very well with this set, too much spin for the modern equipment, but just about right for the older stuff.


I agree that the game is a little more challenging and interesting with the old equipment. If I committed fully to them I think my scores would be fairly similar even if how I got there looked different.

[Tony Ristola]

What kind of ball do you use?

Great question.


Low compression balls.


Wilson Duo Soft (I believe this is a 29 compression)
Callaway SuperSoft
TaylorMade Soft Response
Srixon UltiFeel (Something like that)
Pro V1 oddly enough soft enough for hickories, but not the V1x
Titliest Tour Soft


There are others. Not every "Soft" ball is soft.


Hard balls should be avoided.

[BHoover]

As others have said, it would be great if someone offered a replica of the 1980s-era balata ball. There’s a market for the hickory-era ball, so I think they could also be a market for a balata remake.

[Tony Ristola]

As others have said, it would be great if someone offered a replica of the 1980s-era balata ball. There’s a market for the hickory-era ball, so I think they could also be a market for a balata remake.

The low compression balls are excellent.


The Titliest 384 was a great ball.

[Peter Flory]

As others have said, it would be great if someone offered a replica of the 1980s-era balata ball. There’s a market for the hickory-era ball, so I think they could also be a market for a balata remake.

I think that the issue is that the balatas are hard to make vs the replicas, due to the wound nature and the liquid injection, etc.  If they were marketed well, I think that they could be a thing though.  Maybe if someone like Snell decided to make them.  But it could be a total folly as well for them. 

[Jim Sherma]

I wonder if Acushnet kept any of the old lines in storage. I'm sure that the high quality wound balls required fairly significant capital expenditure in the manufacturing lines. Much more mechanically intensive than the various molding techniques used for solid balls.

[Peter Sayegh]

Jay Mickle,I heard that PinehurstCC started renting hickory sets. Can you confirm this? I would love to take a couple of friends out just for the fun/humiliation of it...only on #1 or #3.

[Jay Mickle]

Jay Mickle,I heard that PinehurstCC started renting hickory sets. Can you confirm this? I would love to take a couple of friends out just for the fun/humiliation of it...only on #1 or #3.

Confirmed. Replica hickory sets are available.