Courses that changed how you think about golf.

[Tommy Williamsen]

A similar thread was begun by JJ Shanley a few years ago. I thought I begin a new one with a little different twist.
Lincoln GC in Michigan in 1955. The first course I played. I was eight years old. I didn't care about the course just tried to get the ball airborne. I played with hickories my Dad got me. I was hooked. I played the course years later and decided that playing golf was more important than the course. Then played it again and changed my mind. The quality of the course was more important to the enjoyment of the round than score.

Fort Meade golf club 1961-1964. I grew up on those two courses and learned how to play a variety of shots. I learned how to compete. When I think of playing golf, my thoughts invariably go back there. I spent some of the happiest moments of my golfing life on that course with my father.

Riviera in 1983 was my first really good course. I didn't know how good golf could be.
Musgrove Mill in 1995. I had never seen anything like it. I joined on the spot. It was fun, difficult, and beautiful with some of the most interesting greens and hazards I had played.

Ballybunion in 1991 was my first experience with links golf and fell in love.
Royal County Down in 1991 on my first trip to GB&I. It was the most difficult course I had ever played and loved every minute. I learned that blind shots are part of the game. After many plays it still is my favorite course in the world.

[Peter Pallotta]

Scarlett Woods, about the most modest of Toronto's municipal courses, built in the early 70s as a family & beginner friendly course: an 'executive' 18 holes in a treed-parkland setting with many Par 3s and with all the Par 4s between 225 and 300 yards long, except for one at 340 yards -- and often dog-legging left or right. I didn't take up the game until my mid 30s, so never played it as a youngster (even though it was minutes from my home). When I did play it many years later, it taught me two things:
1. Golf course design isn't so much about what the architect intends as it is about what the golfer experiences. (The great architects & designs don't prescribe but instead 'allow for' a myriad of individual experiences.)
2. You have to play & accept the architecture-a course exactly as you find it, not as you expect or want it to be -- even if it means taking a 7 iron off the tee to get to the corner of a dogleg left; or discovering that your overly-faded driver was actually the perfect shot on a short dogleg right, and that you now have to wrap your head around having a Texas wedge left for eagle.

[Bill Gayne]

Ballybunion in 1991 was my first experience with links golf and fell in love.

Same for me as Ballybunion was my first links experience. Went to sleep on a nice Irish evening in a bed next to an open window. Woke up  middle of the night shivering and wet with rain and wind coming through the window sideways. Dawn didn't bring any better weather and coming from America my water proof gear wasn't up to Irish standards. Ended up playing both courses and never looked backed.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Probably Shoreacres, as I had never seen a course like that one before.

[Bill Brightly]

Royal Melbourne. I had been hanging out on GCA.COM for a few years and kept reading posts talking about  the importance of playing angles and valuing width. As someone who played almost exclusively on parkland courses designed for an aerial game, I really didn't understand. Then I went on the GCA Boomerang and played RM West with the guys. I found myself in the (very wide) fairways a few times, but on the completely wrong side.  The light bulb went off in my head and I said, "ah, WIDTH, I get it now!"

[Ira Fishman]

I am taking the topic as stated: thinking about golf versus golf course architecture. I grew up playing Chicago Park District courses (Edgebrook, Billy Caldwell, Chick Evans). We were kids who fell in love with the game. So one year, we found a way to go to the Western Open at Butler National. All of us thought we could become Pros. Until we watched Pros play on a course a tad more difficult than our “home” courses.


Ira

[mike_malone]

Had to be the shock of Myopia in the mid 80’s. It was so unpredictable and intriguing. Could golf be this higgledy-piggledy?

[Sean_A]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.

Ciao

[Thomas Dai]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.
Ciao

+1 .... played some akin to these as a kid but didn't appreciate them back then. Himalayas at St-A too.
Love the concept of reversible courses and reversible versions of the above would be tremendous.
The other side of the coin is how little time I now have for lush, tree-lined, manicured parkland courses.
atb

[Sean_A]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.
Ciao

+1 .... played some akin to these as a kid but didn't appreciate them back then. Himalayas at St-A too.
Love the concept of reversible courses and reversible versions of the above would be tremendous.
The other side of the coin is how little time I now have for lush, tree-lined, manicured parkland courses.
atb

I was sold on the idea animals as greenkeepers a long time ago. Not because of a sense of rustic golf being cool. But because I prefer the conditions and presentation. Add the element of non golfers enjoying the land at the same time and really do get a feeling that the future of golf will be OK.

Ciao

[Thomas Dai]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.
Ciao

+1 .... played some akin to these as a kid but didn't appreciate them back then. Himalayas at St-A too.
Love the concept of reversible courses and reversible versions of the above would be tremendous.
The other side of the coin is how little time I now have for lush, tree-lined, manicured parkland courses.
atb

I was sold on the idea animals as greenkeepers a long time ago. Not because of a sense of rustic golf being cool. But because I prefer the conditions and presentation. Add the element of non golfers enjoying the land at the same time and really do get a feeling that the future of golf will be OK.
Ciao

The idea of golfers and non-golfers mixing and enjoying the same patch of land could even be enhanced if the golf balls specification were re-jigged so that it didn't hurt or cause damage if it were to hit someone or something.
atb

[Michael Underwood]

Royal Lytham & St. Annes Golf Club - The first Open Championship rota course that I had ever played.  I thought that the course and especially the ground game was wonderful.  As good as the golf experience was it was the history and strolling sacred golf ground that made the hair on my neck stand up.  As I walked down the 17th and a member that I was playing with pointed out the Bobby Jones bunker it was truly special in my golf life.


Royal County Down - Possibly the best golf course that I have ever played.  Just awestruck at the quality of shaping and the interest of the golf course.


Pacific Dunes - Great golf course in the United States and the undeniable beauty of the Oregon Coast.  I was so happy when this "kind" of golf was built for the public in the United States.


Ballyneal Golf Club - Much like with Pacific Dunes the excitement of having a true firm and fast golf course that was sand based and offered the opportunity for the ball to be played on the ground was very exciting.


There are other great golf courses that I have enjoyed playing, but the above four experiences have had a profound impact on what I think about design and architecture.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.

Ciao

Sean, when I first played RND I had never seen animals on the course. I had never even heard that animals could be on the course. Between the design of the course, maintenance, and horses and sheep I felt as though it must have 1905 and not 2005. Too bad I wasn't playing with hickories.

[David Ober]

Great topic.


In order of playing them:

• Lakeside -- I never knew how fun (and interesting) playing a course with tiny greens could be. The back-to-back 12th and 13th are such fun holes when the pressure is on. And then the 78-yard "short 15." What a blast to play in the afternoon when the wind is 15 - 18 mph and the green is firm.
• Rustic Canyon -- Realized just how much I had been missing in Southern California with an inability to play a single course like Rustic where you had so many choices on virtually every approach shot. Fell in love with the place immediately.
• Riviera -- first time playing one of the very best courses in the world. It's everything people who love it say it is -- and I don't even mind the kikuyu grass because they keep it so tight. Very, very playable from the correct tees.
• The Old Course -- Realized just how much a course like Rustic Canyon owes to TOC. Loved every second of playing it.
• Bandon ... All of 'em -- Realized that golf is in good hands and still has a bright future ahead of it, if a place like Bandon can thrive in the modern world

[Craig Sweet]

I play a nine holer in Anaconda, Montana. It is not a course you would go out of your way to play.  No bunkers, very low budget.  But, I can walk nine in a little over an hour and make it to work by 9am.  I pay $425 a year to be a member. The GM/Pro is the nicest guy in the world, and he makes my visiting friends feel like old friends. The members are as blue collar as it gets. Many of the old guys grew up working in the smelter, or the mines in Butte.


A few years ago my view of WHY I play golf changed. It is not for competition with others, it is not to grind out a score and a handicap card. I play for the fresh air and the walk. Yes, I still talk to myself after a bad shot. You can't go from being a 2 handicapper in your 20's to shooting bogey golf in your late 60's without being a little harsh on yourself.  But scoring is not nearly as important to me, now, as how consistent I am striking the ball. 

[Chris_Blakely]

A similar thread was begun by JJ Shanley a few years ago. I thought I begin a new one with a little different twist.
Lincoln GC in Michigan in 1955. The first course I played. I was eight years old. I didn't care about the course just tried to get the ball airborne. I played with hickories my Dad got me. I was hooked. I played the course years later and decided that playing golf was more important than the course. Then played it again and changed my mind. The quality of the course was more important to the enjoyment

Which Lincoln golf cousin Michigan:  the one in Whitehall or the one in Grand Rapids?  Both had portions built in the 20s.


Chris

[Tommy Williamsen]

A similar thread was begun by JJ Shanley a few years ago. I thought I begin a new one with a little different twist.
Lincoln GC in Michigan in 1955. The first course I played. I was eight years old. I didn't care about the course just tried to get the ball airborne. I played with hickories my Dad got me. I was hooked. I played the course years later and decided that playing golf was more important than the course. Then played it again and changed my mind. The quality of the course was more important to the enjoyment

Which Lincoln golf cousin Michigan:  the one in Whitehall or the one in Grand Rapids?  Both had portions built in the 20s.


Chris

The one just south of Whitehall. Have you played it? I think it has been forty years since I was there. The last time was with my Dad. He loved it because the green fees were about $15. It was short but fun because I was with him.

[Sean_A]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.

Ciao

Sean, when I first played RND I had never seen animals on the course. I had never even heard that animals could be on the course. Between the design of the course, maintenance, and horses and sheep I felt as though it must have 1905 and not 2005. Too bad I wasn't playing with hickories.

Tommy


I dearly wish there were more courses with animals helping to maintain them, but I am taking it a to higher level.  I am talking about non-golfers accessing the same land at the same time. Golfers are far too precious about their courses.


Ciao

[Tommy Williamsen]

Common land courses such as Minch Old and Cleeve Cloud etc with multiple same time usage have completely changed how I think about the game.

Ciao

Sean, when I first played RND I had never seen animals on the course. I had never even heard that animals could be on the course. Between the design of the course, maintenance, and horses and sheep I felt as though it must have 1905 and not 2005. Too bad I wasn't playing with hickories.

Tommy


I dearly wish there were more courses with animals helping to maintain them, but I am taking it a to higher level.  I am talking about non-golfers accessing the same land at the same time. Golfers are far too precious about their courses.


Ciao

There are almost as many walkers as sheep at RND. As you know. Both golfers, walkers, horses, and sheep seem to coexist well.

[Chris_Blakely]

The one just south of Whitehall. Have you played it? I think it has been forty years since I was there. The last time was with my Dad. He loved it because the green fees were about $15. It was short but fun because I was with him.

I have played Lincoln CC in Grand Rapids that unfortunately just closed.  I have played the one just south of Whitehall and across the street from Michigan Adventure.  I sought both out because they were built in the 20's.  Lincoln CC the entire course was built in the 20's and Lincoln GC (Whitehall) the original 9 holes (mostly front 9) was built in 1927.  Based on the photos I took, the original greens have a lot of character.

[Brad Tufts]

Tedesco CC:  My home course, home course to several generations of my family before me.  I'm so fortunate that "golf" from the start was a Golden-Age course with an interesting architectural history...and fast, smooth greens!


Essex CC:  First played it in an interclub when I was about 14, I almost lost my bag in the fescue at one point.  This bridged the gap from the parkland course at Tedesco, to a more rugged parkland course with linksy roots like ECC.  Playing it once each year from 14, I shot 119, then 89, then 76, and it continues to teach me things today at age 40.


Prestwick:  Played many of the favorites during this formative trip, but it was Prestwick that was most fun for me.  Links golf is almost a different sport, but helped my total knowledge of golf's roots, and the evolution to parkland golf as I know it in New England.


I've been lucky to see hundreds of courses since, but all seem to be variations of thoughts formed at the above three.  I like innovative designs, and I don't shy away from controversial architectural ideas.  One that always sticks out is Jim Engh's Four Mile Ranch near Pueblo, CO...wild terrain, no bunkers, shale mounds, wild green concepts, blind shots.  I've played it 4 or 5 times now, and it's awesome!

[David Wuthrich]

Wolf Point!