[Brian_Ewen]

Just in case ...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/island-golfers-accept-defeat-in-wrangle-to-tee-off-on-sabbath-zn755pgrg


Island golfers accept defeat in wrangle to tee off on Sabbath
Mike Merritt
Friday March 26 2021



Golfers in the Outer Hebrides have agreed not to play on Sunday after a decade of wrangling with landlords over playing on the Sabbath.

Playing on Sundays is outlawed at the 18-hole course built on Lewis 70 years ago, under a clause in the lease with the Stornoway Trust.

Stornoway golf club had wanted the ban abolished and refused to sign a new lease, which ran out four years ago. The trust repeatedly turned down the golf club’s request and threatened eviction.

In 2019 a trust board meeting agreed that “due to the golf club’s continued failure to sign their new lease, trustees agreed that the trust’s solicitor should be instructed to issue a termination notice, should the club continue to fail to reach agreement”.

But Andrew Reeves, the club captain, has said this week that the club had agreed not to play on Sundays.

“When it came down to it that’s the way it panned out,” he said. Another member said both sides recognised they did not want to get involved in potentially expensive court action and “a truce” was declared. But there are review breaks in the lease which means the issue could be revisited.

In an online survey 70 per cent of respondents had backed all sports in the Lewis Castle Grounds “being treated the same way by the Stornoway Trust”.

Since 1949 the club, which has 250 members, had been paying just £50-a-year to use the course. The new lease is believed to be a couple of hundred pounds a year.

Iain Maciver, a trust factor, said the new lease would cover 20 years. He called the club a “huge asset”.

It is another victory for Sabbatarians on Lewis. Leisure facilities on the island have traditionally closed on Sundays.

Lewis’s public swimming pool and sports centre was set to open for a trial period on Sundays — but were refused by the Western Isles council that said its decision was for “operational reasons”.

Local authority-run leisure centres on Lewis and nearby Harris are closed, but similar sites in the Western Isles are open on Sundays. Despite church protests, Sunday screenings in Lewis’s only public cinema have proved popular and are set to continue when allowed.

A businesswoman on Lewis defied Sabbatarians in 2017 to open her shop.

Leona Rawlinson, who runs Tweed Tastic in Stornoway, was sent a Bible and a letter from The Lord’s Day Observance Society, Lewis and Harris branch asking her to not open.

She said she had suffered “appalling” harassment and intimidation.

[Adam Lawrence]

Lewis and Harris are both affected in this way, I think -- the Isle of Harris GC online booking engine does not offer Sunday tee times. The north of the Hebrides is dominated by extreme Calvinistic protestant churches, and thus there is an almost complete ban on doing _anything_ much on a Sunday (I once stayed in a holiday cottage on Lewis and there was a notice in the house that said 'Please do not hang out washing or allow your children to play football on a Sunday as it will offend the locals') but the southern part of the islands, including South Uist, where Askernish is, is Catholic, and therefore rather more free and easy 

[Tim Martin]

Lewis and Harris are both affected in this way, I think -- the Isle of Harris GC online booking engine does not offer Sunday tee times. The north of the Hebrides is dominated by extreme Calvinistic protestant churches, and thus there is an almost complete ban on doing _anything_ much on a Sunday (I once stayed in a holiday cottage on Lewis and there was a notice in the house that said 'Please do not hang out washing or allow your children to play football on a Sunday as it will offend the locals') but the southern part of the islands, including South Uist, where Askernish is, is Catholic, and therefore rather more free and easy 

Would rather deal with the guilt and shame than not play. As someone who takes a great amount of joy from eating a cheeseburger on Good Friday being a lapsed Catholic has it’s advantages.

[Tom_Doak]

Hmmm, I wonder if that's why nobody was around at Isle of Harris GC the morning I stopped in?  The possibility never occurred to me.

[Kalen Braley]

Ha, and i thought Utah was bad, although they certainly have their own set of Blue laws here, car dealerships and state run liquor stores are closed on Sundays...

But you can still play golf! 

[David_Tepper]

For many decades ferry service between the Hebrides and mainland Scotland did not run on Sunday. Ferry service between Lewis and the mainland on Sunday did not start till 2009.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/jul/19/sunday-ferry-stornoway-christianity   

[C. Sturges]

Kalen,


What about Thanksgiving Point?   I know they used to be closed on Sunday.  They even had Johnny’s tournaments there play Wednesday-Saturday.


Things must be changing for the better since I lived there.


ps. Lots of state’s liquor stores are closed on Sunday, but not New Hampshire that advertise on the freeways that they are open for liquor and lottery tickets on Sunday!!!


chris

[V. Kmetz]

Ha, and i thought Utah was bad, although they certainly have their own set of Blue laws here, car dealerships and state run liquor stores are closed on Sundays...

But you can still play golf! 

Many years back, the (laughably incongruous named) Utah Jazz couldn't play home games on Sunday; their games were often the only ones on Monday night (9:30 ET)...is that still a thing?


Though I remember, and sometimes miss, the slower pace of Sundays, I couldn't go back to the <1970s world where a lot of commerce was dormant... I remember the long lines (during the 73-75 oil crisis) on Saturday afternoon at the gas pumps.

[John Kavanaugh]

I doubt if I am alone in enjoying a car lot without car salesmen.

[Tim Martin]

I doubt if I am alone in enjoying a car lot without car salesmen.

I’m getting ready to purchase a car for my wife and am going with the no visit to the dealership option which has become popular since COVID. The only reason I have hesitated so far is that I don’t want to deprive myself of the joy I’ve gotten fantasizing about the transaction.

[Kalen Braley]

Chris,

That's a good question, I haven't played TP in years, but I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case as its in Utah County which is still like 80% Mormon.  In most states, at least in the West, liquor isn't controlled by state run stores, but at least we don't have dry counties thou.  The state run stores are a joke thou, many are located in dank old buildings, grossly understaffed, and they never refrigerate the beer...all the while charging a significant "sin" tax that they use for other state budgets...its nothing short of a legal racket as I see it.

VK,

They do play Jazz games on Sundays now, but if I had to guess it would be one of the fewest in the league.  The UFC also pulled out on doing an event here a few years back because they had all kinds of crazy rules regarding the fight card running over into Sunday at the stroke of midnight...

P.S.  John, I'm surprised you don't like car salespeople, they are my absolute fav.  I always enjoy returning the favor on the game playing in the buying process.

[John Kavanaugh]

On my last purchase the very young salesman asked if I would pose for a photo next to the car. I still can't believe the detail he required from me to deny his request.

[Ally Mcintosh]

I last visited Lewis / Stornoway 25 years ago. I stayed with a friend.


To give you an idea of how seriously they take their Sundays, the jammed out pubs would close at 11 on Saturday so that everyone could be home by midnight.


On the Sunday itself, many families go to Church twice, 90 minutes in the morning in Gaelic and 90 minutes in the evening in English. This is the only reason to go outdoors. I went out for a walk with my friend. It was the first time she had been outside on a Sunday for 4 years other than to go to church. We played monopoly indoors. This in itself was a “special treat” for my benefit.


I’m not sure all families were the same but it was pretty much the norm.

[Tom_Doak]

I doubt if I am alone in enjoying a car lot without car salesmen.

You are not.


I have often thought that if I worked on a course adjacent to a town, I would do the St. Andrews thing and close the course for at least part of the day on Sunday, so that the residents could use it as a park and have a more vested interest in supporting the existence of the course.  I doubt I will ever find a client who agrees, though.

[Peter Pallotta]

Whenever I hear the word 'Hebrides' I think of that Bugs Bunny episode. He makes a wrong turn at the La Brea tar pits and ends up playing a round of golf against a true Scotsman, who accuses him of engaging in 'a dirty bit of cheating'. Bugs feigns insult & outrage -- and then with his usual facile patter and bluster and a string of made-up historical precedents, convinces the Scotsman that he was wrong. I still remember the poignant moment when that good & honest man hangs his head in shame and says 'Ah, the weight of evidence is against me'. It's the only time I ever disliked Bugs -- even as an 8 year old I realized that he'd used the golfer's own code of honour as a weapon against him! And that episode was my introduction to the game of golf!

[Thomas Dai]

How many Sundays per year is golf on TOC permitted?
Atb

[Clyde Johnson]

Hmmm, I wonder if that's why nobody was around at Isle of Harris GC the morning I stopped in?  The possibility never occurred to me.

Yes it was. There's a sign on the gate that says so, I'm pretty sure.


When I was there in 2018, I got rained off on the Saturday, so had to hang around an extra couple of days for the Monday. Well worth it for those 2nd and 3rd greens!

[Joe_Tucholski]

The land owners are clearly within their rights to maintain the stipulation that golf is prohibited on Sunday.  The article also clearly mentions the great terms of the lease.

The surprising thing to me is the trust allowed the club to continue using the land without a lease for 4 years.  I can't image the club has any sort of chance to change the terms of the lease during the "review breaks."

[Thomas Dai]

Remote islands and religious practices. The film ‘The Wicker Man’ comes to mind.
Atb

[JohnVDB]

BYU won’t play any sports on Sundays.  This has led to the NCAA golf championships having to have them play their Sunday round the day before the tournament begins for the other teams.  The other teams play practice rounds on Thursday morning, the holes are set in Sunday’s locations after that and they go out as 5 singles with referees.  The other teams can go out and watch.  Then on Sunday, they don’t play while the other teams do.


This works ok because the stroke play portion of the championships don’t end until Monday with match play on Tuesday and Wednesday.

[Ronald Montesano]

Are the distilleries open?

[Adam Lawrence]

Are the distilleries open?

There really aren’t many distilleries in the Outer Isles. But the two I know of in Lewis/Harris are not, according to Google

[Marty Bonnar]

Are the distilleries open?

There really aren’t many distilleries in the Outer Isles. But the two I know of in Lewis/Harris are not, according to Google

The Isle of Harris gin is rather good - and comes in a really beautiful bottle.


https://harrisdistillery.com/pages/isle-of-harris-gin


F.

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