Joyce Wethered

[Tommy Williamsen]

I have long been aware of her and Glenna Collett Vare. There is nice article on her in today's Morning Read.


https://www.morningread.com/news-opinion/feature/2020-11-24/as-good-as-bobby-jones-yes-and-then-some?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Morning+Read+11-25-2020

[Tom_Doak]

My favorite story about Ms. Wethered was something that Jones wrote about their match at St. Andrews:  that she played the 4th hole by going well out to the left, and then playing between the mound in front of the green and the bunker, using the mound to her advantage to steer the ball back to the left.  He marveled at the line because of how straight a hitter you'd have to be to even consider playing it that way; he had never thought of it, and never seen anyone else do it.

[Tommy Williamsen]

My favorite story about Ms. Wethered was something that Jones wrote about their match at St. Andrews:  that she played the 4th hole by going well out to the left, and then playing between the mound in front of the green and the bunker, using the mound to her advantage to steer the ball back to the left.  He marveled at the line because of how straight a hitter you'd have to be to even consider playing it that way; he had never thought of it, and never seen anyone else do it.

The ultimate in local knowledge and knowing your game.

[Peter Pallotta]

And to think that she could own her golf swing so completely and play the game so brilliantly several whole decades before Gankas even started teaching, and when the only ‘trackman’ she knew was Eric Liddell!

[Thomas Dai]

Add an exceptional brain, not necessarily exceptional intellectually, but with exceptional 'nous', to exceptional hand-eye coordination and you get an exceptional player.
atb

[Ben Stephens]

Add an exceptional brain, not necessarily exceptional intellectually, but with exceptional 'nous', to exceptional hand-eye coordination and you get an exceptional player.
atb

Also known as Lady Heathcoat-Amory 

[Lou_Duran]

Interesting.  Made me wonder if she was related to H.N. who along with Tom Simpson wrote the highly regarded "The Architectural Side of Golf" (a book which has put me to sleep numerous times).  Below is what I found.  Nice family legacy.

H.N. Wethered
Bornin Clifton, Bristol, England, The United Kingdom
November 14, 1870


Herbert Newton Wethered (1870–1957) was a versatile English author, who wrote in a number of areas of non-fiction.

Wethered married in 1890 Marion Emmeline Lund, daughter of James Lund, and sister of Reginald William Lund, a college contemporary. They had a son and a daughter, who were the golfers Roger Wethered and Joyce Wethered.

[David_Tepper]

Lou D. -

Don't forget Joyce & Roger Wethered spent several summers in Dornoch in the 1920's & 30's.

DT

[Thomas Dai]

Isn't Knightshayes Court, the estate near Tiverton in Devon once owned by the Heathcoat-Amory family (now National Trust) and where Joyce H-A lived after her marriage, supposed to have had some holes laid out by Tom Simpson? Another Wethered-Simpson connection.
The now played over course at nearby Tiverton GC was apparently started by the H-A family. Braid (not Simpson) designed the course although it was constructed a few years before J H-A married into the family. I wonder if Simpson did any subsequent work at TGC?

atb

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

I read a book about her which was written by Basil Ashton Tinkler. It was called "Joyce Wethered: The Great Lady of Golf".


She was engaged to Major Cecil Key (C.K) Hutchinson, the well known golf course architect. They never got married; he was 24 years older than her.

[Adam Lawrence]

Isn't Knightshayes Court, the estate near Tiverton in Devon once owned by the Heathcoat-Amory family (now National Trust) and where Joyce H-A lived after her marriage, supposed to have had some holes laid out by Tom Simpson? Another Wethered-Simpson connection.
The now played over course at nearby Tiverton GC was apparently started by the H-A family. Braid (not Simpson) designed the course although it was constructed a few years before J H-A married into the family. I wonder if Simpson did any subsequent work at TGC?

atb

Not holes. A putting green. Simpson designed as a wedding present for Joyce.

[Jonathan Mallard]

Lou D. -

Don't forget Joyce & Roger Wethered spent several summers in Dornoch in the 1920's & 30's.

DT

David,


I seem to remember you posting a video a while ago that included the swings of Harry Vardon and Joyce Wethered among others. I tried the search function, but did not see it.


I remember thinking that she had a wonderful swing.

[Tommy Williamsen]

try this.  Looks like the modern swing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivo0n49U3aI

[JMEvensky]

try this.  Looks like the modern swing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivo0n49U3aI

Thanks for posting this and the article--great stuff.

[Stewart Abramson]

She won the Worplesdon Mixed Foursomes 8 times between 1922 and 1936 with a number of interesting partners.



Worplesdon Golf Club Clubhouse lobby

[Tommy Williamsen]

She won the Worplesdon Mixed Foursomes 8 times between 1922 and 1936 with a number of interesting partners.



Worplesdon Golf Club Clubhouse lobby

I assume that B. Darwin is Bernard? Interesting pairing.

[Marty Bonnar]

1932.
For a second there, I thought it was the Robert Oppenheimer. Wrong initials.
F.

[Adam Lawrence]

She won the Worplesdon Mixed Foursomes 8 times between 1922 and 1936 with a number of interesting partners.



Worplesdon Golf Club Clubhouse lobby

I assume that B. Darwin is Bernard? Interesting pairing.

It is, yeah. J. S. F. Morrison (1928) is John Morrison, Colt's partner (Morrison was a famous sportsman, a Cambridge blue in cricket and football as well as golf, and full-back for the famous Corinthians football team). Miss G. Cradock-Hartopp (1935) was Gwen, who married Morrison. Molly Gourlay (1929, 1930 and 1934) helped Tom Simpson on a number of his projects.

[Stewart Abramson]

I love visiting the club houses of the old clubs in GB&I. You can feel the history. Joyce Wethered's partner in 1923, Cyrill Tolley (Love that name) was no slouch. He was a 2X British Am champion and lost a third to Bobby Jones in a playoff at The Old Course in 1930.

[Richard Fisher]

Can I just make a tiny amendment? Bobby Jones actually beat Cyril Tolley's great Oxford contemporary Roger Wethered 7&6 in the final of the 1930 Amateur Championship at St Andrews: there is some Pathe news footage of the final (watched by an amazing gallery of 15 000) here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-E06dveh4Y


The Worplesdon Mixed honours board is one of the most distinguished in the UK. Until the 1960s this was one of the most important events in the entire British amateur calendar (and indeed gets a whole chapter of its own in Darwin's Golf Between Two Wars - the same level of coverage as e.g. The Ryder Cup), and at the foot of the image you can see Mr and Mrs Michael Bonallack winning in 1958, three years before Sir Michael's first win in our Amateur Championship.


Not the Manhattan Project Oppenheimer, no, but Raymond Oppenheimer, one of the people who (like Gerald Micklem) basically ran British golf in the middle of the last century. And Tolley himself not only won the Amateur twice but also twice won the French Open, when it was unquestionably the most important continental European championship with fields to match.


Agree 100% about honours boards in the older British clubs, with particular recommendations for RND Westward Ho! and RStD Harlech - at the latter the true anorak can find the names of five Open Champions and five Amateur Champions, if you know where to look...

[Marty Bonnar]

Lovely seeing Cecil Leitch there too. Nice tribute to her in the Silloth clubhouse.
F.

[Stewart Abramson]

I love visiting the club houses of the old clubs in GB&I. You can feel the history. Joyce Wethered's partner in 1923, Cyrill Tolley (Love that name) was no slouch. He was a 2X British Am champion and lost a third to Bobby Jones in a playoff at The Old Course in 1930.

Per Richard Fisher's post above, I mis-remembered and misspoke regarding the 1930 Am. As the Am was match play, Bobby Jones beat Cyrill Tolley in 1930 on the 19th hole. Their match was not the final round. As Richard pointed out, Jones handily beat Roger Wethered in the final.