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Mark Mammel

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Favorite quirky courses
« on: June 24, 2020, 12:59:53 AM »
What's a quirky course? Blind shots, odd doglegs, shots crossing other holes, undulations? You decide. I will toss out these courses I love as quirky but also fun- a key point. Quirky and not fun = do not list!  Here are a few of my favorites.

1. Durness Golf Club http://www.durnessgolfclub.org/
A wonderful 9 hole course, then most northern course on the mainland of the UK. maintained entirely by local members, the bay looks like the Caribbean except for the cows on the beach. The first hole is straight uphill; the best tee ball is in the short bunker left so it doesn't roll back down the hill. The course proceeds up and down, with a lake in the middle on the par 5 6thn hole and a dramatic fall towards the ocean for the 8th and 9th holes. Different tees for the 2nd 9 holes. The drive from Dornoch north is brilliant and the club outstanding.






2. Stonehaven Golf Club http://www.stonehavengolfclub.com/Home.aspx
On the headlands of the east coast of Scotland, while not true links turf, this place is a gas. Dramatic cliffs, views, Victorian clubhouse, it should be on your list if your are in the region.




3. Askernish Golf Club  https://www.askernishgolfclub.com/
On the isle of South Uist in the outer Hebrides, Askernish Golf Club was  originally a Tom Morris layout. It basically vanished, and was rediscovered (as much as possible) by a n umber of local and international golf lovers. It is a course that likely is as near as possible to a real 19th century layout. Minimal maintenance, cattle on the course, enough "scrapes of burrowing animals" to make all who play aware of why relief from same was one of the original rules of golf. Greens that are slow and sloped. Ocean and wind. Worth then trip and then some. The image showing "March of Death" reflects my addition to the 12th hole sign as the hole that took it's toll on all who attempted it.



4. Cruden Bay Golf Club https://www.crudenbaygolfclub.co.uk/Cruden Bay.
A course set in some of the most massive links in the UK, Cruden Bay is an experience never forgotten. Blind par 3s, unbelievable dunes, views that take your breath away, it is an old links by Tom Morris and unique. Shots you won't find anywhere else. And then there's Slains Castle, the inspiration for Bram Stoker's "Dracula".




5. White Bear Yacht Club https://www.wbyc.com/
OK, this is my club. But I list it here because it has wildly sloped greens, blind shots, rarely a level lie, and views of both a vineyard and a lake, neither in play.

I could go on, but I have finished my cognac and now it's off to bed.













So much golf to play, so little time....

Mark

Greg Gilson

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2020, 03:50:14 AM »
Mark, that's a fun list. WBYC...I need to get there! Looks great. Someday post-CV!

Garland Bayley

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"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2020, 09:33:33 AM »
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Anthony Fowler

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2020, 11:05:13 AM »
Great topic, Mark! I'm not going to name a course (just yet), but I do have a fun story on the topic of quirky courses and even the word quirky itself.

I was invited to play in a mid-am tournament at a course that I love. It's one of the most polarizing courses among GCAers. Virtually all of us would agree that it's quirky, some of us think it's among the very best in the world, and some of think it goes too far. I'm more in the former camp, but I understand where the other side is coming from.


I've just arrived on site for my practice round and the first of 3 days that I will be spending there. I'm on the putting green and I spot the owner. I run over to say hello, introduce myself, thank him for inviting me, tell him (honestly) how much I love his course, etc. We're chatting about a few different topics, and I start to tell him about my home course. I say something to the effect of "The greens are a little quirky, but nothing like these." I mean it as a compliment, but he's taken aback. "You think these greens are quirky?!" I won't give you the full dialogue and my memory wouldn't do it justice anyway, but he storms off angrily.

Thinking that there must be some kind of misunderstanding, I chase him down to try to clarify that I meant it as a compliment and that these greens in question are some of the most fun, interesting, unique in all of golf. But he's inconsolable. The word quirk has clearly struck a nerve, and there's no coming back!

Needless to say, this encounter soured the entire 3-day tournament for me, and it appeared to put the owner in an even worse mood. Making matters worse, I was the talk of the event! Everyone came up to me and asked some form of, "Are you the guy who pissed off the owner on the first day?" The other golfers made it their goal to use the word quirky as much as possible throughout their rounds.

To complete the story, it seems as if the superintendent or tournament committee caught wind of our conversation and made it their goal to highlight all the quirks of the course. It was as firm and fast as possible, and the pins were in the most extreme possible places. I saw one victim drive the green on a par 4 and then proceed to make a 6 without ever hitting a bad shot! Some of that was fun, but a bad setup can turn quirky-and-fun into quirky-and-ridiculous, and that's decidedly not the topic of this thread, so I'll stop there.

Jim Hoak

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2020, 11:18:42 AM »
Related to the last post, is "quirky" ever a complimentary term--or is it always pejorative?

David_Tepper

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2020, 11:31:04 AM »
Lincoln Park in San Francisco. Par-68, 5,000 yards, several 250-300 yard par-4's, back-to-back 230 yard par-3's, 5 or 6 bunkerless holes. Plus spectacular views of the Pacific Ocean, the Golden Gate Bridge, the Bay and the San Francisco skyline.   

Tom_Doak

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2020, 11:37:55 AM »
Related to the last post, is "quirky" ever a complimentary term--or is it always pejorative?


In the first version of The Confidential Guide, writing up The National Golf Links of America for the Gourmet's Choice, I described it as quirky, and it confused the hell out of them because they thought it was a dig.  I asked them how they could come to that conclusion when I had singled it out as one of my 31 favorite courses, but for years after that, Mike Muller addressed me as "Quirky" Doak.


I took it as a compliment.  I do not understand why many people consider it an insult of some kind.  There must be some older use of it that I am not familiar with. 


I looked up definitions online and they are all over the map!  The Cambridge English Dictionary has it as "unusual in an attractive and interesting way," which is how I've used it, but the very first search result I came up with had it as "shifty, quibbling, characterized by petty tricks".  I never realized the word meant such different things to different people.


How quirky.

Tom_Doak

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2020, 11:43:17 AM »
Lincoln Park in San Francisco. Par-68, 5,000 yards, several 250-300 yard par-4's, back-to-back 230 yard par-3's, 5 or 6 bunkerless holes. Plus spectacular views of the Pacific Ocean, the Golden Gate Bridge, the Bay and the San Francisco skyline.


Plus some crazy blind shots and a couple of ridiculously narrow holes!  That place is quirky by any and all of its definitions.

Jeff Loh

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2020, 11:44:23 AM »
Hubbard Heights
Stamford CT

Ira Fishman

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2020, 12:34:54 PM »
Speaking of definitions, does a course with several quirky holes but only several count as a quirky course? Lahinch? Elie? North Berwick? Brora and Golspie?


I love quirk.


Ira

SL_Solow

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2020, 01:34:27 PM »
Its been a long time but when I was in Cambridge for law school I used to drive to Brookline to play the muni next to The Country Club.  Putterham was not a great course but it was full of quirk.  Rock outcroppings, blind tee shots with periscopes and bells, lay up drives with 2nd shots to a green on top of a steep hill etc.  Real lay of the land architecture and a lot of fun particularly when one is getting away from law school.

cary lichtenstein

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2020, 01:54:51 PM »
Mission Hills in Orlando El Champion Course, very quirky, especially the 17th hole, but lots of slanted fairways, odd lies, fun fun fun
Live Jupiter, Fl, was  4 handicap, played top 100 US, top 75 World. Great memories, no longer play, 4 back surgeries. I don't miss a lot of things about golf, life is simpler with out it. I miss my 60 degree wedge shots, don't miss nasty weather, icing, back spasms. Last course I played was Augusta

Pete_Pittock

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2020, 02:24:05 PM »
I've played a bunch.  The Machrie, Painswick, Cruden Bay in the UK, but missed Cullen.  North Berwick and Prestwick. King Island's Ocean Dunes might be included, but RACV:Healesville is not quite there. Astoria, Tobacco Road, Black Mesa in the US. But my favorite is Sagebrush, which may be up and running next year.

archie_struthers

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2020, 04:50:25 PM »
 


Thought Portstewart had  wonderful quirk, and was really fun to play.


« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 09:59:53 PM by archie_struthers »

Niall C

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2020, 05:57:39 PM »
Can a links course be called quirky just because it has some blind holes ? I'd have thought not. In fact given the variety you get on links you could make an argument that they are either all quirky or none at all if you were using "unusual" as your barometer for quirk.


Niall

David Jones

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2020, 06:22:40 PM »
Speaking of definitions, does a course with several quirky holes but only several count as a quirky course? Lahinch? Elie? North Berwick? Brora and Golspie?


I love quirk.


Ira


Great question. How many quirks on a course are required for it to be quirky rather than a course with some quirks?! Of course there is always the risk that quirksome becomes irksome.


I think NGLA is probably closer to quirky than North Berwick (which has some quirks). Neither approach irksome.

Mark Mammel

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2020, 06:25:24 PM »
I think quirky is just a description- which is why I added the course must be fun and exciting to play. Courses with bunkers shaped like mouse ears or bear paws may be quirky but wouldn't be on my list. As Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart said of pornography, "I know it when I see it." That's how I feel about a quirky course. And I am waiting with bated breath for the name of Mr Fowler's course with the pissed off owner!
So much golf to play, so little time....

Mark

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2020, 06:47:23 PM »
Victoria Golf Club in British Columbia, Canada - an A.V. Macan design.

Mark Pearce

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2020, 07:05:04 PM »
Related to the last post, is "quirky" ever a complimentary term--or is it always pejorative?
Errr...  In my book it's almost always complimentary.
In July I will be riding two stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity, including Mont Ventoux for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

jeffwarne

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2020, 07:11:24 PM »
Quirky-in a good way
The original list is terriffic-can't wait to get back to Durness-I would plan a trip around it.Lots of variety packed into 9 holes.


I get quirky mixed up with fun, or even charming.
In other words my favorite courses
Perranporth comes to mind.
Aberfoyle
Dunaverty
Shiskine
Pennard
Northwest
Apawamis
Cruit
Covesea
Goat Hill
Myopia
Palatka
Eastward Ho
NGLA
St Georges
North Berwick
Shennecossett








"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Tim Leahy

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2020, 07:40:50 PM »
Lincoln Park in San Francisco. Par-68, 5,000 yards, several 250-300 yard par-4's, back-to-back 230 yard par-3's, 5 or 6 bunkerless holes. Plus spectacular views of the Pacific Ocean, the Golden Gate Bridge, the Bay and the San Francisco skyline.
+1
Also Lake Chabot in the Oakland, CA hills. Major elevation changes uphill and downhill. 100 ft drop shot par 3. Par 6 finish all downhill. Great views of the bay, both bridges on clear days. Always fun.
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

Ronald Montesano

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2020, 07:56:39 PM »
I don't know that I would call the E-Ho! quirky. I wonder if a part of quirk is abbreviated, overall terrain. I may be alone in this reading.


Astoria, for sure. That's a fun, quirky course.


Kebo Valley?


Hanover (NH) CC?


Delaware Park (Buffalo)
Coming in 2025
~Robert Moses Pitch 'n Putt
~~Sag Harbor
~~~Chenango Valley
~~~~Sleepy Hollow
~~~~~Montauk Downs
~~~~~~Sunken Meadow
~~~~~~~Some other, posh joints ;)

Greg Hohman

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2020, 08:59:12 PM »
Goat Hill Park, Oceanside CA
newmonumentsgc.com

Mark Mammel

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Re: Favorite quirky courses
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2020, 09:03:39 PM »
Forgot to add Spey Bay http://www.speybay.co/index.html
- crossing fairways, wild hills,fun. again, not links turf but seaside nonetheless...I'm the guy hitting from clearly the wrong place.


So much golf to play, so little time....

Mark