Walking with trolleys

[Mark_Fine]

I think it’s ridiculous that some clubs/courses still don’t welcome trolleys or pull carts when walking/carrying your own bag is allowed. They are widely welcomed in Europe and Asia and if you want to use one for example at The CC Brookline, which is one of the most exclusive golf courses in the world, you could take one as well.  What say you?

[mike_malone]

Covid golf is bringing basic golf values back.

[Mark Smolens]

I've posted about Erin Hills' ridiculous no push cart policy here before. Apparently early during the Covid-phase of the course being open they were allowing them, but I've been told that they're back to their policy banning them. . . thereby eliminating any chance of my returning.

[Mark_Fine]

It is an old golf elitist position that should be abolished.  Some people want to walk but carrying their bag is too much.  Who cares if you drag it or carry it on your shoulder    Stupid and arrogant in my opinion to not allow them IF you are allowing golfers to walk on their own at certain times.  It does not take away cart revenue or impact caddies (both those issues I understand). 

[JJShanley]

I'm using my late father's powakaddy and it's great (other than the fact that I'd prefer him to be using it, obviously.) I wouldn't have bought one at age 37, but I'm grateful for it.

[James Reader]

Call me naive (I haven’t played much golf in the US) but I didn’t realise that this is a thing!  I thought insisting on using carts was daft enough but this certainly is ridiculous.

[Tim Martin]

It’s easier to find a bag of cash on the side of the road than a trolley online. Everybody wants one!!!!

[John Kavanaugh]

Letting golfers who want to carry carry is another concession to the youth that clubs so desperately need.

[Mark_Fine]

Problem is some courses/clubs still don’t allow trolleys!  It is been a pet peeve of mine for a long time.  Maybe if there is enough people demanding otherwise this will change. 

[Ian Galbraith]

As someone who lives in Scotland this is beyond my understanding

[John Kavanaugh]

I’m a member of a club that found the perfect solution. Raise dues to cover cost and let everyone play however they choose for no additional fees. Caddie tips not included. You just show up and walk, ride, trolley or take a caddie. Very few people choose trolly in this scenario.

[John Kavanaugh]

As someone who lives in Scotland this is beyond my understanding

Scottish culture doesn’t lend itself to cheap shaming.

[Mark_Fine]

Brad Klein just sent me a great article:


http://magazine.golfcourseindustry.com/article/june-2020/rethinking-golf-carts.aspx

[Michael Whitaker]

To our UK friends who don’t understand the ban of trolleys at some US clubs...


Many clubs in the US have the opinion that trolleys are unsightly and project the image of public/municipal golf. This opinion goes back many many decades. As a result, a great many private clubs that want to be perceived as “elite” and defenders of the “propriety” of golf have banned trolley use. As golf cart (buggy) use became the norm, the ban on trolleys became even more entrenched as trolley use cut into cart revenue. Obviously, this is the opposite of the opinion and use of trolleys in the UK at even the most exclusive clubs.


It is sad, really, that golf became primarily a riding game in the US. There are so many health benefits to be gained at golf by walking.


And, it is extra sad that some have the opinion that the only reason a golfer carries their bag or uses a trolley is because they are cheap!!! It’s just another way to promote their elitism.

[Ian Galbraith]

As someone who lives in Scotland this is beyond my understanding

Scottish culture doesn’t lend itself to cheap shaming.

deliciously ambiguous 

[John Kavanaugh]

Walkers are different people than cart ballers. I’m sure the guy who walks to a meeting or takes the stairs is quicker to get to the task at hand. Walking is not faster, walkers are.

[Michael Whitaker]

Walkers are different people than cart ballers. I’m sure the guy who walks to a meeting or takes the stairs is quicker to get to the task at hand. Walking is not faster, walkers are.

The percentage of walkers vs riders in the UK is probably the opposite of what it is in the US. UK club golf is primarily a walking game, with very little cart use. There non-walkers are only different than walkers in their ability to walk.

[jeffwarne]

Walking is not faster, walkers are.

Truth

[John Kavanaugh]

Brad is saying that walking is as fast as riding. I’m saying people who choose to walk are quicker by nature. Follow someone around Walmart who chooses to take an electric scooter. Their decision making processes are slower than everyone else in the store.

[jeffwarne]

Brad is saying that walking is as fast as riding. I’m saying people who choose to walk are quicker by nature. Follow someone around Walmart who chooses to take an electric scooter. Their decision making processes are slower than everyone else in the store.

The problems begin when they don't start to compaison shop brands till their partner has already checked out..

[Tim Martin]

It is sad, really, that golf became primarily a riding game in the US. There are so many health benefits to be gained at golf by walking.

Mike-A lot of good points in your post. Although the game had already gone the way of carts in the U.S. the number of modern golf courses built with very long green to tee walks didn’t help. Those that came to the game playing these courses didn’t know there was any other way to play.

[David_Tepper]

Almost all the private clubs in the San Francisco area now permit walking with trolleys. That was not the case 10-20 years ago. Things can change for the better.

[Mark_Fine]

I won’t argue one way or the other what is faster but I will say a walker carrying their bag and a walker pulling or pushing their bag are equally as fast.  And the trolley likely allows that golfer to walk vs having to ride in a golf car. 

[Mark_Fine]

David,
Let’s hope it stays that way and they aren’t banned again!

[Lou_Duran]

Walkers are different people than cart ballers. I’m sure the guy who walks to a meeting or takes the stairs is quicker to get to the task at hand. Walking is not faster, walkers are.

A generalization with many, many exceptions.  But these anti-cart notions that riding is not faster than walking and that carts offer no net economic benefits to a club have been promulgated as facts quite regularly on this site.  They are demonstrably false. 


On the first, my group usually has the first time during the weekday mornings.  We have a number of riders with later tee times who we let go first because there is no way to keep up with them- we routinely play a 4-ball walking in between 3-3:10, and 3-balls under 3:00.  We have riding 4-balls who can play in 2:30 easily, except that they run into the maintenance crews and are forced to slow down.


Re: the economics of riding, we may think that we're smarter than the folks at Club Corp, but the company does not stay in business by losing money on such things.  I am unaware of a Club Corp property that does not have a very high riding to walking ratio.  My own analysis when I was looking at such things indicated that the cart fleet had the highest % contribution to cash flow.  Depending on volume, $300-$400k annually was not unusual.


Re: non-riding carts, my home club and others I am aware of do allow their use, but only if rented from the club at $8-$10 per round (we have been allowed to use our own temporarily due to C-19).  There seems to be more leniency toward these over the years, but other than munis, I don't think that very many privates allow the use of personal carts.


Any thoughts on the impact on the greens if these carts could be pushed/pulled through the greens?  There is an impact on the pace of play when they have to be rolled around large green complexes and creeks.