How many parts of the game should you learn?

[John Kavanaugh]

Hitting the ball in the air is a start. Hitting a low check check stop chip is towards the end. What are the shots in between that makes architecture more interesting?

[David Ober]

All of them -- within your own level of ability.


Everyone should be able to hit the ball high(er), low(er), with more spin, or less spin, spin it left to right and right to left, when called for.


Tall order, yes, but certain pins with certain winds call for certain shots. If you can't play the shot, then you can't play your best.


That's what makes this game actually FUN. Playing golf without learning to actually hit golf shots is like playing billiards or snooker and never learning how to hit the cue ball below the equator and draw it back at will or hit it high and make the cue ball run forward after hitting the object ball.


I'm convinced that if everyone tried to learn the game by first learning to curve the ball both ways (more or less) at will, that two things would happen: 1) Players would improve more rapidly; and 2) Enjoyment of the game would dramatically increase.

[JESII]

After you learn to get it in the air, you should learn to keep it on the ground.

[Peter Pallotta]

I think that after you learn to get it in the air but before you learn to keep it on the ground, it's useful to know how far you hit each club. It doesn't matter if you hit your 7 iron 140(ish) or 190, but it does matter that you know what the most likely distance is -- especially on a good golf course, with interesting greens.

[Pete_Pittock]

Looking at a slope and being able to envision the first bounce in order to select the best club for the best shot.

[David Ober]

Looking at a slope and being able to envision the first bounce in order to select the best club for the best shot.

Yes indeed. That's hugely important for scoring, even on "bland" courses -- but usually only when you miss the green. So much of short game is imagination and "vision" and then pulling off the shot you imagine.

[jeffwarne]

That your 8 iron doesn't go 170, and therefore 200 out is not 5 iron, especially if you're hitting your second shot on a 370 par 4
That your drives don't go 250
That my drives aren't going 300
That when taking a caddies not every wind is "hurting"
that your caddie, despite what he tells you, can't tell you "what it's playing," unless you hit it exactly on the trajectory and curve he's expecting
That uphill putts require more stroke than you're going to use
That downhill putts require less stroke than you're going to use
That your L wedge should only be used when no other club will do, or better yet-left in your garage, or traded for a 9 wood
To hold your finish on putts.
How to putt from off the green
Where the practice green and practice bunker is
How to hit a punch under a tree with a lofted club from the rough-not your 3 or 4 iron.
That a solid shot from the rough with a 7 or 8 iron goes significantly farther than the duff you're about to hit with a 4 iron(and not to confuse the fact that your delicious 8 iron you just hit 170 because of the flier/roll is not your 8 iron distance(see above)
How to hit a fairway wood from the rough
Where to buy a 5,7 wood and/or a 9 wood and where to dispose of your 3 hybrid
That if you're 150 to the water and laying up not to hit your 150 club "easy"
When you decide to lay up-LAY UP
To stop pacing off your putts
Not to use your laser inside a roughly a 3/4 wedge-use your eyes-that lazer won't figure temp,altitude, uphill, wind, lie, stance, ability, attitude, creativity, intuition
How to get it on the green from 15 yards with at least 9 different clubs
Why you don't walk to the ball from your cart, caddie or bag with just your SW and putter(see above)
How to hit 5 or more different clubs 50 yards
How to hit 5 or more clubs 100 yards
How to hit 5 or more different clubs to a target of unknown distance inside 3/4 wedge distance
How to get out of trouble in one shot
How to judge distance BEFORE you use your lazer to confirm-soon you will barely need it
How to hit a 1/2 shot
How to hit a 3/4 shot
How to practice full swings at 1/2 speed
How to make a perfect slow motion practice swing
Why a pro can do absolutely anything new or unusuall when  you ask him to it do at 1/2 speed OR with a half swing, despite it feeling "uncomfortable"
That staying "still" won't actually result in anything happening
That things with their "head down" get eaten in the wild




That should pretty much put me out of business without me ever once looking at your "swing"
Where 95% of new students want to work

[Jeff Schley]

That your 8 iron doesn't go 170, and therefore 200 out is not 5 iron, especially if you're hitting your second shot on a 370 par 4

That a solid shot from the rough with a 7 or 8 iron goes significantly farther than the duff you're about to hit with a 4 iron(and not to confuse the fact that ypur delicious 8 iron you just hit 170 becasue of the flier/roll is not yur 8 iron distance(see above)

Ouch, bruised ego! Can we get a second opinion?

[jeffwarne]

That your 8 iron doesn't go 170, and therefore 200 out is not 5 iron, especially if you're hitting your second shot on a 370 par 4

That a solid shot from the rough with a 7 or 8 iron goes significantly farther than the duff you're about to hit with a 4 iron(and not to confuse the fact that your delicious 8 iron you just hit 170 because of the flier/roll is not yur 8 iron distance(see above)

Ouch, bruised ego! Can we get a second opinion?

Absolutely,
that's why I have 7 other teachers!

[Ronald Montesano]

Some ambitious thoughts here...bravo!


I'll borrow some, add others...


1. How to putt from as many places as possible, and how to putt with your eyes closed;
2. How to swing at a consistent rhythm and arc, without over-swinging;
3. How to hit a shallow, greenside sand shot, and how to hit a ball-first longer sand shot;
4. How to move your hands around the grip, with any club;
5. How to take 9 o'clock, 10:30, and 11 o'clock swings;
6. How to hit a shot that lands short of an unguarded green, and how to hit a shot that lands deep into a guarded green.


If these sound like swing thoughts, rather than shots, that's good. If these sound like strategy, better. I've played for 40 years, and played as low as scratch. The shots that some call for herein, have always been beyond my ken. Good luck in your search. May you never stop searching.

[Mike Hendren]

All of them -- within your own level of ability.


Everyone should be able to hit the ball high(er), low(er), with more spin, or less spin, spin it left to right and right to left, when called for.


Tall order, yes, but certain pins with certain winds call for certain shots. If you can't play the shot, then you can't play your best.


That's what makes this game actually FUN. Playing golf without learning to actually hit golf shots is like playing billiards or snooker and never learning how to hit the cue ball below the equator and draw it back at will or hit it high and make the cue ball run forward after hitting the object ball.


I'm convinced that if everyone tried to learn the game by first learning to curve the ball both ways (more or less) at will, that two things would happen: 1) Players would improve more rapidly; and 2) Enjoyment of the game would dramatically increase.

Everyone?  I must disagree.  I realize you are a good player but I believe one can play to scratch with no ability to "work" the ball.   Repetitive execution - controlling distance and direction is more than enough, particularly if one can think strategically and make a few putts.   I was once a 4 and it never dawned on me that I needed to curve the ball.   I knew where to aim and where to miss.  I can't recall a single time in 50 years of playing the game where I've stood over a shot and thought "boy, I really wish I could curve the golf ball." 

The beauty of the game is that there are so many ways to get the ball in the hole.  Even the better players know how to avoid or play away from their weaknesses.  I've personally witnessed Trevino in tournament play take a fairway wood out over a leftside lake.   How many parts of the game should you learn?   As few or as many as necessary based upon your objectives. 

As for fun, I can't fathom anyone has had more than I have.    Also, the billiards analogy doesn't work any more as neither the stick of the ball is now manufactured in a way that inhibits the ability to curve the ball.

Mike

[David Ober]

All of them -- within your own level of ability.


Everyone should be able to hit the ball high(er), low(er), with more spin, or less spin, spin it left to right and right to left, when called for.


Tall order, yes, but certain pins with certain winds call for certain shots. If you can't play the shot, then you can't play your best.


That's what makes this game actually FUN. Playing golf without learning to actually hit golf shots is like playing billiards or snooker and never learning how to hit the cue ball below the equator and draw it back at will or hit it high and make the cue ball run forward after hitting the object ball.


I'm convinced that if everyone tried to learn the game by first learning to curve the ball both ways (more or less) at will, that two things would happen: 1) Players would improve more rapidly; and 2) Enjoyment of the game would dramatically increase.

Everyone?  I must disagree.  I realize you are a good player but I believe one can play to scratch with no ability to "work" the ball.   Repetitive execution - controlling distance and direction is more than enough, particularly if one can think strategically and make a few putts.   I was once a 4 and it never dawned on me that I needed to curve the ball.   I knew where to aim and where to miss.  I can't recall a single time in 50 years of playing the game where I've stood over a shot and thought "boy, I really wish I could curve the golf ball." 

The beauty of the game is that there are so many ways to get the ball in the hole.  Even the better players know how to avoid or play away from their weaknesses.  I've personally witnessed Trevino in tournament play take a fairway wood out over a leftside lake.   How many parts of the game should you learn?   As few or as many as necessary based upon your objectives. 

As for fun, I can't fathom anyone has had more than I have.    Also, the billiards analogy doesn't work any more as neither the stick of the ball is now manufactured in a way that inhibits the ability to curve the ball.

Mike

Not a single time in 50 years?


Regardless, my point stands: I believe most players would both be better and enjoy the game even more if they learned to curve the ball both ways. Clubface control is an amazing thing. For those of you who have never attempted it, you will never know...

[John Kavanaugh]

With all due respect Mike was left with little game after the athleticism of youth passed.

[Ben Hollerbach]

Everyone?  I must disagree.  I realize you are a good player but I believe one can play to scratch with no ability to "work" the ball.   Repetitive execution - controlling distance and direction is more than enough, particularly if one can think strategically and make a few putts.   I was once a 4 and it never dawned on me that I needed to curve the ball.   I knew where to aim and where to miss.  I can't recall a single time in 50 years of playing the game where I've stood over a shot and thought "boy, I really wish I could curve the golf ball." 

The beauty of the game is that there are so many ways to get the ball in the hole.  Even the better players know how to avoid or play away from their weaknesses.  I've personally witnessed Trevino in tournament play take a fairway wood out over a leftside lake.   How many parts of the game should you learn?   As few or as many as necessary based upon your objectives. 

As for fun, I can't fathom anyone has had more than I have.    Also, the billiards analogy doesn't work any more as neither the stick of the ball is now manufactured in a way that inhibits the ability to curve the ball.

Mike

Not a single time in 50 years?


Regardless, my point stands: I believe most players would both be better and enjoy the game even more if they learned to curve the ball both ways. Clubface control is an amazing thing. For those of you who have never attempted it, you will never know...

I think this is where the modern architecture movement gets off track.  They think the good players of today are responding to course architecture with different shot shapes and styles.  Most of them don't.  They hit the same shot every time, attack when it fits, and play conservative when it doesn't.



The biggest mistake most golfers make is trying to adjust their swing or desired ball flight because of playing conditions.  Change the aiming point, yes, but not the swing or shot shape. Unless you can break 80 repeatedly, the only thing you should be worrying about is repeating the same swing over and over again.  Even if you can break 80, you should only adjust your swing or shot shape on rare occasions.


Golf is about repeating the same swing, and then picking the proper aiming points for that swing.


In the immortal words of Bruce Lee "I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times."

[Tim Martin]

I think 100 yards and in including putting gets overlooked. You have a lot of players that cannot hit half shots or flight anything down including single digit handicappers. Imagination is important and anything but a stock full shot gives many players fits.

[David_Tepper]

Can't remember who said it, but "learn to hit your long irons high and your short irons low."

[Pat Burke]

Etiquette first
When learning. Keep up.  It’s ok to pick up to keep up


Learn to make basic contact with a tee shot mid and short iron


Learn to chip a bit. Putt 
Short game is boring but can teach clubface control  And start to teach scoring

[Lou_Duran]

Regardless, my point stands: I believe most players would both be better and enjoy the game even more if they learned to curve the ball both ways. Clubface control is an amazing thing. For those of you who have never attempted it, you will never know...

David,


You and I have one thing in common, we arrived at the game late but became decent players quickly.  You took it a lot further than I did, playing smart, control golf that could withstand high level competition.  Me, I always felt like the old pitcher in Major League who threw everything but the kitchen sink at the plate until he ran out of gas.  Tournament play was always very stressful.


Reasonably accurate driving with enough distance to get home in regulation on 16-17 holes and a decent chipping and pitching game keep me in the mid single digits.  When I putt better it goes down a bit, but typically the reversion to my mean is within a couple rounds.


The unfortunate thing is that when I find a good key for one part of the game, I typically lose something in another.  And often, I can't remember what I did the day before that allowed me to do better.  I suppose that rediscovering good techniques is part of the game's great charm.


As to working the ball both ways, hitting the ball both ways with control is aspirational for most of us.  A look at the face of my M6 driver proves the merits of large heads and twist-face technology.  Finding a way to hit my wedges and putter solidly is the most I can hope for.  Trying to flatten my irons out at the bottom and sweeping the ball is a long term project.  I was getting over 4000 rpms on my driver for a long time.  I am still putting on too much backspin and losing distance.     

[William_G]

all

[John Kavanaugh]

With a little time and effort we can all learn the shots. I remember exactly where I was 45 years ago when the best player in town taught me how to hit a hard low driver into the wind. If we hadn't been playing together that day I may still not know how.

[Mike Hendren]

With all due respect Mike was left with little game after the athleticism of youth passed.

John, thanks for cutting me some slack - we both know I have NO game. No game at all.


Mike

[jeffwarne]

With a little time and effort we can all learn the shots. I remember exactly where I was 45 years ago when the best player in town taught me how to hit a hard low driver into the wind. If we hadn't been playing together that day I may still not know how.

a shot that took a long time for me to learn, having grown up in a relatively wind free environment.
Learned it at Long Cove on Hilton Head.
Was particularly useful on the links for years...'Now I play with guys with  similar speed that use high launch/low spin drivers  and balls that look at me like I'm nuts when their shots go right through the wind miles past what I think is a perfectly executed low penetrating draw.


Heavy sigh

[John Kavanaugh]

With all due respect Mike was left with little game after the athleticism of youth passed.

John, thanks for cutting me some slack - we both know I have NO game. No game at all.


Mike

Mike, considering that we started playing around the same time I am surprised you didn't have an occasion to move the ball around trees. Before dutch elm disease killed just about everything in Illinois it was the only game in town.

[Mike_Trenham]

first thing you need to do is to, learn how to use your hands, then you need to learn how to not use them too much.

[David Ober]

first thing you need to do is to, learn how to use your hands, then you need to learn how to not use them too much.

YES. Exactly.