Houses on Golf Courses

[JWinick]

It struck me today that I can't consider any golf course surrounded by homes to be truly a great golf course.    Is that fair?   I have nothing against golf course communities (I think they are often awesome), but the quality of the golf experience suffers when you're surrounded by houses. 


I find this to be especially true when its the $400K (ok now $320K) homes that surround many of the golf courses in the Phoenix area.   The houses around Troon North are really cool, so it didn't bother me as much there.

[Ryan Coles]

St George’s Hill is quite enjoyable and the houses on the course probably add to rather than detract from the experience. I don’t know if it’s a truly great course but it’s good enough!

[JWinick]

I loved it - played it last year.   There were not many homes on the golf course and they did not detract from the experience.   I guess i'm referring to lines of homes on both sides of every hole.   

St George’s Hill is quite enjoyable and the houses on the course probably add to rather than detract from the experience. I don’t know if it’s a truly great course but it’s good enough!

[Pete_Pittock]

North Berwick (West) has an impressive array. Also LACC, but have never been there.

[Jeff Schley]

The Country Club at Brookline has houses that border, including Brady's old house.

Also Chicago Golf Club has backyards that border it's course, including CB MacDonald's old house.

[Thomas Dai]

Royal Troon has one in the centre of the course with holes played on both sides of it. Been there a long time though.
atb

[Adam Lawrence]

I loved it - played it last year.   There were not many homes on the golf course and they did not detract from the experience.   I guess i'm referring to lines of homes on both sides of every hole.   

St George’s Hill is quite enjoyable and the houses on the course probably add to rather than detract from the experience. I don’t know if it’s a truly great course but it’s good enough!

Nonetheless, SGH was a masterplanned golf and housing development from the start, the first one in fact. I guess what it shows is that houses in themselves are not necessarily a negative; it is how they are positioned in relation to the golf.


The traditional linear masterplan, with rows of houses down each fairway, is undeniably a negative for the golf course. And this is why it has, to an extent, fallen out of fashion. Golf architects have been making noise for years about how golf and housing developments can be done better -- and more sympathetically to the golf -- by abandoning the idea of 'golf frontage' and clustering houses in 'villages'. This makes the golf more core and at the same time makes the houses more social. It just requires people to get over the idea of living 'on a golf hole’

[Jeff Schley]

North Berwick (West) has an impressive array. Also LACC, but have never been there.

Riviera above and Bel Air surrounding as well.  Pretty pricey real estates.  Sherwood CC obviously as well.

[Mike_Young]

Pasatiempo comes to mind as one and the Merion.  But I can agree with you when it comes to developments where homes were on both sides of each hole on the course.  However, there are plenty of really good and even great courses where the course is a "core" and the perimeter has homes.

[Steve Lapper]

It struck me today that I can't consider any golf course surrounded by homes to be truly a great golf course.    Is that fair?   I have nothing against golf course communities (I think they are often awesome), but the quality of the golf experience suffers when you're surrounded by houses. 


I find this to be especially true when its the $400K (ok now $320K) homes that surround many of the golf courses in the Phoenix area.   The houses around Troon North are really cool, so it didn't bother me as much there.

Fairly silly statement IMO.


There are dozens, if not hundreds of good courses, quite a few greats, surrounded by houses. In addition to others previously mentioned (LACC-Riv-Bel-Air-Merion being probably the best examples), the likes of Winged Foot, Quaker Ridge, The Creek, Pebble Beach, Desert Forest, etc......

[John Kavanaugh]

Hello people. Winick is looking for a house on the cheap to go with his new membership. I spent an hour on Zillow last night combing the fairways of Merion looking for a good deal. Not much under $700,000.

[Tom_Doak]

I loved it - played it last year.   There were not many homes on the golf course and they did not detract from the experience.   I guess i'm referring to lines of homes on both sides of every hole.   

St George’s Hill is quite enjoyable and the houses on the course probably add to rather than detract from the experience. I don’t know if it’s a truly great course but it’s good enough!

Yes -- this is the key difference.  It's a matter of priorities. 

When a developer wants homes both sides of the fairways, golf is just not the first priority, and it's likely that the land planner and not the golf course architect will dictate the routing -- so, the holes will not be built around natural features, they will have to be created.  That's much different from places like Bel Air or St. George's Hill, where the golf course architect had a lot of say in the routing.


Funny, nobody mentioned Pebble Beach as a course with housing!

 

[J_ Crisham]

Hello people. Winick is looking for a house on the cheap to go with his new membership. I spent an hour on Zillow last night combing the fairways of Merion looking for a good deal. Not much under $700,000.

Why run with the bottom feeders when you can overlook Cypress Point or Monterey Peninsula? No shortage of homes on the market there these days

[John Kavanaugh]

I honestly thought I could find an affordable house on Ardmore Ave overlooking the course. The home prices around Merion surprised me. Now if you want an inexpensive clean house on a fine course look no further than Norwood Hills.


I had mentioned gentrification earlier today. What would be the best course where a guy and his good buds might pick up some distressed homes and spruce up the neighborhood?

[J_ Crisham]

I honestly thought I could find an affordable house on Ardmore Ave overlooking the course. The home prices around Merion surprised me. Now if you want an inexpensive clean house on a fine course look no further than Norwood Hills.


I had mentioned gentrification earlier today. What would be the best course where a guy and his good buds might pick up some distressed homes and spruce up the neighborhood?

Look no further than the Beverly area- but then you would need to live in Hellinois

[John Kavanaugh]

I pulled up Zillow and couldn't find any homes on Beverly with decent course access. Affordable, no doubt. When I was first married I did own a home up in Waukegan on Bonnie Brook GC. I loved that place, or maybe I was just in love.


On a side note: One night during a round of drunken frivolity my wife and I did pull up Zillow and toured all the homes that we once owned. It is amazing technology. I had a bit of trouble selling my house in Waukegan. We hit a snag when the real estate agent pulled into our driveway and his rear window was shot out. Completely random of course.

[Mike Hendren]

Holston Hills, if you don't mind doing your grocery shopping at Food Lion.

[John Kavanaugh]

Holston Hills, if you don't mind doing your grocery shopping at Food Lion.

I did find some nice fixer uppers for around $100/sqft. This thread should be moved to the Refuge.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

What's the difference between a " great" course and a " truly great" course ?
 
Is there a difference between a residential golf development where custom houses are built and one where production houses are built? 


In any event, here is   Golfweek's list  of the top residential courses:


https://golfweek.usatoday.com/2020/01/16/golfweeks-best-2020-top-200-residential-golf-courses/

[Mark Pearce]

St George’s Hill is quite enjoyable and the houses on the course probably add to rather than detract from the experience. I don’t know if it’s a truly great course but it’s good enough!

It gets my vote as a great course and I agree the houses add rather than detract from the experience.

[Ian Andrew]

Capilano is a great example of housing and golf integrated together. All of this was initially overseen by the Olmstead Brothers. The lots are large and the original architectural sketches are breathtaking. Most of the early development is really beautiful.


There are lots more examples - more than you might think - because when the housing is set far enough back or the architecture is well handled it blends and we don't notice it.


At St. George's - in Toronto - the front nine shows the benefits of planned community with architectural standards. The back nine shows where the development that came much later has a completely different impact. The limited set back, smaller lots and no architectural control makes the houses impose themselves rather then blend in.

[Kalen Braley]

JW,

Given all the fine examples given, i think its safe to say your assertion is busted. 

P.S. Even ANGC and CPC have housing/cabins on several holes...

[David_Tepper]

Royal Liverpool is surrounded by houses.

[Tommy Williamsen]

The first time I played Muirfield Village I was surprised to see all the houses on the perimeter of the course. I expected it to stand alone. The house are very nice but I have to say, they did detract from my initial experience.  I notice them less with each subsequent visit. I think we would all prefer not to see houses but that cannot be the case. What I do mind are houses on both sides of the holes like so many courses in Florida have. But yes there are great courses that have housing.

[JWinick]

Kalen,


There’s a big difference between a few homes on a golf course around the perimeter and homes surrounding every single hole.   There’s also the proximity. Does it feel cramped like you’re playing in someone’s backyard?