Joe Jemsek

[Ira Fishman]

How is Mr. Jemsek not in the World Golf Hall of Fame? If Mr. Keiser belongs, Mr. Jemsek needs to go in first. Other than Chick Evans (yet another Chicagoan), it is difficult to think of anyone else who did more to promote public golf. Plus Mr. Jemsek assiduously supported women golfers and women teaching professionals.


Ira

[Mark Smolens]

+1. And they should do it before the point where Frank couldn't be there to accept the honor for his Dad!

[John Kavanaugh]

It started here: https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,17809.msg315614.html#msg315614


and then his heirs hired a less favored architect that made things worse...


and then Golfweek showed up with their raters and the greens were aerated...


I love the man because the last thing he cared about was pleasing the type of people who vote for the Hall of Fame.

[Tom_Doak]

The Hall of Fame is mostly for competitive golfers.  Yes, there is a category for others who have made an outstanding contribution, but it is limited to just a couple of nominees per year, and there is a very long list of deserving people who are not in. 


(Next year the nominees in that category are Marion Hollins and . . . Tim Finchem, to give you some idea where their priorities lie.)


This year's nominating committee included Colin Montgomerie, Juli Inkster, and Mark O'Meara, in addition to the usual heads of big golf organizations.  How many of them know much about Joe Jemsek, or Mike Keiser, or Harry Colt?  It's Tour centric, and there are a lot of people who won't make the cut from that perspective.

[John Kavanaugh]

Do you think Keiser could make the HOF if within 10 years of his passing all his courses had fallen out of the top 100?

[Ira Fishman]

The Hall of Fame is mostly for competitive golfers.  Yes, there is a category for others who have made an outstanding contribution, but it is limited to just a couple of nominees per year, and there is a very long list of deserving people who are not in. 


(Next year the nominees in that category are Marion Hollins and . . . Tim Finchem, to give you some idea where their priorities lie.)


This year's nominating committee included Colin Montgomerie, Juli Inkster, and Mark O'Meara, in addition to the usual heads of big golf organizations.  How many of them know much about Joe Jemsek, or Mike Keiser, or Harry Colt?  It's Tour centric, and there are a lot of people who won't make the cut from that perspective.

Mr. Jemsek and Ms. Hollins would be a terrific induction class.


Ira

[Tom_Doak]

Do you think Keiser could make the HOF if within 10 years of his passing all his courses had fallen out of the top 100?

Luckily, their reputations are not all based on being tough but fair.  Live by the sword, die by the sword!


But, also, no, you are right.  Without its top 100 status - and maybe more importantly to this nominating committee, without a Tour event being held there anymore - Cog Hill is just another big CCFAD.  Heck, the Tufts family aren't in the Hall, either.

[Tom_Doak]

Mr. Jemsek and Ms. Hollins would be a terrific induction class.

Sadly, Miss Hollins probably wouldn't be there, except that they want fairly equal representation between men and women.


In the end, a Hall of Fame is about getting votes from a committee, so they are all extremely political.  The Hollins supporters have been lobbying for several years.  If you want to see Joe Jemsek elected, you'll have to do the same.

[SL_Solow]

Barney, no need to denigrate either of these men as a means of elevating the other.  I have been fortunate enough to know both of them,although I confess that I have come to know Joe's family better than I knew Joe.  Both have been great for golf.  Joe was more in the tradition of the classical owner of public fees golf courses but he elevated the business by doing his best to improve the product and providing maximum service.  Mike came to golf operations and ownership as a second career and really was and I believe, still is, principally interested in building interesting golf courses.  As such, with regard to the topic of principal interest to this site, Mike has been far more important to the development and support of Golf Course Architecture.  That in no way demeans Joe's contributions to the game as a whole and public golf in particular.  I remember a young nobody being given a ride around Pine Meadow on opening day by an elderly gentleman who just happened to be the owner but who was excited to show off his latest course while that young fellow was waiting for a chance to play.  I had yet to become involved in golf administration but Joe decided it would be a good thing to show someone who expressed interest what Joe Lee and company had done with the remnants of the old seminary course.  That ride was typical of Joe, a wonderful man whose family has carried on in much the same spirit.  I fear Tom Doak's observations about the Hall of Fame are accurate.  Joe is a member of the Illinois Golf Hall of Fame, a well deserved honor.

[Ronald Montesano]

Isn't the difference, that Keiser's kourses won't fall out of favor? What they represent, is what was lost to golf in the 1940s and 1950s. Mr. Jemsek might deserve consideration for the events he hosted, and the support of all touring professionals, but his courses did not give the game a rebirth that it desperately needed.

[SL_Solow]

Ron,  I think that is an unfair comparative standard.  As I stated, Joe's principal interest was not architecture.  He was at first a golf pro and then an operator of golf courses.  In that role he elevated the presentation of his product in terms of conditioning and service. In doing so he set a standard for the industry. Mike is far more interested in the architecture and his market is far different although he certainly has done an extraordinary job in terms of presentation and service with the help of the Kemper Sports organization.  The question presented did not reference a Golf Architecture Hall of Fame.

[Ira Fishman]

Do you think Keiser could make the HOF if within 10 years of his passing all his courses had fallen out of the top 100?

Luckily, their reputations are not all based on being tough but fair.  Live by the sword, die by the sword!


But, also, no, you are right.  Without its top 100 status - and maybe more importantly to this nominating committee, without a Tour event being held there anymore - Cog Hill is just another big CCFAD.  Heck, the Tufts family aren't in the Hall, either.

Actually, Richard Tufts is a Member. All the more evidence that Ms. Hollins and Mr. Jemsek should not be viewed as outliers in terms of basis for induction.


Ira

[Ronald Montesano]

Did Mr. Jemsek do for conditioning and service, what Mr. Keiser has done for architecture, conditioning, and service? Mr. Keiser has reminded us that golf courses do not need to be soft, lush, and pretty chartreuse, to be functional. We save a lot of money this way. I grew into golf in the 1970s, when the Cog Hill machine was in its first stages of fading.


I'll happily admit my felonious argument, if someone can define for me how Mr. Jemsek's contributions are hall-of-fame worthy. I'm a very good teacher and coach, but have never received a yearbook dedication, nor an award, despite 23 years at my institution. I might not be deserving of any of them, just as some folks aren't ever going to make a hall of fame. This seems to me the case for Mr. Jemsek.

[Mike_Young]

It started here: https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,17809.msg315614.html#msg315614


and then his heirs hired a less favored architect that made things worse...


and then Golfweek showed up with their raters and the greens were aerated...


I love the man because the last thing he cared about was pleasing the type of people who vote for the Hall of Fame.

He was the best.  When I decided to buy a public course I went to see Frank and Nick(manager who they trained from day one) and they spent the day showing me the set up...Joe used to come to GCSAA shows and would always go to church on Sunday of that week at a local church and leave an offering...Frank would pick him up and off he would go.  The family should write a book of his tales..

[Jeff Schley]

It started here: https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,17809.msg315614.html#msg315614


and then his heirs hired a less favored architect that made things worse...


and then Golfweek showed up with their raters and the greens were aerated...


I love the man because the last thing he cared about was pleasing the type of people who vote for the Hall of Fame.

He was the best.  When I decided to buy a public course I went to see Frank and Nick(manager who they trained from day one) and they spent the day showing me the set up...Joe used to come to GCSAA shows and would always go to church on Sunday of that week at a local church and leave an offering...Frank would pick him up and off he would go.  The family should write a book of his tales..

Nick Mokelke is a class act, I went to HS with his kids and they were both fine citizens as well, and played for the HS team.
I know we are all architecture nerds, but the HOF and JJ's contributions extend beyond architecture.  He was a champion for improving public golf facilities and access to them for all in the Chicago land area. He did a lot for Cog Hill, Chicago public golf, Western Golf Association, Illinois PGA, and public golf in general. Everyone concentrates on #4, but there are 3 other courses out there all targeting a different demographic IMO. Not to mention Pine Meadow. We think of Dubsdread as a failure unfairly IMO after the Rees Jones wrecking ball of a renovation. Cog Hill hosted a July 4th event that was wonderful for the Chicago area, WGA, and something the entire city would look forward to. In an area where there weren't many nice high end public courses, JJ tried to bring that experience to the every man.

Why the hate?  Celebrate as there is much there.

[Jeff Schley]

Did Mr. Jemsek do for conditioning and service, what Mr. Keiser has done for architecture, conditioning, and service? Mr. Keiser has reminded us that golf courses do not need to be soft, lush, and pretty chartreuse, to be functional. We save a lot of money this way. I grew into golf in the 1970s, when the Cog Hill machine was in its first stages of fading.


I'll happily admit my felonious argument, if someone can define for me how Mr. Jemsek's contributions are hall-of-fame worthy. I'm a very good teacher and coach, but have never received a yearbook dedication, nor an award, despite 23 years at my institution. I might not be deserving of any of them, just as some folks aren't ever going to make a hall of fame. This seems to me the case for Mr. Jemsek.

So your teaching/coaching chops in relation to your peers is a good analogy for JJ and his qualifications to the HOF?   

I was going to just pass by this comment, but I do roll my eyes when I hear people use words, "appears" or "seems" which are passsive aggressive qualifiers in front of a less than confident opinion. I'm sure you are a good teacher, I'm a former one myself, however you are one of thousands in your state, JJ was one of a kind in golf.

[SB]

Joe shouldn't get in because he had a Top 10 or top whatever golf course, and he shouldn't be out because his course did or did not fall out. 

He should get in because he promoted golf to the public when nobody else did.  He built good/great courses for the public when nobody else did.  He hosted major competitions on public courses when nobody else did.  He got public golfers handicaps when nobody else did.  And, what nobody seems to have mentioned, he basically invented televised golf. 

[John Kavanaugh]

I'm not hating on Joe Jemsek. I'm hating on the raters and writers who decided to destroy his courses. I remember it all very clearly.

[Ken Fry]

If you look up the career of Joe Jemsek, you'll see the word "first" used often.  First public course to host a U.S. Open Qualifier.  First to offer handicaps to public players.  First to cater golf to the masses.  Helped to launch the Illinois PGA.  He was one of the pioneers of early American golf, promoting the game and promoting accessibility.

His desire for one of golf's major events is well documented and in no way should impact the importance of what he accomplished in promoting golf throughout his career.

Ken

[Mike_Young]

HE DESERVED A MAJOR...

[Ken Fry]

HE DESERVED A MAJOR...

Mike,

I only bring that point up as many use that against him because of the documented criticism of the Dubsdread changes.

Ken

[Mike_Young]

I understand....thx...

[Ian Mackenzie]

Just FWIW...There is no place called "Cog Hill" per se. The town is Lemont, IL.


Joe Jemsek bought the facility from the Coghill family of Orland Park, IL.
The family still operates Spring Lake Golf Club - a 36 hole public track in the same area.

[Jeff_Brauer]

As a Chicago kid, I remember his legacy of good public courses well (as opposed to the muni and privately owned goat tracks that were typical) and how thrilled I was to meet him after I got in the biz.  (And, how nice a person he seemed to be) So, I can see the case.  Improved golf for millions around Chicago or for tens of thousands who can afford far flung golf trips? 


Those from other areas of the country might disagree, or better yet, have their own qualified candidates, but I (if anyone empowered me to do so) would vote for JJ.

[Tim_Cronin]

Just FWIW...There is no place called "Cog Hill" per se. The town is Lemont, IL.


Joe Jemsek bought the facility from the Coghill family of Orland Park, IL.
The family still operates Spring Lake Golf Club - a 36 hole public track in the same area.

Actually, Cog Hill was in unincorporated Cook County next to Lemont, and recently, along with nearby Gleneagles, arranged to be annexed by Palos Park.


The Coghills own Silver Lake Country Club in Orland Park, which has 45 holes.


Carry on.


And yes, Joe should be in the World Golf Hall of Fame. He was the only public course operator named one of the 100 Heroes of American Golf in 1988. He's the only PGA professional who served on the USGA Executive Committee. He helped create "All-Star Golf," the first filmed TV golf show. He was one of eight charter members of the Illinois Golf Hall of Fame, along with CBM and Chick Evans, among others.


Golf would be the lesser without him. The Hall is the lesser without him.