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C. Sturges

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Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #325 on: March 28, 2020, 12:14:41 PM »
Update in Ohio:


As of yesterday, the Department of Health for Ohio has changed there mind and golf is not an essential business and all courses should be closed.   


Would not be surprised some courses try to stay open and who knows how long until they change there minds again.


Stay healthy,
chris

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #326 on: March 28, 2020, 12:37:13 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas. 

Mark Pearce

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Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #327 on: March 28, 2020, 12:42:01 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.
I don't think that's a fair characterisation of what's going on here.  Quite reasonably, remote areas with less health care provision than cities are asking second home owners not to come from those cities, risking transmission and putting the local health care system under pressure it can't cope with.  Those areas with lots of second homes are areas that make most from tourism.  When this is over they will welcome those second home owners and tourists with open arms.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #328 on: March 28, 2020, 12:44:01 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.


Reports of police pulling over NY plates in Rhode Island.
Is this Russia?
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-27/rhode-island-police-to-hunt-down-new-yorkers-seeking-refuge?fbclid=IwAR20zQDRyKHrEomqEEh7-dm9cJJh-DQVz9757dJ9qnSFLmJKNiQSnTCIjUQ
If i owned a second home in Rhode Island I would never spend another nickel in the state.


I'm cool with the 14 day quarantine-isn't that what we're all supposed to be doing anyway?
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 12:48:19 PM by jeffwarne »
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Peter Flory

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #329 on: March 28, 2020, 12:47:02 PM »
There were police cruisers posted at the entrances the municipal courses here in Erie yesterday. Private clubs continue to "look the other way" as members use the land to walk, often while hitting a ball every so often.


This brings back the concept of the Sunday stick. 

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #330 on: March 28, 2020, 12:48:54 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.


Reports of police pulling over NY plates in Rhode Island.
Is this Russia?
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-27/rhode-island-police-to-hunt-down-new-yorkers-seeking-refuge?fbclid=IwAR20zQDRyKHrEomqEEh7-dm9cJJh-DQVz9757dJ9qnSFLmJKNiQSnTCIjUQ
If i owned a second home in Rhode Island I would never spend another nickel in the state.


I'm cool with the 14 day quarantine-isn't that what we're all supposed to be doing anyway?


Yikes!!
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Buck Wolter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #331 on: March 28, 2020, 01:01:55 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.


Reports of police pulling over NY plates in Rhode Island.
Is this Russia?
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-27/rhode-island-police-to-hunt-down-new-yorkers-seeking-refuge?fbclid=IwAR20zQDRyKHrEomqEEh7-dm9cJJh-DQVz9757dJ9qnSFLmJKNiQSnTCIjUQ
If i owned a second home in Rhode Island I would never spend another nickel in the state.


I'm cool with the 14 day quarantine-isn't that what we're all supposed to be doing anyway?



I wonder if they'll give the second home owners a rebate on their property taxes -- most of those places wouldn't have shiny new hospitals and fire departments without milking the out-of-staters in the good times.
Those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience -- CS Lewis

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #332 on: March 28, 2020, 01:06:11 PM »
There were police cruisers posted at the entrances the municipal courses here in Erie yesterday. Private clubs continue to "look the other way" as members use the land to walk, often while hitting a ball every so often.

I was at my home course yesterday (no clubs), and it's private property, and saw no fewer than 14 people walking the paths. Hundreds more were at Presque Isle State Park.

John, you can file it under "other people are doing it so why can't I" if you want, but the inconsistency of allowing hundreds or thousands of people to walk around a state park on a path five or six feet wide while putting police officers at the entrance to muni courses (where people may just want to walk - one of the courses here has a full path for all 18 holes) makes no sense to some people.

People are out with their dogs. They're outside playing frisbee, or tennis, or soccer. Basketball, though of course that's mostly teens and college-aged students… what about members playing golf on their course - no flags or even holes in the greens, no clubhouse to go into, etc. - is so different?

If the rule was "do not go outside unless it's to get food or medical attention or to travel to your deemed necessary job" then that would be one thing, but that's not the rule.


Worth reading. It's not uncommon for the last post on a page to get missed.


I have gotten comfortable going out in public with my shirt untucked and have even gone inside to pick up prescriptions without removing my cap. It wouldn't surprise me if in a week I go to the local range that is open and hit a few balls. Tyranny greases the slippery slope.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 01:10:29 PM by John Kavanaugh »

Peter Pallotta

Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #333 on: March 28, 2020, 01:08:24 PM »
As always, Mel Brooks has a useful perspective. From the Two Thousand Year Old Man skits (with Carl Reiner):

Carl: What was your first real home?
Mel: Cave 17! It was the best. We had everything in there.
Carl: Back then, 2000 years ago, did you have a national anthem?
Mel: Sure, of course we did -- every cave had its own national anthem.
Carl: Do you remember yours?
Mel: I certainly do. You don’t forget a national anthem. It went: "Everybody can go to hell, except Cave 17. Everybody stinks and smells, except Cave 17".
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 02:00:15 PM by Peter Pallotta »

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #334 on: March 28, 2020, 01:22:03 PM »
I disagree Mark.  I am a city dweller and not a second home owner.  If I choose to flee the city, and I find no refuge at the beach or in the mountains, that is one thing.  But if I flee and am forbidden to shelter in my own property, that seems another thing altogether.  Then I am (or was) a neighbor, not a tourist. If I were a resident of NYC and owned a second home in a "community" that locked me out, the open arms -- and pockets -- long after my time of need wouldn't move me an awful lot.  If I can choose, I like to be where I'm welcomed, not where I'm tolerated, and even then conditionally. 


[modified] If national health authorities are advising second home owners to stay away, that advice should be followed.  But if local authorities are turning away property owners, I think that will have repercussions after the pandemic, whether one thinks it should or not.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 02:15:03 PM by Bernie Bell »

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #335 on: March 28, 2020, 02:48:34 PM »
It strikes me, Bernie, that this is one of the biggest problems we have.  People have grown used to feeling entitled.  So someone wealthy enough to own a second home in, say, Cornwall, thinks they are entitled to move down there from London to sit out the pandemic in rural tranquillity.  The fact that that risks transmission of the disease in an area that can't cope doesn't, for them, over-ride their entitlement to do as they please.  What we are entitled to trumps what we should do.  Welcome to the modern world.  If this pandemic changes that, even a little, it will be one good thing to come out of it.  If it persuades us all to travel less for work, because working from home proves we don't need to, that will be another good thing.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Jon Wiggett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #336 on: March 28, 2020, 03:00:12 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.
I don't think that's a fair characterisation of what's going on here.  Quite reasonably, remote areas with less health care provision than cities are asking second home owners not to come from those cities, risking transmission and putting the local health care system under pressure it can't cope with.  Those areas with lots of second homes are areas that make most from tourism.  When this is over they will welcome those second home owners and tourists with open arms.



Mark,


it is not just medical resources that are a problem for remote communities it is also food, drink and other essentials. There have been some villages on the west coast in the Highlands that have had the only village shop picked clean by tourists.


Jeff,


I think for more remote communities they struggle to keep the fixed population resourced at the moment. Whilst I am sure you would be sensible and considerate bringing supplies with you were you to visit your second home there are unfortunately too many who would/do not. I had a discussion with a couple who were fleeing Edinburgh in their camper van and were complaining that our village shop was closed on a Sunday. 'What are we suppose to do?' they complained. 'Why not go back home' I suggested. They were not impressed.


Jon

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #337 on: March 28, 2020, 03:07:55 PM »
There were police cruisers posted at the entrances the municipal courses here in Erie yesterday. Private clubs continue to "look the other way" as members use the land to walk, often while hitting a ball every so often.

I was at my home course yesterday (no clubs), and it's private property, and saw no fewer than 14 people walking the paths. Hundreds more were at Presque Isle State Park.

John, you can file it under "other people are doing it so why can't I" if you want, but the inconsistency of allowing hundreds or thousands of people to walk around a state park on a path five or six feet wide while putting police officers at the entrance to muni courses (where people may just want to walk - one of the courses here has a full path for all 18 holes) makes no sense to some people.

People are out with their dogs. They're outside playing frisbee, or tennis, or soccer. Basketball, though of course that's mostly teens and college-aged students… what about members playing golf on their course - no flags or even holes in the greens, no clubhouse to go into, etc. - is so different?

If the rule was "do not go outside unless it's to get food or medical attention or to travel to your deemed necessary job" then that would be one thing, but that's not the rule.


Worth reading. It's not uncommon for the last post on a page to get missed.


I have gotten comfortable going out in public with my shirt untucked and have even gone inside to pick up prescriptions without removing my cap. It wouldn't surprise me if in a week I go to the local range that is open and hit a few balls. Tyranny greases the slippery slope.


Kav-CVS delivers the prescriptions free of charge in two days if it’s local. I would rather be dangled over a pit of asps than enter another pharmacy.

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #338 on: March 28, 2020, 03:14:39 PM »
It's an interesting issue.  I would say the wealthy Londoner not only feels entitled, he is literally entitled, because he holds title to his property.  If government exercises police power, that could override.  If the health system in Cornwall can't handle the possibility, while that of London can, I take your point.  I suppose at this point that's just a guess on both ends.  In Florida the governor is not closing the border, but is asking those who come from NY to self-quarantine for 14 days in their second home.  That seems sensible to me, but there may not be the same disparity in health systems that you are suggesting in Cornwall.  I can see your point of view, and that of the "locals" who don't want the city folk, but it does seem to me likely to have lingering effects regardless.  On the other side, I think people will travel less for work and maybe also for golf. 

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #339 on: March 28, 2020, 03:17:47 PM »
I feel more in control of my points of contact by getting the pills from directly behind the counter. Plus I might pick up some ice cream while in the store.


It will take a small miracle for my Illinois plates not to be vilified in Florida in the upcoming weeks.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #340 on: March 28, 2020, 03:24:38 PM »
I feel more in control of my points of contact by getting the pills from directly behind the counter. Plus I might pick up some ice cream while in the store.


It will take a small miracle for my Illinois plates not to be vilified in Florida in the upcoming weeks.


My son has his car with NY plates parked at my father in laws house in Georgia where he left it when leaving college-hopefully the locals don't burn down the house. Good thing he backed it in
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #341 on: March 28, 2020, 03:30:09 PM »
Reports showing a lot of rural communities in US and UK are pulling up the drawbridges to keep everyone, especially second-home property owners, on the other side of the moat.  Seems like this might have long term effects on golf in those areas.
I don't think that's a fair characterisation of what's going on here.  Quite reasonably, remote areas with less health care provision than cities are asking second home owners not to come from those cities, risking transmission and putting the local health care system under pressure it can't cope with.  Those areas with lots of second homes are areas that make most from tourism.  When this is over they will welcome those second home owners and tourists with open arms.



Mark,


it is not just medical resources that are a problem for remote communities it is also food, drink and other essentials. There have been some villages on the west coast in the Highlands that have had the only village shop picked clean by tourists.


Jeff,


I think for more remote communities they struggle to keep the fixed population resourced at the moment. Whilst I am sure you would be sensible and considerate bringing supplies with you were you to visit your second home there are unfortunately too many who would/do not. I had a discussion with a couple who were fleeing Edinburgh in their camper van and were complaining that our village shop was closed on a Sunday. 'What are we suppose to do?' they complained. 'Why not go back home' I suggested. They were not impressed.


Jon


Jon, we know
https://nypost.com/2020/03/18/chic-hamptons-food-stores-ransacked-by-the-wealthy-amid-coronavirus-pandemic/
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #342 on: March 28, 2020, 03:31:25 PM »
I'd take the plates off in case things turn for the worse. On a happier note I was just cold called and offered a free cruise. Happier in that those people on the other line are still getting paid.

Erik J. Barzeski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #343 on: March 28, 2020, 04:07:17 PM »
This brings back the concept of the Sunday stick.
Exactly. I'll often take only a 7-iron out when I'm playing even in the summer with my daughter. I'm mostly coaching her, but will hit different shots from around the course when I have the chance.

Worth reading. It's not uncommon for the last post on a page to get missed.
Thanks, John, for bumping the post.
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, Garland, and Chris.

Lou_Duran

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #344 on: March 28, 2020, 04:19:07 PM »
JK,


I discovered over the past two weeks that Blue Bell has a new flavor, Red Velvet Cake.  I am on my third gallon (ok, my wife has had a scoop or two) while adding three pounds.


Jon W,


Your story about the Edinburgh couple reminds me of a frequent lament/whine/complaint I heard in the Costa del Sol (around Marbella) during the '90s.  It seems that in August of most years, a considerable number of French tourists hauling small trailers with under-powered vehicles descended on the public spaces near the beach.  These would be packed to the gills with supplies, and with the exception of spending a little on gas and a few cheap staples, they left nothing in Spain other than their garbage.


It is somewhat amusing how we think about "entitlements".  From my perspective, if I own something which "entitles" me to some use (there is relevance here to Coul Links, but it is not my major point), perhaps my responsible enjoyment of what is rightfully mine should not be denigrated.  If I am to understand how the good folks in Cornwall would be fearful of a Londoner occupying his own property there and diminishing local supplies, is it reasonable for me to have a burr up my arse about Asians who live in my development but travel frequently to various parts of China and compete with me for scarce supplies?  Don't think so.

Peter Flory

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #345 on: March 28, 2020, 05:32:07 PM »
How does driving to your 2nd home and sheltering there risk spreading the infection?

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #346 on: March 28, 2020, 05:46:49 PM »
How does driving to your 2nd home and sheltering there risk spreading the infection?
Because even sheltering and doing the minimum you are going out to shop, or buying fuel.  Those things don't just not count.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #347 on: March 28, 2020, 05:47:50 PM »
Concerning Rhode Island's statement that they have only 200 cases vs. New York's 50000.

Suppose we want to find out how many women live in our state (population, say, 50 million people). We develop a test to check someone's gender and then crunch the numbers.

Week 1: 10 tests, 5 women.
Week 2: 20 tests, 11 women.
Week 3: 40 tests, 23 women.
Week 4: 100 tests, 55 women.

So, the conclusion is that in our state the number of women increases exponentially. It seems to more than double every week!

Of course, the truth is that there are actually about 25 million women living in our state and their number doesn't increase very much at all. It's just that we previously weren't able to find them and now the exponentially increasing test rate allows us to discover more and more of them every week. But we're still so far from the true number that the entire exercise is moot.

I have this example from German virologist Carsten Scheller. It shows us that it is insane of Rhode Island or anyone else to justify their measures with the number of infections (positive tests).

The correct justification would be: there are few people living here. Let's not import many, because our resources are tailored to us few plus one or two guests. But if our hospitals have capacity, we would gladly take the sick from other areas, where they can't be treated. But for the healthy people, please stay where you belong.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 05:51:14 PM by Ulrich Mayring »
Golf Course Exposé (300+ courses reviewed), Golf CV (how I keep track of 'em)

Peter Flory

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #348 on: March 28, 2020, 06:07:22 PM »
How does driving to your 2nd home and sheltering there risk spreading the infection?
Because even sheltering and doing the minimum you are going out to shop, or buying fuel.  Those things don't just not count.

I mean in that scenario, you obviously have a Tesla.  It's a 3 hr drive.  You can get home delivery.

And who's pumping gas this month without wearing gloves? 

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Any course restrictions due to Coronavirus?
« Reply #349 on: March 28, 2020, 06:22:07 PM »
Shelter within a half tank of gas isn’t a second home, it’s a pied de terre.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2020, 06:29:32 PM by John Kavanaugh »

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