Should you skip Birkdale and Hoylake?

[mike_malone]

A friend is heading to that area and is being told to skip them.


Actually he was told to skip Lytham not Birkdale but I’m interested in other ideas for him. He’s well travelled.

[Tom_Doak]

Well, the question is really, skip them in favor of where?


If price is a factor, I can see skipping both.  But the midlands is not teeming with other great courses to substitute.  If it's part of a bigger trip, there are lots of other parts of English golf worth exploring instead.

[jeffwarne]

depends upon what the alternatives are.
Pretty historical places

Adding Formby, Wallasey and Aberdovey(i know a ways)might tempt me to skip them but other than price I can't say there's a real reason to skip them.

[Tommy Williamsen]

It depends on why he is going to England. If it is just to play some very good courses, then play someth8ing else and save the pounds. I suspect that most first timers go to play the courses they have seen in the Open rota. If he skipped them, a month later he would rue that decision.

[Michael Wolf]

I think spending the night in Lytham's dormie house, the opening par 3, the great loop at the turn, and the finish hard by the clubhouse adds up to one of the great days in golf. If I was only picking one of the 3 rota's in that area, that would be my choice.


But unless it's finance related, all three plus Formby are to me pretty much must plays. If you've gone that far, go the final mile.


At a minimum play Lytham and have a drink in Liverpool's clubhouse


Michael

[Greg Gilson]

Cannot understand this trick question. The alternatives  or reasons to skip them must be off the charts good. Both these (+ Lytham) are really good courses. Not the best in the UK, or even England. But all 3 are worth investing a day of your life, surely. And then theres the history, the clubhouses.


I have not factored $$$$ into this... that would be the only reason I would think you might consider saying "YES".

[David_Tepper]

No.

[Jon Wiggett]

Other than if it is on price then no.

[Sean_A]

A friend is heading to that area and is being told to skip them.

Actually he was told to skip Lytham not Birkdale but I’m interested in other ideas for him. He’s well travelled.

Mayday

It depends on what your friend is looking for.  To a large degree Lytham and Birkdale are brawny proto-modern championship venues.  That said, being links there is most definitely a sense of self for each course, especially Lytham. To my eye Hoylake is the most interesting of the three, but the element of OOB for which Hoylake was justly famous has been denuded in the fairly recent past.  The three courses are very different from each other.  Bottom line, unless money and/or time are issues than I can't see why one would skip Hoylake, Lytham or Birkdale.  That said, in this area, I would start with Formby.  Again, wildly different from the nearby Big 3, but I think Formby has far more variety because of a great blend of old and new.

Ciao 

[Mark_Fine]

I would recommend telling your friend to get advice from someone else who has a clue    The beauty of golf in the U.K. is golfers have access to all the great golf courses.  Almost any course is worth playing once and these aren't just any courses.  The advice your friend is getting is like someone saying don't bother playing the two Winged Foot courses (even if you can) when you are booking your golf trip to the NY area     

[Bill Gayne]

I wouldn't miss either course and as others have said stay in the Dormie House at Lytham.

[Mark Chaplin]

Michael Wolf good luck with popping into Royal Liverpool for a beer.

[Michael Wolf]

Mark,


I’ve always had good success via advance Email to the Secretary of clubs that I’d like to visit but don’t have time or invitation to play.


If anything, my experience in both the UK and US is that many clubs are more welcoming to a genuine interest in their clubhouse, or library or maintenance facilities than the golf course. Not all of course, but certainly the majority.


Is Liverpool an exception? I don’t want to post bad advice on the board.


I’ll see you soon!
Michael

[jeffwarne]

Mark,


I’ve always had good success via advance Email to the Secretary of clubs that I’d like to visit but don’t have time or invitation to play.


If anything, my experience in both the UK and US is that many clubs are more welcoming to a genuine interest in their clubhouse, or library or maintenance facilities than the golf course. Not all of course, but certainly the majority.


Is Liverpool an exception? I don’t want to post bad advice on the board.


I’ll see you soon!
Michael

Wait till JK gets ahold of this.....

[Tim Martin]

Mark,


I’ve always had good success via advance Email to the Secretary of clubs that I’d like to visit but don’t have time or invitation to play.


If anything, my experience in both the UK and US is that many clubs are more welcoming to a genuine interest in their clubhouse, or library or maintenance facilities than the golf course. Not all of course, but certainly the majority.


Is Liverpool an exception? I don’t want to post bad advice on the board.


I’ll see you soon!
Michael

Wait till JK gets ahold of this.....

 

[David McIntosh]

Mayday,

In a word, no.

Both are very good courses and the only reason I could see for not playing them when visiting would be cost or if your friend had already played them and wanted to see something new this time.


I liked the course at Birkdale quite a bit more that Lytham but, as others have already said, the Lytham experience of staying in the dormy house, having dinner and breakfast in the club house, getting to use the snooker room etc is outstanding.

Whilst not an Open rota course, Formby is also a must see when in the area and has its own excellent dormy accommodation.

[Mark Pearce]

Mark,


I’ve always had good success via advance Email to the Secretary of clubs that I’d like to visit but don’t have time or invitation to play.


If anything, my experience in both the UK and US is that many clubs are more welcoming to a genuine interest in their clubhouse, or library or maintenance facilities than the golf course. Not all of course, but certainly the majority.


Is Liverpool an exception? I don’t want to post bad advice on the board.


I’ll see you soon!
Michael

No, not at all.  Royal Liverpool is very welcoming, if they know you're coming.  I think Mark was suggesting that it might be different if you turned up unannounced.

[Mark Chaplin]

Michael “have a drink in Liverpool’s clubhouse” is rather different to writing to the Secretary in advance and donning a jacket and tie for a prearranged visit.


I’d imagine Royal Liverpool would be welcoming to such an approach on a non event day.

[Mark_Rowlinson]

I don't think you should skip Hoylake, Birkdale or Lytham, unless you've played them so often (and are such a good player) that they hold little interest. They are great courses. So, too, are some of their neighbours. I just think it is a very bad idea to tell somebody not to play this course or that.


It reminds me of a politician I interviewed years ago when I was working as a musician. I asked him which pieces of music from a fairly eclectic list he would not recommend. He said that he couldn't answer that question because one man's tastes were so different from the next man's.

[Alan Joss]

Having played all 3 courses (Lytham on a number of occasions) I would say they are a must play if he hasn't played them before.
Birkdale is a great layout which really tests your golf game with holes played in all directions. Hoylake is excellent especially off the medal tees and the clubhouse is full of history. Lytham has probably the best fairway bunkering I have ever seen and a stay in the Dormy House takes you back to basics but is so enjoyable.
They may be expensive but they are worth it!


Nearby you also have Hillside and Southport & Ainsdale which are both well worth a game.

[Thomas Dai]

Doesn’t seem worth missing them if you’ve got the cash and the time. Add Formby/Formby Ladies too. If you’ve got the time but not the cash then there are a few others along the coast well worth playing in that area that’ll have less impact on the wallet but are still very good and challenging too, such as the likes of Wallasey, West Lancs.
Atb

[Greg Gilson]

I would be interested in hearing from the OP how this feedback was received?


Mike Malone....any comments? You got lots of ….surprisingly unanimous... input on your question.

[Gib_Papazian]

Whoever told you to skip Royal Liverpool has rocks in their cabeza. One of the primary reasons to travel is soak in the history at our golfing touchstones. Putting aside the interest and originality of Hoylake's golf course - the cops for instance - you're walking in the footsteps of Harold Hilton and John Ball.


It has been quite a while, but the Club Sec at the time was Group Captain Christopher Moore, who gave me the full tour of the archives - breathtaking is the only way I can describe the collection. He could not play, but was kind enough to set me up with a couple characters who ran The Asian Golf Review - and we had huge fun.


The food is excellent (for Scotland), the members are beyond lovely and the combination of historic golf and the Beatles was hard to beat.


One warning however - for those who have seen the movie "Hard Days Night" - that affected Liverpool mumble is an unintelligible patois, known only to the local punters. The upper crusties in Liverpool speak the King's English, but pull up a barstool in any working class joint along the waterfront and best of luck.


The barmaids, you know the type - hot as fuck, but with bad teeth, plenty of tats and a perma-cig dangling from their crusty lips - are tougher than a shoe-leather steak. Tip and chat all you want, but the only thing you're taking back to the B&B is a bladder full of Guinness and banger grease on your new golf shirt.           

[Jon Wiggett]

Gib,


if you are going to make slurs at least try to get your facts right. Liverpool was in England last time I looked and the last time anyone spoke the King's English was in 1952.

[Michael Graham]

The Beatles; the pride of Scotland since 1960.