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John Mayhugh

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Golf balls and the ocean
« on: January 18, 2019, 07:29:55 AM »
Ran across this article today and took a look at the website mentioned.
https://www.npr.org/2019/01/17/686257550/teenage-diver-finds-tons-of-golf-balls-rotting-off-california?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark

https://www.theplasticpick-up.org/golf-ball-break-down


I've never given any real thought to what happens to the golf balls that people like me lose on coastal courses.  As environmental consciousness grows, might we expect recovery efforts to be mandated for seaside courses?
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Jim_Coleman

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2019, 08:51:53 AM »
   At the Teeth of the Dog (presently on display on ESPN), swimmers fish the balls out of the sea, package them up in bags of 20, and sell them back to the players.  Problem solved.
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Jeff_Brauer

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2019, 09:51:31 AM »
Cue the Seinfeld episode.....
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Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2019, 10:01:32 AM »
Why not require golfers to put down a deposit like at a pool hall and get their money back when they prove they didn't lose a ball at the end of the round? Lost ball deposits that are forfeited could be used for retrieval and reclamation.


Playing the ocean holes with designated balls is a small price to pay and it beats putting up huge nets so we can't see the fish and the fish can't see us.


One of my first jobs was working for the government brainstorming ideas like this. It was great work.
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Steve Lang

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2019, 10:13:34 AM »
 8) Hey Titleist...  Ever heard of product stewardship?  You may want to notice that you're currently the poster child at https://www.theplasticpick-up.org  A small corporate investment in the golf ball project to fund some ball recovery would go a long way!



There seems to be some confusion at https://www.theplasticpick-up.org/the-golf-ball-project between calling the ball surface polyurethane and paint...


One hundred years in at Pebble, how many balls are out there alone?  This could be a great Golf Ball Archeology study.


I seriously doubt there's truly toxic amounts of zinc being released versus the natural zinc concentrations in sea water, but the word TOXIC sells...


I see the old wound core balls decomposed, seems the macro plastics would be of more interest than the micro, or nano elemental issues. 


The "smell" of 50,000 golf balls, I wonder if they washed the sea water off???  Plenty of microbiology basis for the odor...
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Inverness (Toledo, OH) cathedral clock inscription: "God measures men by what they are. Not what they in wealth possess.  That vibrant message chimes afar.
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Jim Franklin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2019, 10:43:46 AM »
Quote from: John Kavanaugh on January 18, 2019, 10:01:32 AM
Why not require golfers to put down a deposit like at a pool hall and get their money back when they prove they didn't lose a ball at the end of the round? Lost ball deposits that are forfeited could be used for retrieval and reclamation.


Playing the ocean holes with designated balls is a small price to pay and it beats putting up huge nets so we can't see the fish and the fish can't see us.


One of my first jobs was working for the government brainstorming ideas like this. It was great work.

Makes  a lot of sense for me to put a deposit down on something I purchased. Sounds like government work.
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Mr Hurricane

Tom Hooker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2019, 12:56:41 PM »
Ultimately, the golf industry (like all of us) has to come to terms with its role in the destruction of the environment - and this is just one of its many forms. And it doesn't have to be this way.


Shouldn't Pebble and similar courses, as much as the ball manufacturers, take responsibility for cleanup? From a financial perspective, what's Pebble without the ocean? And what's Pebble without the PGA Tour and the USGA, both of whom could certainly do much more to promote sustainable practices?


At this point, "Save the Game" seems like it will have more long-term resonance than "Grow the Game"
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Joe Leenheer

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2019, 02:36:22 PM »
"She says it is too bad the golf balls sink. If they floated, people would be shocked and outraged. "If a person could see what we see underwater," she says, "it would not be acceptable." "
[/size][/color]
[/size]She obviously is not watching the golfers reaction to sending a $5 golf ball into the ocean....shock and outrage is an understatement.  Sadly, thousands of lesson slots go unused that could help reduce this problem. [/color]
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Never let the quality of your game determine the quality of your time spent playing it.

Joshua Pettit

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2019, 03:33:19 PM »
Is anyone here a marine biologist?!
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"The greatest and fairest of things are done by nature, and the lesser by art."

Michael Graham

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2019, 04:28:44 PM »
Quote from: Joshua Pettit on January 18, 2019, 03:33:19 PM
Is anyone here a marine biologist?!


“So I started to walk into the water. I won't lie to you boys, I was terrified! But I pressed on and as I made my way passed the breakers a strange calm came over me. I don't know if it was divine intervention or the kinship of all living things but I tell you Jerry at that moment I was a marine biologist!”
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Joshua Pettit

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2019, 04:46:56 PM »
Quote from: Michael Graham on January 18, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Quote from: Joshua Pettit on January 18, 2019, 03:33:19 PM
Is anyone here a marine biologist?!

“So I started to walk into the water. I won't lie to you boys, I was terrified! But I pressed on and as I made my way passed the breakers a strange calm came over me. I don't know if it was divine intervention or the kinship of all living things but I tell you Jerry at that moment I was a marine biologist!”

The sea was angry that day my friends, like an old man trying to send back soup at a deli...
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"The greatest and fairest of things are done by nature, and the lesser by art."

Daryl "Turboe" Boe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2019, 05:16:53 PM »
To heck with Harbor Seals, the seaside courses could just hire Navy Seals to be snipers and shoot any golfers who dare to hit an errant shot into the ocean.  I think once word gets out there would be a lot less of it.





"Correct me if I'm wrong Sandy, but if I kill all the golfers they'll lock me up and throw away the key." - Carl
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"Time spent playing golf is not deducted from ones lifespan."

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ChipRoyce

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2019, 05:44:33 PM »
Quote from: Tom Hooker on January 18, 2019, 12:56:41 PM
Ultimately, the golf industry (like all of us) has to come to terms with its role in the destruction of the environment - and this is just one of its many forms. And it doesn't have to be this way.
Oh my... I am doing everything to bite my tounge.
I can't believe that I would be the most anti-PC person on this board, but perhaps as I age, my filters and perspective are skewed.
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RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2019, 06:15:31 PM »
It seems like every other thing we have in our modern world that are made of plastics of one type or another.  I would be great if we could just recycle the balls that aren't in waterways or ocean.  Can you imagine in the last 100 years how many worn out useless balls from driving ranges, and golfers losing them or discarding them have been landfilled or whatever?  It seems like this whole micro particle flaking off stuff getting into the food chain is relatively new concerns in last few decades.  I am guessing it might be centuries for a golf ball to decompose, and decompose into what other toxic substance in soil.  And, burning must place more undesirable material in the air.  no answers...
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No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Tom Hooker

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2019, 07:09:04 PM »
Quote from: ChipRoyce on January 18, 2019, 05:44:33 PM
Quote from: Tom Hooker on January 18, 2019, 12:56:41 PM
Ultimately, the golf industry (like all of us) has to come to terms with its role in the destruction of the environment - and this is just one of its many forms. And it doesn't have to be this way.
Oh my... I am doing everything to bite my tounge.
I can't believe that I would be the most anti-PC person on this board, but perhaps as I age, my filters and perspective are skewed.

My [/size][size=78%]language might offend you, but what’s wrong with calling out owners and architects and companies who aren’t doing what they can to make golf more sustainable? Shouldn’t that also be part of what we consider “great”? [/size]
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James Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2019, 08:50:14 PM »
This is a reasonableness standard issue. 


The plastics in the ocean issue is certainly overblown in the press, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t at least consider the most feasible ways to address a topic like this. 


I would imagine Cypress Point #16 has put more balls in the ocean than any other hole on earth.  What would be the environmental answer there?


Uh huh?
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Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2019, 09:09:13 PM »
Quote from: James Brown on January 18, 2019, 08:50:14 PM
This is a reasonableness standard issue. 


The plastics in the ocean issue is certainly overblown in the press, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t at least consider the most feasible ways to address a topic like this. 


I would imagine Cypress Point #16 has put more balls in the ocean than any other hole on earth.  What would be the environmental answer there?


Uh huh?

You are right about CP16. I drove left into the cove. I could not find my ball because there were literally hundreds of them on the beach.
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David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2019, 09:51:02 PM »
"What would be the environmental answer there?"

James B. -

The answer is pretty simple. Hire a diver or two a couple of times a year to go out into the water and retrieve as many golf balls as they can find. They will find a lot of them. ;)

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/01/girl-removes-amazing-sum-of-golf-balls-off-pebble-beach-in-study

DT
   
« Last Edit: January 18, 2019, 09:57:48 PM by David_Tepper »
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jeffwarne

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2019, 10:54:19 PM »
Rumor has it Mueller is disputing this "news"
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"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
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Jon Wiggett

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2019, 04:11:32 AM »

Golf balls in the ocean is a pretty small scale problem in the grand scheme of things but certainly the golf industry should be doing a lot more to reduce the environmental impact. Biggest culprit are the professional tours with their pushing of totally unnecessary short cut greens.


As for wet balls as DT suggests maybe a clean up a couple of times a year.


Jeff,


but which parts of 'golf ball gate' is he disputing  ;D
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James Brown

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2019, 09:05:30 AM »
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Steve Lang

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2019, 10:11:20 AM »
James,


Not so quick... Alex Weber, the teen, is the subject of  the first post's link... 


ahh the dangers of just posting without checking the whole thread ::)
« Last Edit: January 19, 2019, 10:17:29 AM by Steve Lang »
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Inverness (Toledo, OH) cathedral clock inscription: "God measures men by what they are. Not what they in wealth possess.  That vibrant message chimes afar.
The voice of Inverness"

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2019, 10:40:42 AM »
I wholeheartedly agree with Jon W on this one.  In the grand scheme of things there are much much bigger fish to fry.  If we're serious about keeping our oceans clean we need to first address our obsession with plastic goods and the massive negative effect its having on aquatic life globally.
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Mike Sweeney

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Re: Golf balls and the ocean
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2019, 04:03:50 PM »
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"One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us."

Dr. Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
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